6 - Carles Alena

God Serena

New member
What makes zero sense is to promote him when every talent we had who was promoted at that age or developing phase have failed except Messi, who himself suffered health consequences of not being physically ready and spend his 1st 3 years with many injuries,
And please, Alena is good and potential world class, but have you seen Thiago or Busquets at same age? Iniesta? they were better than him and still remained in B team, only one of them had B team in 2nd division btw and the other two had it in 3rd and 4th division.
I really don't get why people want to take such huge risk of his development to fulfill their La Masia fantasies.
Throwing him in 1st team at this stage of his career could be career destroyer, sending him 1 more year in b team holds way less risk.
All what you say right now was said on Munir who showed even more promise, and tbh only very few thinks he belong to big clubs anymore.

Just because our golden generation players stayed with the B team at this age doesn't mean it's the only way we can handle youth development. Guys like Busquets, Iniesta, Thiago etc. had players ahead of them more than capable of fulfilling their role. Who with the first team is a better distributor and tempo controller than Alena? Gomes? Denis? Arda? You're so willing to chalk it off as another "La Masia fantasy" that you're blind to just how talented the kid actually is. At his current skill level he could easily slot into the first team and during every appearance he's made both under Lucho and Valverde he has shown that.

I don't know how Munir has anything to do with Alena but just because Munir didn't meet expectations, doesn't mean Alena will fail as well if given a similar opportunity. If we had a Dembele or an Mbappe coming through our academy you'd probably argue for them to be stuck with the B team, too, with your line of reasoning.
 

khaled_a_d

Senior Member
Just because our golden generation players stayed with the B team at this age doesn't mean it's the only way we can handle youth development. Guys like Busquets, Iniesta, Thiago etc. had players ahead of them more than capable of fulfilling their role. Who with the first team is a better distributor and tempo controller than Alena? Gomes? Denis? Arda? You're so willing to chalk it off as another "La Masia fantasy" that you're blind to just how talented the kid actually is. At his current skill level he could easily slot into the first team and during every appearance he's made both under Lucho and Valverde he has shown that.

I don't know how Munir has anything to do with Alena but just because Munir didn't meet expectations, doesn't mean Alena will fail as well if given a similar opportunity. If we had a Dembele or an Mbappe coming through our academy you'd probably argue for them to be stuck with the B team, too, with your line of reasoning.

If any of the players you mentioned had the same performance Alena had, his thread would be full of how disappointing he is, I mean seriously,Alena tempo controller? He didn't control any tempo in those games. He keep the ball well and make the obvious pass and Gomes himself has done that many times and he was called names in this forum, difference is one is La Masia talent and the other is 45M transfer and people won't held them both to same standards.

And who exactly was ahead of Iniesta in 2003? Was Edmilson a better player than those in 2007? come on now.
And I won't risk Alena development for his own sake,even if he is better than shitty players we have.
There isn't a single way of succeeding for sure,but if there is a repeated pattern then we should be aware off.
Luckily Valverde won't promote him anyway and he will stay with B team.
 

God Serena

New member
If any of the players you mentioned had the same performance Alena had, his thread would be full of how disappointing he is, I mean seriously,Alena tempo controller? He didn't control any tempo in those games. He keep the ball well and make the obvious pass and Gomes himself has done that many times and he was called names in this forum, difference is one is La Masia talent and the other is 45M transfer and people won't held them both to same standards.

khaled. If you truly think Alena had a Gomes-like performance you might as well argue he should never be promoted. Calling him a tempo controller was wrong of me, but it was late when I said it and I was trying to make the point that he always picks out the correct pass and contributes to midfield dominance. Gomes does not do that, not even close. Gomes loses the ball in tight spaces nearly every time he gets the ball, which Alena did not. Gomes only feels secure passing backwards and rarely moves into space demanding the ball, which Alena does not. And Gomes' top running speed is in the Busquets/Samper tier, which Alena is not. No disrespect old friend, but comparing Alena to Gomes just to downplay his abilities is nonsense.

And who exactly was ahead of Iniesta in 2003? Was Edmilson a better player than those in 2007? come on now.
And I won't risk Alena development for his own sake,even if he is better than shitty players we have.
There isn't a single way of succeeding for sure,but if there is a repeated pattern then we should be aware off.
Luckily Valverde won't promote him anyway and he will stay with B team.

I admittedly wasn't a fan back in 2003 but I do know Edmilson faced decline as he got older. Weird you don't address Thiago and Busquets in your argument.
If Alena is really only able to do what Gomes does why do you care about his development at all?
I could argue that past players not doing well is down to them being flops more than anything. If it was really so impossible for great, young, talented players to succeed if promoted too early we'd never see players like Donnarumma, Mbappe, or Dembele develop.
Maybe he will, maybe he won't. It's clear he's going to get a lot of minutes with the first team either way.
 

tacticvarium

New member
He keep the ball well and make the obvious pass and Gomes himself has done that many times and he was called names in this forum, difference is one is La Masia talent and the other is 45M transfer and people won't held them both to same standards.

Better be careful of making nonsensical argument to justify your opinion.
I understand your point of not rushing the promotion but this was just beyond common sense.
Gomes has surely more experiences in La Liga and he might deserve another chance to prove himself (though I believe it's completely waste of time)
but that doesn't make him a better player than current Aleñá.
 

khaled_a_d

Senior Member
khaled. If you truly think Alena had a Gomes-like performance you might as well argue he should never be promoted. Calling him a tempo controller was wrong of me, but it was late when I said it and I was trying to make the point that he always picks out the correct pass and contributes to midfield dominance. Gomes does not do that, not even close. Gomes loses the ball in tight spaces nearly every time he gets the ball, which Alena did not. Gomes only feels secure passing backwards and rarely moves into space demanding the ball, which Alena does not. And Gomes' top running speed is in the Busquets/Samper tier, which Alena is not. No disrespect old friend, but comparing Alena to Gomes just to downplay his abilities is nonsense.

Gomes has plenty of shit performance, and I didn't argue against that. But Gomes himself had performances like Alena and you won't find many (although there is always few) who will get excited about him.
Ok, Alena is young and promising but that doesn't make him good player immediately for first team. Point is there is two standard of how good a player is,one for La Masia and the other for new purchases.
That is argument is valid when we have someone who is 100% ready and has nothing to do in B team and that isn't Alena, even last season he has problem with being consistent, and again plenty of young players suffered from that.


I admittedly wasn't a fan back in 2003 but I do know Edmilson faced decline as he got older. Weird you don't address Thiago and Busquets in your argument.
If Alena is really only able to do what Gomes does why do you care about his development at all?
I could argue that past players not doing well is down to them being flops more than anything. If it was really so impossible for great, young, talented players to succeed if promoted too early we'd never see players like Donnarumma, Mbappe, or Dembele develop.
Maybe he will, maybe he won't. It's clear he's going to get a lot of minutes with the first team either way.

Who did you think I was talking about when I brought Edmilson name?
Man, the names you are bringing has developed in totally different clubs, a much smaller clubs (Milan is currently not our level by any mean) and easier leagues.
It is one thing to put a player into one of the top teams in the world with insane pressure in comparison to those clubs; and considering that people doesn't fantasy the idea of loan. I don't see the comparison at all.

Being a midfielder in Barca is probably second toughest position to succeed after CB position. Not worth the risk by any mean


Better be careful of making nonsensical argument to justify your opinion.
I understand your point of not rushing the promotion but this was just beyond common sense.
Gomes has surely more experiences in La Liga and he might deserve another chance to prove himself (though I believe it's completely waste of time)
but that doesn't make him a better player than current Aleñá.

I didn't say who is better, and while I believe that Gomes is better player currently (and probably far worse fit) I avoided such discussion. Point is Alena isn't a difference maker at the point, he is at the stage of his career that people will get excited about any thing good he does, promote him now and by the end of the year you could be reading about how he doesn't add to our midfield or that he is another over hyped La Masia even if he had slightly better performance.
 

messi1995

New member
To Khaled:

Aleña is way braver and better than Gomes and he's 19 years old with only third division experience. Did you see the pass he gave to Alba against Juve or how he combined well with players like Busi and Messi? I know it was just a friendly, but have you seen Gomes give a performance like that? Last year we played friendly against Sampdoria and he was shit while Aleña played well against Juve, Man Utd and Real. Not only Sampdoria, but also shit in copa catalunya against Espanyol B + Copa del rey against Hercules, a third division team.

Aleña fits better in our team because he's way better + understand our philosophy which will help him make it with experience and trust from Valverde. Gomes is 24 and Aleña is still 19 and impress way better. And by the way I don't think a tall pace merchant like Gomes would fit in Barca. Best thing we can do is to sell Gomes and Arda and let Aleña compete with Rakitic and Roberto. We should let him stay for an another season in B team because I think two years there would be good enough for his development. Xavi, Iniesta, Busi and Pedro also stayed in two years. Valverde will notice that Aleña only needs to compete with Raktic and Roberto because our other CM's are shit.
(no hate).

He deserves call up in many easy la liga games, home and away + when we need an extra midfielder. Should also give him a chance against teams like Real, Atletico, Villereal and Sevilla only to test his ability against strong teams. I can promise you this: when he turns approximately 22-23 years old he will be a starter for our team ☺
 

clemente

New member
Alena has a much better passing than Gomes, I even saw some outside the foot passes which I have never seen from Gomes, unless that 1 time where he aired it to the stands. Also he just has much better agility and can play those 1-2 passes and quickly run into spaces, which is our style. Every single trait about Gomes tells me he doesn't fit our style, unless he had skilled feet like Ronaldinho.
 

messi1995

New member
Just a friendly anyway. He did well against Juve, united and Real so I thought he would play like he did against them.
 

Trickykid

Active member
Difference is today he was playing with our B lineup which in all honesty is kind of pathetic lol

Not that I disagree that it's easier to play well with great players surrounding you, but you could also easily argue that he - his talent in mind - should be able to stand out amongst our pathetic second string players against a reasonably weak side.

I didn't catch the match, though, so I'm not commenting on his performance.
 

messi1995

New member
Hard to play with braindead players. You can have a great game, but very difficult to play with shit players. Just watch Messi with Argentina.. He carry his team, but hard to perform because you will have few passing options + needs to solve everything by yourself. And I don't expect Aleña to do that when even the best player Leo Messi struggle to do it. Don't agree with people saying that Maradona and pele carried their national team. They had many world class players around to help them. Impossible for one man do it alone. If it was possible, then I would say the 11 players for the opponents team should retire. 11 vs 1 and you can't stop him loool! So yes I just want Aleña to work hard and improve with great players around.
 

God Serena

New member
Not that I disagree that it's easier to play well with great players surrounding you, but you could also easily argue that he - his talent in mind - should be able to stand out amongst our pathetic second string players against a reasonably weak side.

I didn't catch the match, though, so I'm not commenting on his performance.

The problem wasn't just that he was with our second string players, it was that he was playing with second string players who appeared to not even be giving any real effort. The only players I can say gave any real effort are Samper (Who is desperate not to be sent on loan) and, like, Mascherano. Maybe, Mascherano. The game was a snoozer. Even Valverde didn't seem to be doing much on the sideline. Deulofeu came on and he didn't even try to dribble everyone, either.

We're better off just pretending that game didn't happen tbh...
 

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