Does messi have any fault?

Mihai Stefan

New member
I said in the last few days, to look at Barcelona's eliminations from the UCL, from Messi's last years (especially 2016-21). Although I admit that I am a big fan of his, he is the best of all time, and that he made my childhood more beautiful, I was waiting for the evening with my soul in my mouth to watch a match of his, I have to admit that sometimes I noticed some things about him, WHICH I PERSONALLY BELIEVE, made Barcelona a weaker team in the UCL. From what I saw in those matches from 2016-21, eliminations from ucl, Messi's position on the field was WAY TOO free, he could actually go anywhere on the field, he doesn't respect any limits of what he has to do. Too many times, I saw him in the middle of the field leaving his position free, or taking the ball from his defenders, something that caught my eye way too much.
And being a child, I sat and wondered how it was possible that in 2014-15, you could win absolutely everything, and I mean in particular, THE DOMINANCE that Barcelona had in the UCL, to beat all the champions of the big championships, to you always humiliate with a difference of 2-3 goals in general, and from the 2015-16 season to effectively be a punching bag for any team in Europe, effectively with the same team and coach, no major change in the team, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying to win YEARS in a row, but from being a UCL winner, not being able to be in the semi-finals for at least 5 years, it seems to me a huge stupidity.
Another mistake that caught my eye, is that Messi and Suarez did not press ABSOLUTELY AT ALL, any defender/midfielder from the opposing team who passed by them was left free to pass, not even a little attention to attack him , I'm not even saying to defend against their attacks. This period of Messi from 2016-21, seems to me simply a shadow of what I was used to in my childhood 2010-13 when I was watching with my brother and father.
My problem with Messi is that for a long time Barcelona could not have a fixed form to attack and defend, many times Rakitic had to come to the right wing to create width, Barcelona was forced to play with 2 midfielders defensive because Messi, standing in the center, did not defend at all and did not press. I know that in the 2010-13 period, he still had attempts to go down to the middle of the field, but in the end, he returned to his initial position, did not remain behind the attack, and pressed much more, as many times as he pressed and he stayed in his position, the better the team performed. I remember how frustrated I was because at that time Ronaldo scored goals out of nowhere, not being better than Messi, neither in dribbling, nor in finishing, nor as a creator (as an assists provider for his attackers), he could score from anything , and Messi was standing in the middle of the field with 4-5 players in front of him permanently, who were about to attack him. When Messi is a full time attacker, as we saw in the 10/11, 11/12, 12/13 seasons, he is by far the best attacker in history and nothing can take his place, but he always has this strange mentality to he goes to the middle of the field and creates opportunities, which have no value because Suarez and Neymar are attacked by 4 defenders, and they cannot manage, this is a reason why Messi had to be permanently in attack, to create width that is very much needed. In order to create game options and to create width in the attack, the full-backs WERE MUCH TOO HIGH ON THE FIELD, you could be caught very easily on the counter-attack and the pivots were forced to go a little to the sides so as not to be caught on the counter-attack, purely and it was simply something extremely wrong for Messi to be a full time midfielder but without defending, the team cannot create a good SHAPE to attack and defend.
What I still can't understand is that many people defended him just because of the simple fact that he is Messi and that's it, everything was said based on feelings and nothing objective, strictly based on what is seen on the field. A lot of people said "but he doesn't have a good RB to combine with", but he played in this style in 2015-16, when Dani Alves was still the team's starter. Another thing I heard "The midfield can't create chances at all and that's why he has to go down", but with the same midfield you won the UCL, and now they can't create anything at all? I didn't see the logic at all. I want to know what you think and if I see something wrong, please explain it to me, thank you for reading, VISCA BARCA.
 

Maradona37

Well-known member
Good effort and some fair enough points made in the post my friend, but more people are likely to read it if you break it into paragraphs (put a space between the paragraphs you have there) rather than a wall of text. Just some friendly advice.
 

companyofcules

Well-known member
I said in the last few days, to look at Barcelona's eliminations from the UCL, from Messi's last years (especially 2016-21). Although I admit that I am a big fan of his, he is the best of all time, and that he made my childhood more beautiful, I was waiting for the evening with my soul in my mouth to watch a match of his, I have to admit that sometimes I noticed some things about him, WHICH I PERSONALLY BELIEVE, made Barcelona a weaker team in the UCL. From what I saw in those matches from 2016-21, eliminations from ucl, Messi's position on the field was WAY TOO free, he could actually go anywhere on the field, he doesn't respect any limits of what he has to do. Too many times, I saw him in the middle of the field leaving his position free, or taking the ball from his defenders, something that caught my eye way too much.
And being a child, I sat and wondered how it was possible that in 2014-15, you could win absolutely everything, and I mean in particular, THE DOMINANCE that Barcelona had in the UCL, to beat all the champions of the big championships, to you always humiliate with a difference of 2-3 goals in general, and from the 2015-16 season to effectively be a punching bag for any team in Europe, effectively with the same team and coach, no major change in the team, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying to win YEARS in a row, but from being a UCL winner, not being able to be in the semi-finals for at least 5 years, it seems to me a huge stupidity.
Another mistake that caught my eye, is that Messi and Suarez did not press ABSOLUTELY AT ALL, any defender/midfielder from the opposing team who passed by them was left free to pass, not even a little attention to attack him , I'm not even saying to defend against their attacks. This period of Messi from 2016-21, seems to me simply a shadow of what I was used to in my childhood 2010-13 when I was watching with my brother and father.
My problem with Messi is that for a long time Barcelona could not have a fixed form to attack and defend, many times Rakitic had to come to the right wing to create width, Barcelona was forced to play with 2 midfielders defensive because Messi, standing in the center, did not defend at all and did not press. I know that in the 2010-13 period, he still had attempts to go down to the middle of the field, but in the end, he returned to his initial position, did not remain behind the attack, and pressed much more, as many times as he pressed and he stayed in his position, the better the team performed. I remember how frustrated I was because at that time Ronaldo scored goals out of nowhere, not being better than Messi, neither in dribbling, nor in finishing, nor as a creator (as an assists provider for his attackers), he could score from anything , and Messi was standing in the middle of the field with 4-5 players in front of him permanently, who were about to attack him. When Messi is a full time attacker, as we saw in the 10/11, 11/12, 12/13 seasons, he is by far the best attacker in history and nothing can take his place, but he always has this strange mentality to he goes to the middle of the field and creates opportunities, which have no value because Suarez and Neymar are attacked by 4 defenders, and they cannot manage, this is a reason why Messi had to be permanently in attack, to create width that is very much needed. In order to create game options and to create width in the attack, the full-backs WERE MUCH TOO HIGH ON THE FIELD, you could be caught very easily on the counter-attack and the pivots were forced to go a little to the sides so as not to be caught on the counter-attack, purely and it was simply something extremely wrong for Messi to be a full time midfielder but without defending, the team cannot create a good SHAPE to attack and defend.
What I still can't understand is that many people defended him just because of the simple fact that he is Messi and that's it, everything was said based on feelings and nothing objective, strictly based on what is seen on the field. A lot of people said "but he doesn't have a good RB to combine with", but he played in this style in 2015-16, when Dani Alves was still the team's starter. Another thing I heard "The midfield can't create chances at all and that's why he has to go down", but with the same midfield you won the UCL, and now they can't create anything at all? I didn't see the logic at all. I want to know what you think and if I see something wrong, please explain it to me, thank you for reading, VISCA BARCA.
Well, yeah an no.
First Barcelona "dominated" in the last treble if you take it appart but won because Ter Stegen, Messi, Neymar, Suarez were too good and somehow the midfield and defense limped their body over the line.
Real was really good and playing amazing football, especially Benz.
So you are starting from a false idea. We dominated mostly the second tier.
2.
Once Neymar gets into clubing and Suarez fatter that wasn't the case anymore, we were second tier too. vs Atletico
From 2016 the trio got stuck against the top second tier or the top tier. Alba and Alves started to be liabilities.
3
Then the next year the midfield was totally killed by LE, and Neymar was the ultimate clown like Vinicius on steroids.
Suarez sensing Barcelona is on a path to downstairs he aquired Messi as a scutum and was playing for fun.
And this was the year the humiliations started to pour down because now you had 3 players who had little discipline and plenty of dead weight acumulated from 2013 to 2017.
4
Of course Barcelona needed to apoint a real manager to fix the midfild and defense and to sell Neymar because there was a young fella who was clutch in Monaco and Suarez was still needed more than Neymar.

But anyway, we didn't, because somehow getting a fortune on Neymar was made into a drama and instead of a great manager we apointed a mediocre losser.
As for the issue of Messi and Ronaldo scoring, Real is usually playing 13(ref)(media) vs 10 (usualy 1 mauled by Ramos, Casemiro etc).
Real played simple Italian football with some Spanish tint. That means defending, having a deep possession and crossing and shooting from every angles. That tends to give you lots of goals for poachers.

Since Neymar was just provoking and dancing like a clown, Rakitic was unable to hold the ball for more than 3 seconds and we were a possession team(Alba, Pique, Busquets, Stupidi are shit under any pressure), Messi had to run the game.

Running the game and getting the ball in trench football to lazy no headers Suarez and to flimsy clownish Neymar is as effective as Darwin Nunez.

If Ronaldo failed there was always Benz who had more talent and could actually head balls, Bale, a tanking winger who could head too and briliant midfielders like Isco, James, Modric.
if that fails you had absolute mad dogs like Pepe, Ramos and Casemiro.
Compare that to our clowns if Messi fails there is nobody to score and defend from 2016 till 2021.

Yeah, Messi was not defending shit from 2013 but he always run the game. Him playing on 3 to 4 positions was actually an advantage nobody had.
His only blame is putting his "friends" over his club and carrer. But being a introvert I get him.
(A minor disappointment was him staying between lines when he needed to drop more deep like with PSG or with Liverpool away) But again, not his fault since the attack not scoring will usually be blamed on him, not creating chances on him, so he needed to do both snd got stuck in the middle of nothing. )
 
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