Thiago Translantara

[MessiCam]

[MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION]

Instead of buying him since all other available options suck, why not wait till next summer and then buy some real-deal player?

There hare few players of his profile around. Arthur is but one of the few.

Also, maybe Cou-Rakitic partnership will work.
Maybe Arthur will turn to be a good player.
Maybe Alena will improve.
Maybe the other Alcantara, Rafinha, will stay fit and improve in terms of impact and similar.

So now you're throwing around all these maybes when it suits your agenda. Previously you stated that Arthur and Alena will take at least 4-5 years to settle in...

Also, for guys who want Thiago, where do you see him play?
1. at Iniesta's position, in Thiago-Rakitic duo
2. or as a Xavi, in Coutinho-Thiago duo
3. or in some crazy, defensive duo Arthur-Thiago?

Does it matter? He is a versatile midfielder that can play in both advanced and withdrawn positions... And having him and Arthur in the same squad gives you depth of the same profile on the bench.

Regarding Rakitic... It doesn't matter how many games he's played but rather how he performs in those games.

Rakitic - 214 appearances for Barcelona (15,200 minutes) - 27 Assists (As mainly a starter as you keep reminding us)
Thiago - 100 appearances for Barcelona (6000) - 20 Assists (As a substitute)

The disparity in production is numbing and Thiago is just a better footballer all round.

If he is a new Iniesta, Rumenigge and Matthaus said that he can leave because he is not good in attacking part of his play.

They play him in deep positions and in deep roles. Further, I haven't read anything of the sort other than Matthaus saying he hasn't performed in big matches for Bayern which I think is a straight-faced lie.

So, he can't be a new Iniesta for Barca.

Nobody can be a new Iniesta. Time to get rid of those thoughts...

On the other hand, if he will play on Xavi's position, what about Rakitic then?
A guy with the highest amount of matches played for Barca in the last 4 years?
There must be some reason why Rakitic is so loved by coaches (Lucho, EV, NT coaches), except those obvious, classical reasons: does he have EV's nudes or what?

So, would you bench Raki, whom all coaches love, for Thiago, a guy whom all clubs/coaches are willing to let go in his prime years (Barca at 22, Bayern at 27).

He can do whatever he wants as long as he faces competition for his position which I have no doubt he will lose with ball midfielders coming in. He can be a backup for Busquets because as you say he plays most of the matches which means he is hardly injured and will be ready to when called upon. Or he can just leave.

 

[Judoman]

Does it matter? He is a versatile midfielder that can play in both advanced and withdrawn positions... And having him and Arthur in the same squad gives you depth of the same profile on the bench.

Regarding Rakitic... It doesn't matter how many games he's played but rather how he performs in those games.

Rakitic - 214 appearances for Barcelona (15,200 minutes) - 27 Assists (As mainly a starter as you keep reminding us)
Thiago - 100 appearances for Barcelona (6000) - 20 Assists (As a substitute)

The disparity in production is numbing and Thiago is just a better footballer all round.

Perhaps Thiago is a better footballer than Rakitic, but they are not of same profile. So comparing their production doesn t say a lot.

Modric who is better than both of them produced 27 assists in the last 5 seasons (243 games) in Madrid. Statistics doesn t tell us everything.

 

[MessiCam]

Perhaps Thiago is a better footballer than Rakitic, but they are not of same profile. So comparing their production doesn t say a lot.

Modric who is better than both of them produced 27 assists in the last 5 seasons (243 games) in Madrid. Statistics doesn t tell us everything.

Rakitic, for 3 seasons, played as a RCM (still does on occasion) for Barcelona. The very same position that a wet behind the ears Thiago predominantly occupied.

And while you're right about the profile, Thiago outperforms Rakitic in his bread and butter double pivot position too...

Modric, in his time at Madrid, has produced 40 assists not 27 and this is in a cross heavy system where balls are moved rapidly to the flanks.
And while we're on the subject of profiles, who would you say is the better fit for Barcelona?

I have no idea why Rakitic is looked on so favourably by some of our fan base. He is quite limited and tactically conditions the team to be at a decent level which is not bad when looked at in isolation but it becomes a hindrance when you've got 3 other players doing exactly the same in Messi, Suarez and Busquets.

 

[Judoman]

Rakitic, for 3 seasons, played as a RCM (still does on occasion) for Barcelona. The very same position that a wet behind the ears Thiago predominantly occupied.

And while you're right about the profile, Thiago outperforms Rakitic in his bread and butter double pivot position too...

Modric, in his time at Madrid, has produced 40 assists not 27 and this is in a cross heavy system where balls are moved rapidly to the flanks.
And while we're on the subject of profiles, who would you say is the better fit for Barcelona?

I have no idea why Rakitic is looked on so favourably by some of our fan base. He is quite limited and tactically conditions the team to be at a decent level which is not bad when looked at in isolation but it becomes a hindrance when you've got 3 other players doing exactly the same in Messi, Suarez and Busquets.

https://www.fctables.com/players/luka_modric-273713/

Modric since 2012/13 season: 269 games/32 assists = 0,11 assists per game

https://www.fctables.com/players/ivan_rakitic-251307/
Rakitic since 2014/15 season: 217 games/24 assists = 0,11 assists per game


To me, Rakitic has a lot of credit due to his price (he was cheap) and his role in the last CL/treble win. He is a solid player, who had a solid season, but he is not a superstar MF. But than again, there are only few of those around.
He actually contributed to this club, unlike some other more expensive players (Gomes, Arda,..). Why is he looked on favorably shouldn t be a mistery right?

That being said, i would sell Raki if we buy Thiago. Not because i m sure Thiago will be better, but because he turned 30 and this would be last chance to sell him for decent price and actually get some profit for a change.
Also, we have Paulinho with Alena and Arthur coming in.

 

[Joan]

I would never sell Rakitić if we get Thiago.

Not because I rate Raki that high, but because when the later get injured and it will happen, we'll end up playing likes of Gomes and Paulinho.

Raki is a solid player, great backup and hasn't yet declined.

 

[Judoman]

I would never sell Rakitić if we get Thiago.

Not because I rate Raki that high, but because when the later get injured and it will happen, we'll end up playing likes of Gomes and Paulinho.

Raki is a solid player, great backup and hasn't yet declined.

You are right, i agree, but i don t think Rakitic would take the bench role. Remember his discontent, when Gomes (who will not be here next season) was pushed by Lucho for some period of time?

 

[FCB1987]

not starting again for Spain

 

[BarcaMessi]

70m and injury prone. Decisions.

 

[NorthernCule]

Guys like Lucas Vasquez and Koke are preferred over him for Spain.

Nowhere near good enough for a club like Barca. People just like to get carried away with the all the sentimental La Masia crap.

 

[JamDav1982]

Guys like Lucas Vasquez and Koke are preferred over him for Spain.

Nowhere near good enough for a club like Barca. People just like to get carried away with the all the sentimental La Masia crap.

Not direct comparisons though.

Koke better defensively and Vasquez can add a bit of pace to a team lacking much going forward.

 

[NorthernCule]

Not direct comparisons though.

Koke better defensively and Vasquez can add a bit of pace to a team lacking much going forward.

Not direct comparisons, right, but it's become clear that he's not going to start a singe match for Spain this World Cup. World class players tend to start for their NT.

Bayern have also benched him for big matches on numerous occasions and other times he's been injured.

 

[Barcaman]

Vasquez shouldn't be starting but I guess team needs a waterboy.

 

[Jombi]

If he is actually available for anything in the ball park of 60-70m euros, its such a no brainer. No discussion is needed.

 

[Ursegor]

Thiago was a starter for Pep and Ancelotti and started all the UCL KO matches (when healthy) so don't makeup shit here saying managers sat his ass on the bench. This is a lie!

No he wasn't. At least check your facts before throwing insults.

2015/16 under Pep, return leg vs. Juventus, only came on as a sub in the 101st minute. Was fit, had started (and disappointed) in the first leg.

Same season under Pep, first leg vs. Atletico, got subbed after a disappointing performance in the 70th minute. Then got benched the whole game in the return leg where Bayern trounced Atletico despite going out (Simeone: "This is the best performance a team gave against us" -- and Thiago was not part of it).

This season: Not in Heynckes' starting XI in the return leg against Sevilla nor in the first leg against Real even with Vidal injured. Only after Robben got injured as well Thiago could play and for the new season he is seen as surplus.

I can also answer your question why his contract got extended. Because the club won't lose him for free and can cash in bigger money. You could have answered this yourself.

 

[MTL_Barca]

Not direct comparisons, right, but it's become clear that he's not going to start a singe match for Spain this World Cup. World class players tend to start for their NT.

Bayern have also benched him for big matches on numerous occasions and other times he's been injured.

Before the world cup he was often enough played over Koke as far as i know. Now both are benched. Just like Asensio and Saul are benched and players like Javi Martinez or Sergi Roberto aren't even in the WC squad. It's stupid to make such a statement because it always depends on the players a country has available. If he played for any other team he would be a starter because nothing comes close to a midfield with Iniesta, Isco, Busquets, Silva etc

The only thing that matters is if he would strengthen our squad and i have no idea how someone can look at our dead midfield and come to the conclusion we don't need a new quality CM. And no matter how you put it no available CM is better than him.

If you think Koke is slightly better yeah buy Koke but its impossible so what should we do? Some people here make it look like we already have a world class midfield that can only be improved by a new Xavi but that's far from true. We don't need a new Xavi, Thiago doesn't have to be the best CM in the world to make us stronger.

Currently we have one yeah ONE proven quality CM in the whole squad and that is Rakitic wo isn't even better than Thiago. Our alternatives are Andre Gomes, Paulinho and hoping for Arthur or Alena.

How can someone watch the last season and say we don't need a player like Thiago. The midfield is average and it can't even play Barca style football, it looks like a ManUtd midfield.

No matter if he starts for Spain or not, he would improve the quality of our midfield a lot.