Van Persie

[danumber10]

I agree with you guys, i prefer Villa at the wide forward role. But if you talk about who is better between Villa en Van Persie as a striker and footballer. I would prefer Van Persie. Maybe cause im Dutch.

I'm not dutch but trust me Van Persie could do better than Villa on the wings.

 

[Manuel Traquete]

van Persie can come back when he manages to score 20+ goals for 10 consecutive years.

This. + his brilliant international career.

Van Persie is a level below Villa at every footballing aspect.

/thread

10 years of excellence > 1/2

 

[Dinho]

Suarez > Van Persie anyway.

 

[La Furia]

This. + his brilliant international career.

Apparently it's okay that RVP has been the invisible man for the Netherlands because he's not used correctly, despite supposedly being a more versatile player than Villa.

 

[Aryagorn]

Who said that? If anything they aren't that far removed except one has pulled a disappearing act in his international career and plays for a system notorious for inflating its star players at Arsenal.

I just don't see any reason for paying Kaka-esque money for a guy having a career season. One year without injuries doesn't make him suddenly safe.

Paying huge money for RvP is out of the question, his injuryproneness & age totally rule that out

To the hypothetical question : Who is a better striker when fit and in prime, Villa or RvP?
I think it is RvP. I thought you were one among the clan saying that all the hype is just based on his one season.

 

[danumber10]

This. + his brilliant international career.



/thread

10 years of excellence > 1/2

Should we get rid of Messi for not having a "BRIILANT" international career? International Career is 80 % based on luck.

 

[Yugi]

Apparently it's okay that RVP has been the invisible man for the Netherlands because he's not used correctly, despite supposedly being a more versatile player than Villa.

but hey, RVP is playing in EPL, best league in the world
he would tore the nets in Spain with these brainless defenders around

 

[La Furia]

Should we get rid of Messi for not having a "BRIILANT" international career? International Career is 80 % based on luck.

This is absurd.

Yes, Messi has had bad luck playing for a garbage international team. Argentina has been a circus. There is valid criticism against Messi for his performances for Argentina, but it doesn't help how horribly coached he has been and how he plays with guys who refuse to pass the ball.

The Netherlands have, on the other hand, been the most consistently good international team of possibly the last decade.

 

[Aryagorn]

What you mean by "Villas wok rate" ? Could you elaborate more on this? How is Villa the better option on the wings? And Van Persie could even come free. He has one year left in his contract. If Barca wanted him and he wanted to come ( Which by the way he refers to Barca and the fact he always wanted to play for either barca or Arsenal before arsenal even signed him ) which it seems he does, I'm sure we could get a good deal.

I don't really know how to explain the work rate part... And come on, we are talking about a club captain. There's no way he is going any where for free. Just remember that Wenger has shown a lot of patience towards this injuryprone guy, and if he decides to abandon that club for free forgetting all the help they've done to him... I won't want him representing my club

 

[Manuel Traquete]

Should we get rid of Messi for not having a "BRIILANT" international career? International Career is 80 % based on luck.

Is club career based on luck too? Because Villa is way ahead there as well.

 

[La Furia]

Yeah I really don't see RVP leaving for free, and if he does it's to the club that promises him the most.

 

[danumber10]

This is absurd.

Yes, Messi has had bad luck playing for a garbage international team. Argentina has been a circus. There is valid criticism against Messi for his performances for Argentina, but it doesn't help how horribly coached he has been and how he plays with guys who refuse to pass the ball.

The Netherlands have, on the other hand, been the most consistently good international team of possibly the last decade.

That's what I'm saying. International career is based on luck 80% of the time. Had Messi been born in Spain he would have won the world cup already. Had he accepted won play For Spain when offered he's be on top of the world right now without anyone doubting his game. You see in National teams you are stuck with W.e player happen to be from your country at that place in time, In Clubs you can actually move forward and find better teammates and players. And Please let's not make excuses for Messi's failure with Argentina. He's been coached by 5 different people yet we always blame the coach. The reason why Messi doesn't shine as much is b.c he needs better players in his team. We should not be unfair to criticize Messi b.c of Argentina and no other player. We should only care about their performance with the club....let others in their country deal with the failure in national team.

 

[Aryagorn]

Yeah I really don't see RVP leaving for free, and if he does it's to the club that promises him the most.

Whatever the promise it'd be really cruel to leave Arsenal in such a helplessness state without at least providing them any kind of compensation... unless he won them the league and Cl next season

 

[Aryagorn]

That's what I'm saying. International career is based on luck 80% of the time. Had Messi been born in Spain he would have won the world cup already. Had he accepted won play For Spain when offered he's be on top of the world right now without anyone doubting his game. You see in National teams you are stuck with W.e player happen to be from your country at that place in time, In Clubs you can actually move forward and find better teammates and players. And Please let's not make excuses for Messi's failure with Argentina. He's been coached by 5 different people yet we always blame the coach. The reason why Messi doesn't shine as much is b.c he needs better players in his team. We should not be unfair to criticize Messi b.c of Argentina and no other player. We should only care about their performance with the club....let others in their country deal with the failure in national team.

RvP got good coach and well performing team for his NT though. They were 1st in rankings very recently.

I really don't know why he underperforms for his NT. He did well in 08-09 though

His club form is good, and always has been considering his injuries and all.

 

[La Furia]

That's what I'm saying. International career is based on luck 80% of the time. Had Messi been born in Spain he would have won the world cup already. Had he accepted won play For Spain when offered he's be on top of the world right now without anyone doubting his game. You see in National teams you are stuck with W.e player happen to be from your country at that place in time, In Clubs you can actually move forward and find better teammates and players. And Please let's not make excuses for Messi's failure with Argentina. He's been coached by 5 different people yet we always blame the coach. The reason why Messi doesn't shine as much is b.c he needs better players in his team. We should not be unfair to criticize Messi b.c of Argentina and no other player. We should only care about their performance with the club....let others in their country deal with the failure in national team.

Argentina is a very particular case though. Yes we always blame the coach, for a good reason - the coach is never chosen based on merits, but based on what suits Grondona and the AFA the most.

And besides that, playing with so many talented ballhogs is also unique. You put Messi on some second rate international side - say, Venezuela, he won't win anything, but he'd probably be able to inflate his states a lot more easily than playing with guys like Tevez, Di Maria, Aguero, Banega and so on who all want the glory for themselves. You put Messi on a mediocre but fundamentally sound side - Paraguay, and he could easily shine.


It hasn't been "luck" that has made so many Dutch players - besides RVP, look consistently good internationally, it hasn't been luck that lead Forlan and then Suarez to turn Uruguay into a top 5 international side in the world. Systems do matter, and Messi has the worst case scenario.