10 - Lionel Messi - v3

[Luftstalag14]

Another lucky deflection, karma for 2010.

How so?

 

[Paganinisrvnge]

I'd rather Messi and Argentina start off slow and get into form than obliterate everyone in the group then get knocked out at the round of 16 or quarterfinals. Obviously I was hoping for a great performance today but Messi delivered when Argentina needed him most. Iran parked an enormous bus; I don't expect teams in the knockouts to do that unless they're clear underdogs.

 

[Luftstalag14]

overall I am just not that impressed with Messi so far. When the rumors came out that he was saving himself for this tournament when he was taking sunday strolls through the Camp Nou instead of actually playing, I was hoping to see an overall increase in his effort and his workrate and I have yet to see it. He still walks about the pitch, waiting for the play to come to him instead of imposing his will on matches like he used to do.

Fucking Ronaldo does more off the ball than Messi does right now and it used to be quite the opposite a few years ago. He is still clearly the most explosive and dynamic player in the world and when he gives it 100%, no one can touch him still. I just don't see that old tenacity and hunger that he used to have when he was younger and I think 4 Balon's in a row jaded him. And the fact that I am not seeing it right now on the biggest stage in a tournament that is very feasible for Argentina to win it is disappointing and worrying for me.

I always think that all 10 other players work much harder than Messi does, for both us and Argentina and if he isn't willing to leave it on the pitch for his country in the World Cup, he certainly isn't going to do it for us next season. Idc if Vince Lombardi came back from the grave to try coaching football and Barcelona gave him a chance, I am unsure of whether or not even he could ignite that consistent tenacity back and that tenacity is what is missing from our squad right now and it all begins with Messi.

Maybe he is having health problems with this whole vomiting thing but I honestly don't think its a big deal, its just a coping mechanism he is developing to deal with all of the pressure he has right now but I just don't like what I see from Messi atm. We need and Argentina are going to need more from him in the future because again, you can't just switch it on and off and expect to win every game like that. That's not how sports in general, let alone football, works.

 

[DonAK]

How so?

The amount of time he hit the post in 2010 was way too much without the ball actually going in lol. The amount of bad luck he had in that tournament was astonishing.

 

[Vilarrubi]

@Luftstalag14 It's physically impossible to score goals against teams who put 10 men behind the ball.. Even more so when your midfield doesn't have any real vision or passing ability. Comparing Suarez vs England and Messi vs Iran is like chalk and cheese.. The Uruguay vs England game was 50/50.. end to end football. Look at when Cavani picks up the ball to assist Suarez, there isn't 10 men behind the ball.. there is so much space! Also did you watch Suarez against Chelsea this season? A team which likes to sit back and put players behind the ball? He created nothing at all.

 

[Luftstalag14]

I respect your opinion but I totally disagree. I don't think you appreciate how tough it is to play against a team with 11 men behind the ball when you have Mascherano ( hasn't played midfield for 3 years ) and Gago ( played poor today ) in midfield. Even at Barca with our great midfield we can struggle against these sort of defences. The you add the fact that Messi has 3 players around him at all times.

Fair enough you can say he should be playing like he was in 2010, but to say he's past it is hyperbole. He explodes when given space.

2 goals in 2 games might seem poor against the opposition, but how many goals do Aguero, Higuain and Di Maria have?

Kerry, why do you think that is? Is it because teams, whether be our La Liga and European opponents, or Argentina's opposing teams obtained the secret of how to effectively contain Messi, or is Messi choosing not to play to his best ability?

 

[Paganinisrvnge]

The amount of time he hit the post in 2010 was way too much without the ball actually going in lol. The amount of bad luck he had in that tournament was astonishing.

Especially vs Nigeria. So this means Messi is going to score a hat trick against Nigeria this time around.

 

[NotInHere]

Especially vs Nigeria. So this means Messi is going to score a hat trick against Nigeria this time around.

Not if Nigeria parks their airplane

no but seriously, hopefully they don't resort to that tactic, seeing that against Iran, it worked for the majority of the time. I think with space Messi will show us who he really is, the best player in the world.

 

[DinhoR10]

Well tbh he probably could've scored that goal sooner if he tried but I don't understand why people keep saying he needs to move more since he wasn't a winger or center forward in this game and there was no where to go where he could et the ball on the ground in a dangerous area and since he's five foot nothing a ball for him to head down is out of the question.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Flavia]

Kerry, why do you think that is? Is it because teams, whether be our La Liga and European opponents, or Argentina's opposing teams obtained the secret of how to effectively contain Messi, or is Messi choosing not to play to his best ability?

Yes, he is "choosing" not to play to his best. It's so obvious.

 

[Luftstalag14]

I'd also like to add; if the theory that Messi is saving himself for the world cup is correct then why can't he save himself for the knockouts? It's a fairly easy group and he only needs to turn on beast mode when his team are being shit. In the knockouts he'll go full beast mode and destroy.

But that makes no sense, unless if we are saying Messi rather hopes that Argentina barely qualifies (as the No.2 in the group) so he can save himself to play against tougher teams like France (for sure if Argentina loses to Nigeria next Wednesday) and possibly Germany in the knockout rounds.

 

[Kerrybai]

Kerry, why do you think that is? Is it because teams, whether be our La Liga and European opponents, or Argentina's opposing teams obtained the secret of how to effectively contain Messi, or is Messi choosing not to play to his best ability?

Messi (14) has completed the most dribbles so far in World Cup 2014 (ahead of Di Maria 11)

Teams have certainly figured out how to contain him, it's even easier when the rest of the team is choking. Let's just agree that he could do more off the ball... but on the ball he is still trying his best and performing great. That's the reason I had such an issue with the past it statement. Off the ball perhaps he just doesn't know what to do, I mean he doesn't have the movement of a number 9, it's just not natural for him. This is the World cup, we can say he didn't put in effort for Barca but for Argentina in Brazil?

Maybe we should consider other reasons for his lack of movement and low distance covered.

 

[Paganinisrvnge]

But that makes no sense, unless if we are saying Messi rather hopes that Argentina barely qualifies (as the No.2 in the group) so he can save himself to play against tougher teams like France (for sure if Argentina loses to Nigeria next Wednesday) and possibly Germany in the knockout rounds.

Maybe he secretly knows Germany will qualify second in their group behind the US and wants to avoid them.

 

[Luftstalag14]

See you are looking at the player, while I tend to look at the performances. I don't think Messi will ever be as good as he showed in 2010-2012, which logically means he is past his peak. The golden generation has ended and I highly doubt the next one will provide Messi the platform that he got in 2010-12. It doesn't matter if his technical ability, speed etc. remain the same if he can't put it on show like before.

I don't want to agree with you there but I have to. I think you are right. Performance-wise, we will probably never see the same old Messi again.

As Barca and Messi fans, it is just something that will take a while to sink in for us because it hurts so much. It really hurts. If we accept that we will be more at peace.

 

[Gaudi]

Ufff I'm just reading stats, comprehensive ones, from fifa.com, truly not good. They have this stats, maybe not 100% accurate but still, where they measure not just running distance but running tempo as well and his are not so good.
Nobody can't fool himself anymore, he is not moving well, don't know why though.