André Gomes
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DonAK
President of FC Barcelona
It's like in the case of players like Zidane, Yaya Toure, maybe Iniesta. They are slow, but their ball control and ball recepcion makes them seem faster than most opponents and harder to stop.
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FlaFCB
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He is now.
God Serena
New member
But that's not my argument. Rafinha and Denis being bad doesn't excuse Gomes from being bad as well. I've seen nothing from Gomes to indicate he has this potential I keep hearing about and any hype coming from those who support him looks nearly identical to hype for players like Adama (Okay, Adama is a very dumb player but the overall idea is the same, discussing "potential" instead of quality), and it means very little to me overall.
Our only good midfielder at present is Iniesta, and he's getting old. Rakitic, Denis, Rafinha, and Gomes are just not Barca quality. I couldn't care less about who could or couldn't play for Juventus. Alena will be joining the first team in the next season or two and he too will be nothing more than a potential, along with Samper. Potential doesn't win trophies, quality does, and Gomes doesn't have the quality.
serghei
Senior Member
I agree with this. Their technique on the ball makes them look faster.
Barca has specifically said that Gomes' signing was an opportunity in the market for us to sign a really talented player. It's either you sign potentially world class players when they are young, and you take care of them and develop them, or you take out 100m and try to sign players that are world class already. In which case you might find that the players you want to sign already play for big clubs who don't want to sell. Why? Because they bought them at the same stage that we are buying Gomes now, have invested time and trust in them, developing them to world class level, and now expect a big fat check to let them go, or tell you to fuck off like PSG is telling us with Verratti.
Tell me one world class midfielder who doesn't play for a top club, because people are speaking only about the likes of Coutinho, Verratti, Isco, who can't be signed, or would cost 100m. There isn't one, because you don't become world class by playing for Valencia, or Monaco, or Marseille, or other teams like that. You become world class by playing at the highest level, in the best teams, in which case the price gets closer and closer to 80-100m, simply because top and rich clubs don't need the money.
Gomes' signing is the exact type of signing we have to make. Talented players that can become great players in 2 years. The comparison with Adama is so off the mark it's not even funny anymore.
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BBZ8800
Senior Member
I still think that Gomes is an NT quality.
But he maybe isn't a Barca's fit.
About us having only one good Cm, you are right.
This is how I would also rate our Cms:
1. Iniesta, world class level for all clubs, NT level, Barca's starting material even aged 33
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2. Rakitic, very high level for majority of top clubs. He could play in other tops clubs also. NT level. He was Barca's starting material level, but he lost it due to some factors (loss of physical abilities being the key, imo). So, he is not Barca's starting level anymore, but he WAS that level in the past.
3. Arda, the same as Raki, very high level, NT level. But he was never Barca's fit. Even though, he could play in some other top teams (and he played for Atletico).
4. Gomes, NT level, but probably not Barca's fit. Also, the same as Rakitic and Arda, he could play in other top teams and be a key player (Juventus, for example)
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5. Rafinha: not an NT level, not a world class player either at Barca either in other top clubs. Imo, if he would left Barca, he would never play in Bayern or Juve, but in Villareal, Everton and similar
6. Roberto: the same. Not an NT level, not Barca's starting material, and when he would leave Barca, he could play only in a 2nd tier clubs, the same as Rafinha. Roberto and Rafinha are good for Barca mostly because they came from La Masia and they are a good fit even though their set skills is limited
7. Denis: the same as these 2. Not an NT level, and he couldn't play as a starter in biggest european teams. He has better skills than Rafinha/Roberto but he is a weaker fit for Barca since he isn't from La Masia
So, instead of having 3 players who are world class level, but not a good fit currently (Rakitic, Arda, Gomes) and 3 squad level players (Rafinha, Roberto, Denis), it would be better if we would have bought 1-2 awesome fits (Gundogan's style) and kept 2 squad players.
On the other hand, every team needs squad players, good guys like Rafinha and Roberto.
But the problem is that we don't need 3-4-5 or more squad players who offer more or less the same.
Imo, Samper will end the same as Rafinha/Roberto/Denis (squad level for Barca) and bringing him back while we still have Rafinha/Roberto/Denis would be a suicide and just having way too much squad level of players.
I have already said a few Months ago, imo, Barca will buy 2-3-4-5 new Cms in the next 1-2-3 summers.
Iniesta is almost finished, and other "attempts" (Gomes, Denis, Arda) are not turning as expected.
A sad thing is, a few years ago we had 4 midfielders of a world class level and who are a Barca's fit (Xavi, Iniesta, Thiago and even Fabregas).
Currently we have only 1 (Iniesta) and he will be retired soon.
Our only chances are: Alena and 2-3 world class+perfect fit Cms in upcoming summers.
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serghei
Senior Member
Good luck with that. We already saw this scenario with Verratti. Other than Verratti there is no world class midfielder we can sign who would be a good fit with Pep's Barca style (I say Pep's Barca style because that is what people mean when they say Barca DNA).The only reasonable way to achieve that is to hope we have other Xavis and Iniestas comming up from La Masia. Chances of that happening anytime soon are 1% or close to that. So what we actually need to do is adapt our style to the reality of the situation we are facing today.
Kroos and Pogba are the last world class midfielders signed in the last 3-4 years IIRC. The selling clubs were top clubs both times, Juventus and Bayern. Pogba is not a good fit, Kroos probably was, but we didn't have the money probably.
What is the last world class midfielder we signed? Probably Cesc in 2011.
Midfield is an area where top teams usually sign players earlier, in the development phase. They don't wait for certainty because if you wait for a player to reach world class status to sign, you will find out signing him is near impossible, because he'd already be playing for a top club by then.
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BBZ8800
Senior Member
I know.
Top players cost 100 Millions.
But if La Masia is dry (like always except in 10-15 golden years in 00's), imo, it would be better if the board bought 3-4-5 young guys (18-22 years) like Denis Suarez.
Instead of spending 40+40 on Arda and Gomes, we could have bought a few youngsters.
Ii's is somewhat similar to a lottery.
If you buy only one youngster, you have small chances to hit a jackpot.
If you buy 5 guys and play them in a Bteam/loan them, chances to get ONE future starter are way higher.
Also, since buying youngsters is a huge gamble, instead of buying random young midfielders from Russia/Croatia/Sweden/insert random country, imo, a longterm plan of scouting young midfielders from youth academies/clubs/countries which share the same playing style as Barca, could raise the chances for a success.
For example: players from Ajax and Dutch teams play the same as we do.
So, buying a potential gem from Ajax has a higher chances for a success than a gem from Russia/Cameroon (for example).
Imo, imagine if we bought 6 players (midfielders) for 10M each (age 18-20):
-- 2 guys from Netherlands
-- 2 guys from Spanish league who seem to have our DNA (like Oliver Torres in the past)
-- 2 guys from Brasil who seem to have what we might need
I don't know how much money our club has, but if we will need a longterm planning and if La Masia is dry and if we don't have money for Pogbas and Verrattis, then some kind of planning like in my example could give some fruits over a fer years.
I mean, if not, and if both La Masia is dry and if we won't have money for Pogbas (100M), then we will be stuck with random transfers like Denis Suarez, Arda and similar for the next 10-20 years.
serghei
Senior Member
Or we tweak our style, in order to adapt to the team we have, the manager in charge, and the opportunities on the trasfer market. Which is what Lucho has been doing to great effect.
BusiTheKing
Senior Member
One of his better performances. I generally agree with people that he isn't a good fit for Barca, as he will never function well in tight spaces or turn with the ball and distribute forwards under pressure. Defensively, he's very clumsy. Positioning isn't great, opponents get past him too easily and he commits way too many fouls. He can bring the ball forward in open spaces and win headers. He seems keen on shooting although his shots are generally awful.
serghei
Senior Member
Not necessarily. No team is full of world class players. I would not consider Casemiro world class for example, or any of Bayern's midfielders bar Vidal maybe.
And just because you are not world class doesn't mean you are mediocre. You can still be very good.
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Vilarrubi
New member
Casemiro is amazing at what he does breaking up play, we all saw how RM became better defensively when he was introduced. As for the rest of RMs midfield definitely world class.. even some on the bench.
Maybe world class is the wrong word although Thiago, Xabi Alonso, Vidal all are. Renato Sanches and Kimmich are levels above Gomes too.
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