Arturo Vidal

[Hamzah]

He left training, official announcement today

 

[DonAK]

I don't think we'll move away from 4-4-2. Fitting both Messi and Suarez into 4-3-3 still remains an issue.

And the 4-4-2 hinders creativity in the middle with all the burden falling on two players and have no room for any winger. Slow team, slow sterile possession with everyone waiting for either Messi or Coutinho to do anything.

Suarez need to adapt his game and perform or sit on the bench.

 

[El Gato]

I don't think we'll move away from 4-4-2. Fitting both Messi and Suarez into 4-3-3 still remains an issue.

4-4-2 is a league and rotation thing. Doesn't really fit Barca anyway. Was only a tool to remind the team how hard they should work at the back.

Messi is a RW/SS. He needs to come off the right to be effective. All the Dembeles and whoever will grow into the team through the league fixtures, but won't be enough to deliver CL in the short-term. Hence you need an alternative like Vidal to go to if they're helpless.

 

[henias]

I don't think we'll move away from 4-4-2. Fitting both Messi and Suarez into 4-3-3 still remains an issue.

442 doesnt fit our style, simple as that.

 

[henias]

I don't think 4-4-2 is dead. Coutinho-Busquets-Rakitic-Vidal with Suarez and Messi upfront is something that I can totally see Valverde pulling off.

Nah replacing Paulinho with Vidal aint gonna work as well. Not in the CL at least. Vidal's not a wide player as well.

 

[Hamzah]

And the 4-4-2 hinders creativity in the middle with all the burden falling on two players and have no room for any winger. Slow team, slow sterile possession with everyone waiting for either Messi or Coutinho to do anything.

Suarez need to adapt his game and perform or sit on the bench.

If Messi showed more work rate in the pressing game then he could fit in a 4-3-3 like 2015, he dropped his efforts in that area since then and the following season when he asked to move closer to the middle, Barca had a drop in league form and CL exit.

It really limits Barca’s options when he does that. Madrid have this same problem with Bale, it’s why Vasquez sometimes plays instead of him. Even Ronaldo who was notorious for not bothering to press started doing it later in his career.

 

[henias]

If Messi showed more work rate in the pressing game then he could fit in a 4-3-3 like 2015, he dropped his efforts in that area since then and the following season when he asked to move closer to the middle, Barca had a drop in league form and CL exit.

It really limits Barca’s options when he does that. Madrid have this same problem with Bale, it’s why Vasquez sometimes plays instead of him. Even Ronaldo who was notorious for not bothering to press started doing it later in his career.

You'll need to press and cover more distance with a 442 as well. And we cant keep possession effectively with a 442, Messi is the least of the problems when he literally was the reason we even got past Chelsea. The midfield was the issue.

 

[Hamzah]

Nah replacing Paulinho with Vidal aint gonna work as well. Not in the CL at least. Vidal's not a wide player as well.

Valverde has two different 4-4-2, one was a flat 4-4-2 and one was more of a diamond shape. Paulinho played as the tip of the diamond in that formation and Vidal can do that here. Although a better option is Coutinho as the tip of the diamond with Rakitic, Busquets and Vidal behind.

Still I would prefer a 4-3-3 if it’s possible.

 

[Neeraj]

If Messi showed more work rate in the pressing game then he could fit in a 4-3-3 like 2015, he dropped his efforts in that area since then and the following season when he asked to move closer to the middle, Barca had a drop in league form and CL exit.

It really limits Barca’s options when he does that. Madrid have this same problem with Bale, it’s why Vasquez sometimes plays instead of him. Even Ronaldo who was notorious for not bothering to press started doing it later in his career.

I think expecting Messi to start pressing is expecting mircacles; not only is he not mentally condition to do so, physically, he just isn't there. However, we do need him to move more in an offensive sense. When we talk about Messi walking, I don't think he's required to do much pressing/defending really, but to constantly move and make himself available for good passes rather than waiting on ball to feet and being marked by 2-3 opposition players. Just this change would be more than sufficient, if all other 9 outfield players put in effort into pressing (including our striker, which isn't happening at the moment)

 

[Hamzah]

You'll need to press and cover more distance with a 442 as well. And we cant keep possession effectively with a 442, Messi is the least of the problems when he literally was the reason we even got past Chelsea. The midfield was the issue.

I agree Messi is the least of the problems in that he’s clearly the best player. It’s just operating a 4-3-3 with him is tough because the right back won’t be receiving help.

I would like a 4-3-3 but that is the main problem with it.

 

[Hamzah]

I think expecting Messi to start pressing is expecting mircacles; not only is he not mentally condition to do so, physically, he just isn't there. However, we do need him to move more in an offensive sense. When we talk about Messi walking, I don't think he's required to do much pressing/defending really, but to constantly move and make himself available for good passes rather than waiting on ball to feet and being marked by 2-3 opposition players. Just this change would be more than sufficient, if all other 9 outfield players put in effort into pressing (including our striker, which isn't happening at the moment)

I agree he is static in offense these days aswell. To be fair to Suarez he does press but not as effectively anymore, seems to have lost some physicality.

 

[El Gato]

I agree Messi is the least of the problems in that he’s clearly the best player. It’s just operating a 4-3-3 with him is tough because the right back won’t be receiving help.

I would like a 4-3-3 but that is the main problem with it.

That's what Vidal is for... Lahm had fucking Muller and Robben ahead of him for years.

 

[Barcilliant]

Paulinho is supposed to add "strength" to Barca and we see the result...

And Vidal is not really really better than Paulinho

😂
Vidal is an upgrade. Especially technique wise. Is first touch and passing are good and he's more disciplined defensively.

Valverde will certainly use Vidal alot I he's healthy and focused.

 

[henias]

Valverde has two different 4-4-2, one was a flat 4-4-2 and one was more of a diamond shape. Paulinho played as the tip of the diamond in that formation and Vidal can do that here. Although a better option is Coutinho as the tip of the diamond with Rakitic, Busquets and Vidal behind.

Still I would prefer a 4-3-3 if it’s possible.

Way too narrow and not enough width.

 

[Barcilliant]

Play 4231

Alba Umtiti Pique Semedo at the back.

Vidal/Rakitic and Busquets in front of the back four.

Messi in the middle flanked by Coutinho and Dembele /Malcolm.

Suarez up top or maybe even try Dembele as a cf.