Classico Overdose

XaviMessiGirl

New member
Disagree. It all ultimately comes down to how many titles a team has.

RM has more titles than us, so you're saying they're the better club?

And you could have a billion titles but have a shitty attitude and philosophy and people are going to recognize you for the latter. People are going to say "yes they have all these titles BUT..." For example Juventus is historically the most successful Serie A club, but now most people think of Calciopoli when they think of Juve, not how successful they have been.
 

Richard.H

Senior Member
RM has more titles than us, so you're saying they're the better club?

And you could have a billion titles but have a shitty attitude and philosophy and people are going to recognize you for the latter. People are going to say "yes they have all these titles BUT..." For example Juventus is historically the most successful Serie A club, but now most people think of Calciopoli when they think of Juve, not how successful they have been.

I'm not basing my opinion on a moral ground. When you see people make comparisons between teams, the first thing they mention is the amount of titles. No I don't think RM is the better club because I'm a Barca Fan, but many people will agree that overall RM is the better club over the last few generations, but definitely not these last couple of years. It's something that opposition fans and analyzers point out constantly for prestige and such reasons. However, no doubt we're the better club now.

And no you can't really care the Juve situation with this. Diving is a huge part of the sport, whether you like it or not. While it's definitely not pretty, it does not automatically disqualify a team for not being worthy for a title.
 

XaviMessiGirl

New member
While it's definitely not pretty, it does not automatically disqualify a team for not being worthy for a title.

I was using it as a comparison to show this: Match fixing (Juve) changed the outcome of results. Diving to get people sent off, and then when it doesn't work, having half your squad pressure the ref to change his mind, changes the outcome as well.

I know most teams have players who dive but most at not so pathetic a level as Busquets and Alves do it. Nani is the only example I can think of who is as bad as them, CR maybe too but even he has gotten a bit better.

Anyway obviously I'm in the extreme minority of Barca fans when I say my opinion, so I will just agree to disagree here. We could debate for pages and pages but it's pretty pointless. I just hope that we stay our usual classy selves for the second leg, we have a huge advantage already plus we're playing at home. Let RM players make themselves look bad as usual. Visca Barca.
 

Richard.H

Senior Member
I was using it as a comparison to show this: Match fixing (Juve) changed the outcome of results. Diving to get people sent off, and then when it doesn't work, having half your squad pressure the ref to change his mind, changes the outcome as well.

I know most teams have players who dive but most at not so pathetic a level as Busquets and Alves do it. Nani is the only example I can think of who is as bad as them, CR maybe too but even he has gotten a bit better.

Anyway obviously I'm in the extreme minority of Barca fans when I say my opinion, so I will just agree to disagree here. We could debate for pages and pages but it's pretty pointless. I just hope that we stay our usual classy selves for the second leg, we have a huge advantage already plus we're playing at home. Let RM players make themselves look bad as usual. Visca Barca.


No worries. Everyone is free to have their own opinions. True, Busquets especially, takes it to a whole another level.
 

DucdeOrléans

New member
We've tried. Look at Copa del Rey final, or even the league match at Bernabeu. Madrid players got away with their constant fouls, on and off the ball. I'm sure the playacting was Pep's solution to their fouling us off the park. We played dirty and I don't think anyone likes to see the team they support playing dirty, but we didn't have much choice, we fought fire with fire. I could not care less about the diving, every single club in the world does it and anyone that accuses us of being divers is a hypocrite. What annoys me is the whole circus off the field.

This!

And who cares what the bitter "neutrals" say or think. I could not care less.
 
F

Flavia

Guest
All I'm trying to say is that even though Real Madrid and Mourinho are to blame for most of this, there must be classier ways to deal with them. Getting someone sent off because of a dive has the potential to change the outcome of the entire game, how is that any better than what Madrid did to us to provoke that in the first place?
Are you talking about Dani? Because that tackle was a red, I have no doubt about it. Rm got even cheap, as marcelo should had been sent off for stomping on pedro... and adebayor for hitting busquets on the face.
 

Ocelot

New member
RM has more titles than us, so you're saying they're the better club?

And you could have a billion titles but have a shitty attitude and philosophy and people are going to recognize you for the latter. People are going to say "yes they have all these titles BUT..." For example Juventus is historically the most successful Serie A club, but now most people think of Calciopoli when they think of Juve, not how successful they have been.

Juve are still the biggest club in Italy. They were relegated for nothing, and by next summer we will all see that.
 

ricknattery

New member
All I'm trying to say is that even though Real Madrid and Mourinho are to blame for most of this, there must be classier ways to deal with them

But, what would you suggest Pep to do in this case? we don't need to be above good and bad(no one is), we make mistakes as well, we cannot pretend to have saints as Barca players. Sometimes we cheat, but its football, sometimes you don't even have time to decide about your actiions, you just act. Overall I'd say our team is one of the best regarding sportsmanship. The best team will have everything magnified, we have more people in love with our football, but also more people hating us, neutrals are disappearing when it comes to Barca. That's what every great champion has to go through
 
B

Busquets

Guest
"These El Clasicos are demonstrating the forces of Yin and Yang. Opposite forces colliding. Beauty against the Beast. And thanks to God (dare I say Messi), Beauty won.

Jose Mourinho is an intelligent man. He knows and accepts that Barcelona are superior. So he sets his teams up to destroy Barcelona’s creative play by employing three defensive midfielders, with Ozil and Di Maria also dropping back. So in effect, the Blaugranas have to penetrate a 10 man defensive shield, full of players who are keen to break up the play with niggly and sometimes overly aggressive fouls. And in the two recent meetings, it’s clear that these tactics have worked, as Messi and co have struggled to create many goalscoring chances.

Barcelona are clearly aware of this tactic, so they realise the importance of the referee’s tolerance towards persistent fouling. If the referee allows this to happen, like in the Copa Del Rey final, then Barcelona can’t get their passing game together and their heads will drop in frustration. If the referee is strong and stamps this behaviour out, then it puts Real under pressure knowing that they risk yellow and red cards and Barca can get their tiki-taka passing game going.

This is why Barcelona kept running towards the referee time and again after Real kept ruining the game by breaking up the play. As if to say to Madrid: “If your intention is to foul us, then we’ll overreact so the referee punishes you”. Yes, no one wants to see it, but look at the reason why they did it. And let’s be consistent here: Real were also guilty of diving and surrounding the referee. Talk about Pedro, Alves and Busquets theatrics all you want, but Di Maria is the biggest diver of all - look at how many penalties he’s won for Real Madrid this season. Ronaldo? Say no more. Carvalho, Ramos and Marcelo also go to ground very easily. Remember Crouch’s red card in the quarter final? Marcelo rolled about until he saw the red card come out, then he celebrated and got back up! But Pepe is the biggest scumbag of all of them. He loves to dish out the punishment but dives when he gets caught himself. When Mascherano caught him, he rolled over so many times, he nearly left the stadium.

Mourinho sent his team out super charged, with the clear instruction to destroy Barcelona and not to concede. When the players are pumped up like this, it’s no wonder that yellow and red cards will follow. Was Pepe’s challenge a red card? For me, it was an “orange” card, a borderline case. But what is not in question is that when you go into the tackle like that, studs up over the ball, you’re at the referee’s mercy. Same with Adebayor when he came on, charged up like a bull seeing a red rag. His arms and elbows are flying all over the place…again, you’re running the risk of a red card. Marcelo’s deliberate stamp on Pedro was undeniably a red card, there’s no question about that.

Mourinho asks why his players keep getting sent off against Barcelona. Maybe it’s a by-product of his instruction to his players. How come none of Barcelona’s players get caught up in red card controversies against Real Madrid? Maybe, just maybe, it’s because they actually want to play football, whereas Mourinho, in his own words, said this game “was destined to finish 0-0”, which was his intention all night long.

And that’s my biggest problem with him employing these tactics at Real Madrid. Yes, he’s the best manager in the world, and yes, I’m a massive fan of him. But when you’re at Real Madrid - an institution of football – and you’re going into battle against the ultimate enemy in the grandest match in the world El Clasico, armed with world class players of your own, you have a duty to entertain. Instead, Mourinho serves up this “sh*t on a stick” style of football – a phrase current Real Madrid General Manager Jorge Valdano once used about a Mourinho-Benitez match a few years ago.

No doubt the red card opened up the game, but it still needed two sublime goals to unlock a resolute 10 man defence. Brilliant play by Afellay, and Messi’s lightning quick movement behind Alonso won him the space he needed to prod the ball home through Casillas’s legs. As for the second goal…GENIUS. Pure genius.

Messi was largely kept quiet prior to that, as expected, although he did find Xavi with a brilliant throughball in the first half, but that was it. Ronaldo? I actually felt sorry for him, as Mourinho’s tactics rendered him usesless, unless set pieces came into the equation. I think secretly he’s growing frustrated with these negative tactics. When you win, it’s all good because you have a trophy to show for all your hard work, blood, sweat and tears. But when you lose, what do you have? Nothing. No style and no result – the ultimate embarrassment. Real Madrid’s hopes have virtually died, without them never knowing what could have happened if they showed more ambition.

Whatever your thoughts about this match are, lets agree that for the sake of positive football, the best team won and should progress to Wembley. Barcelona versus Manchester United should make for a far more entertaining spectacle – a spectacle fit for a Champions League final. "

original post : http://forum.football.co.uk/about424544-0-asc-40.html

There. Pay this guy a beer. Thank him later.
 

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