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DonAndres

Wild Man of Borneo
I agree that Messi is a better player in general, but jeez, you are really trying hard to edge everything you possibly can in Messis favor.
Messis best performances are more dominant than Ronaldos, yes, but there is no question that Ronaldo is now the better CL player.
You say something about goalratio, but again, Ronaldo has far outscored Messi in knockouts, the bigger games. Was it always top opposition in those knockouts? No, but neither was it for Messi. Knockout goals counts more than group stage goals for me and thats that.
As for titles, Messis first CL-title was hardly his achievment, i mean, that was Ronaldinhos Barcelona, they would have won it anyways.

Btw, people will indeed remember Ronaldos matches in the CL, even if he didnt drible past 5 players or something.

It's not "edging everything in Messi's favor" it's leveling the playing field. It's looking at the context of every match and every performance instead of decontextualizing everything into "goals" and then sometimes "assists". It's really no surprise at all that in every Messi v Ronaldo debate all the key details somehow get thrown out the window and it becomes a dick-measuring contest of goals/assists. The more facts and details you introduce to the discussion, the more it favors Messi. And that is no coincidence.

Can you answer my first question? Is Gerd Muller better than Maradona?

Because modern football fans have this weird complex of goals being the end all be all in a football discussion. It wasn't always the case, otherwise why would the likes of Maradona/Zidane/Cruyff/Iniesta/Xavi etc. be all time greats if they were barely even relevant as goalscorers? If you're really trying to define the overall value of a player you must take EVERYTHING into account.

Messi simply does way more on the football pitch and impacts games way more. If football had any semi-intelligent people involved in the community and developed net impact stats the way basketball has, then the debate about Messi/Ronaldo would barely have even existed in the first place. It's just primitive thinking.

Also, you said "what did Messi do in 2006"? He was amazing against Chelsea in the R16 and crucial towards breaking them down, again if you didn't only look at "goals" then you would know this. Well what did Ronaldo do in 2016? Score some goals against 8th place in the Bundesliga Wolfsburg? Win a final after playing HORRENDOUSLY and getting bailed out by an offside goal from Ramos and a penalty shootout? Get past the only challenging team they faced in the whole tournament in Man City via a single own goal over 2 legs?

Frankly, Messi has a number of losing CL campaigns better than some of the winning seasons by Ronaldo. He impacts Barca's winning seasons much more than Ronaldo does for RM as well. And I remember Ronaldo's performances in the CL just fine actually, better than many RM fans seem to. Every time I pull up match compilations of Ronaldo's CL games I get ignored for pointing out just how little he does outside of taking shots in the area and scoring. It's not about dribbling 5 players or whatever, he barely wins like 1 out of every 3 or 4 1v1's he attempts and it's been like this for years. He doesn't even do any on-ball duties of a striker in buildup, just look at how clueless he was out there without Benzema today to anchor the defensive line and hold up play.

Players like Gerd Muller, Mario Gomez, Thomas Muller, Falcao, etc. were undermined for years for being penalty box predators and poachers. Tell me why Ribery was unanimously the best Bayern player in 12/13 and not Muller/Gomez who both outscored him in all comps? Yet now when Ronaldo plays essentially the same way as those guys but with even MORE of an emphasis on finishing/poaching he gets all the glory for RM.
 

DonAndres

Wild Man of Borneo
I agree. If you want to limit the discussion to be about one thing and one thing only then what's the point?

I happen to believe there's more to football than that. A lot more.
 

Hardy

Senior Member
as much shit he was tonight still just one game away (for me Real is already in Ukraine) to be officialy considered as the greatest player of this generation and possible all time. Nobody and nothing will stop this narrative after an hystorical threepeat, except Messi pull a Maradona 86 in Russian and wins the WC.
 

DonAK

President of FC Barcelona
Jeez.

Guys stop eating the damn tide pods all the time. Get a grip ffs. All you see in CR and Messi threads these days is the same shit.
 

KingLeo10

Senior Member
lmao, even on the days he didn't put in goals, he is threatening messi, football history and everything else in the world for some. relax and enjoy the game a little more.
 

Total-Football

Senior Member
Ronaldo is arguably the best player of all time, in the best form of his life. Trying to belittle him is likely to end up causing you headaches. Unlike Messi, who only ever scores when his team is doing well and progressing to the next round, Ronaldo scores irrespective of whether his team gets eliminated or not.

i know you are trolling.. but if u started watching football two years ago than maybe you're not. Ronaldo in 2008-2012 is 10 times the player he is today. Now he is just a great player leeching off the best midfield in the world and arguibly the second best left back in modern football.
 

Aryagorn

Improvin' Perfection!!
I guess we can worship our grand dictator in peace now :worthy: [MENTION=2]Barcaman[/MENTION]

anyways tonights game for me is why he should never be in the same sentence with Messi, Maradona and Pele. if Madrid aren't feeding him hes pretty much useless, his game has regressed so much its almost sad when you watch him in his United days. could be age but hes been this way longer than hes been in his 30s. travesty if he does win a 6th Ballon d'or. just look at Salah this season compared to this Diva playing in a lesser team

Please let it be perma banned!
 

Benzema10

Official Lyon representative
yesterday was not a off day for Cristiano, it's just that he didn't score. All his games were like this most of the time but he scored plenty so...
 

Barcaman

Administrator
Staff member
Ronaldo is better CL scorer than Messi but never in million years a better player. Not even close.

Of course, everyone is entitled to have an opinion but for most us who watch football there is no contest.
 

FCBfan22

Senior Member
Ronaldo is better CL scorer than Messi but never in million years a better player. Not even close.

Of course, everyone is entitled to have an opinion but for most us who watch football there is no contest.

Patiently waiting for that Swiss guy to tell you his indespicable truth...


:lol:
 

El Flaco

Active member
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