khaled_a_d
Senior Member
And a far worse results tbh
They are both judged harshly, one was asked to win with an old squad (and he did) while the other is asked to rebuild with awful squad, and he is doing this
Ernesto Valverde
- Thread starter Messigician
- Start date
And a far worse results tbh
They are both judged harshly, one was asked to win with an old squad (and he did) while the other is asked to rebuild with awful squad, and he is doing this
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Just a reminder:
2016, Lucho: Atletico 2:0
2017, Lucho: Psg 4:0, Juve 3:0
2018, EV: Roma 3:0
2019, EV: Liverpool 4:0
2020, Setien: Bayern 8:2
2021, Koeman: Psg probably 8:2 on aggreggate
Verdict: EV has ruined our club and turned us into a European laughing stock, lol.
La Liga:
2016: Lucho almost ruined 10 points advantage in the 2nd part of a season
2017: Lucho continues with a new bad season, Real wins a title = making it 18 bad Months in a row for us (since January of 2016)
2018: EV wins a title with 1 defeat
2019: EV wins a title again
2020: Setien doesn't win a title
2021: Koeman barely qualifies for a CL
Verdict: EV is the worst coach in a history who has ruined our Barca, lol.
Now guys, rewind your memory and now you will perfectly understand that picture of EV with a Joker smile when he was fired.
Also, it is fun to remember posts where fans were celebrating, opening champagnes and saying that it was the happiest day in a recent history.
The guy is still insulted and named Retardo, unlike Tata, Setien or Koeman.
A pure gold of a twist.
2016, Lucho: Atletico 2:0
2017, Lucho: Psg 4:0, Juve 3:0
2018, EV: Roma 3:0
2019, EV: Liverpool 4:0
2020, Setien: Bayern 8:2
2021, Koeman: Psg probably 8:2 on aggreggate
Verdict: EV has ruined our club and turned us into a European laughing stock, lol.
La Liga:
2016: Lucho almost ruined 10 points advantage in the 2nd part of a season
2017: Lucho continues with a new bad season, Real wins a title = making it 18 bad Months in a row for us (since January of 2016)
2018: EV wins a title with 1 defeat
2019: EV wins a title again
2020: Setien doesn't win a title
2021: Koeman barely qualifies for a CL
Verdict: EV is the worst coach in a history who has ruined our Barca, lol.
Now guys, rewind your memory and now you will perfectly understand that picture of EV with a Joker smile when he was fired.
Also, it is fun to remember posts where fans were celebrating, opening champagnes and saying that it was the happiest day in a recent history.
The guy is still insulted and named Retardo, unlike Tata, Setien or Koeman.
A pure gold of a twist.
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BBZ8800
Senior Member
Neymar left
Dembele injured
Coutinho unavailable
Suarez ruining every touch
In midfield, a pure magic:
442 with turtle Busi, the worst player in a history turtle Raki, the WOAT of all times Gomes, a shit crap who can't pass Paulinho, and a granny semi-retired almost invisible Iniesta.
The only playable guys were Messi and on rare occassions granny Iniesta and Busi.
I mean, we all agree that Raki, Suarez, Gomes, Paulinho are among the biggest trash ever.
Yet, EV had something like 18 wins, 5 draws in the first 6 Months with that team, conceding 8-9 goals only.
In which universe a Raki-Paulinho-Gomes midfield was a good team?
They could have barely made 2 passes in a row and neither had anything from Barca's DNA.
So, something is off in that story.
You can't have the worst midfielders ever and the worst coach ever, yet having by far the best results in the last few years, plus we won't win titles in upcoming years either.
Some will reply: Messi was in a God mode then.
Fine.
What about the defense?
Messi had nothing with defense.
Our defense and numerous 1:0 and 2:0 clean sheet wins came from EV, 442 and hated midfielders.
La liga 2017/18, opening 18 rounds when he was just came to a club and didn't know his players yet:
Betis 2:0
Alaves 2:0
Espanyol 5:0
Girona 3:0
Las Palmas 3:0
Malaga 2:0
Bilbao 2:0
Leganes 3:0
Villareal 2:0
Deportivo 4:0
Real 3:0
Levante 3:0
Remember, all of that without Neymar (left), Dembele (forever injured), Cou (not bought yet).
He was probably doing something right.
At can't all be a coincidence (like Real playing bad for no reason, Messi playing in a God mode for no reason, midfield defending like crazy).
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putogusiluz8
The Pale One
EV was very pragmatic, and tried to get the most out of what he had available, and he indeed succeeded albeit with a very ugly brand of football. Unfortunately, he was never going to be the solution to our problems, but on the other hand to say he was the cause was evidently mistaken. I agree.
Goodness have we fallen. This club needs to be completely renewed. I never thought the antithesis to our heyday would have been such a shameful period. I can't think of a club that has suffered humiliation after humiliation the way we have for the past 5 years. It's as though we signed a contract with the devil and for all the glory it bought us we have now received the ugly side of the deal. It's like a nightmare that never ends.
Goodness have we fallen. This club needs to be completely renewed. I never thought the antithesis to our heyday would have been such a shameful period. I can't think of a club that has suffered humiliation after humiliation the way we have for the past 5 years. It's as though we signed a contract with the devil and for all the glory it bought us we have now received the ugly side of the deal. It's like a nightmare that never ends.
Richard.H
Senior Member
It's not as bad as you say it is, just that the gap between us and CL teams is too big. A complete rebuild should happen soon. By complete I mean remove all remnants of the Pep and Lucho team, remove Dembele, Griezmann, Lenglet too. All those players have Champions League PTSD now. Start fresh and play 11 youngsters out there.
This is the only way to develop something new and hope that the players can adapt to the modern game. Can't teach an old dog new tricks. Need to start fresh.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Some will call me a pessimist, but this is just a beginning.
We don't have the money and Messi is done.
For La Liga, we are so-so.
Without Messi, we will probably be 2nd-3rd-4th in La liga for a few years.
Our team and some young guys are not that bad, but Pedri, Mingueza and Dest won't be winning titles until we build a new team with 2-3 new superstars like Rivaldo, Ronaldinho or Messi.
And since we have 1B of debt paired with a fact that usually only 1 out of 3 big money signings turn into a success = that means we will need at least 2-3-4 years to build a nice team.
And again: how, if we don't have money.
Fati, Pedri, Puig alone are nowhere good enough without superstars.
That is about La Liga.
In a CL, it is even worse.
Against Alaves, we can play Pedri, Puig, Dest and Mingueza.
But a CL is a few levels up, with way better opponents and where experience matters a lot.
So, even if our kids are showing some good displays in La Liga, it won't happen in a CL for years.
Pedri and co will need years to gain experience and again: how to buy superstars?
This part is not even connected with coaches.
Even Pep or Klopp wouldn't turn this team into a CL contender for at least 2-3 years.
About your comment about a deal with the devil, imo, since 2012 we are paying the price of our success.
Everything since 2012 is a huge downfall, except 2015 where we had one final "the last dance" type of a season.
In that sense, imo, EV was not shit.
He had a dying, ageing, complacent squad and at least managed to milk a few titles out of them.
Lucho before him, and SEVERAL coaches after him won't win any titles.
EV was not awesome.
But he was a smart, experienced coach who knew how shitty and physically&mentally drained team he has.
In the last few years, it seems that there are only two options:
1. Play more eye pleasing like Setien and Koeman = you won't win La liga and you'll concede 8 in a CL
2. Or play EV's way
The last 2 years reminds me a lot on Gaspart's era.
We are lately as equally as lost as back then.
Except that back then we were never conceding this much in a CL.
CL wise, this is mentally the worst Barca which I have seen in 25 years.
Insane mental midgets.
A team without leaders, spine or any mental strength.
Guys who know how to play ONLY when thinfs are going well.
Yet some posters still look only at passing and technique on young players.
Barca DNA skills will never work unless you have mental strength and fighting spirit.
Or if you are twice as good as your opponents, like in Messi, Xavi, Iniesta days.
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putogusiluz8
The Pale One
"In our job, if you are two years wrong by buying players, you have a big problem- in a big club. And Barcelona is wrong by more than two years." -Arsene Wenger
putogusiluz8
The Pale One
Absolutely. Our biggest shortcoming is our weak mentality. It's infuriating to watch us inevitably crumble in big matches. Our players are incredibly short-sighted, the inevitable ass rapage is on the horizon clear for everyone to see and no one shows any grit whatsoever, or attemps anything bold - something that lets the opponent we will not lay down. To hell with the simplicity, extraordinary circumstances require extraordinary measures. Be bold for fuck sakes. Yet we have lulled ourselves into this perpetual "safe zone" and when we find ourselves pushed out it we freeze completely. Where did this mentality come from?
By far the most shameful aspect of these losses is this. The old madman Maradona was right when he said "Messi did not have the character of leader." You lead by example, if i see my team is crumbling you best believe i'm putting talent to the side and i'm gonna show you that passion, desire and grit also wins games. You might kill me but I'm hurting you on the way down. We have had no one who posseses this mentality.
When Puyol and Xavi retired we stopped having a leader.
BarcaOG
Banned
Messigician
Senior Member
This
BarcaOG
Banned
sir CL calamity, icon of all the beta meme fans who idolize failure
Messigician
Senior Member
Facts
Messigician
Senior Member
Notice you're one of the few who still blames Valverde
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