Frenkie de Jong

[khaled_a_d]

Khaled, Liverpool's front 3 didn't cost them 100m. per player. How much did Salah, Mane, Firmino cost? 100m all 3 probably. That's what we need to do. Get the players who are likely to make the next step. Hard working players without star status who will work hard to overcome the obstacles.

But, more importantly, get a manager who can help them develop, because it would be foolish to think Liverpool would be where they are now with an average Joe managing those players.

They cost more than 100M, and if they were sold after the Neymar/Mpabbe deals they would have cost 250 in the market. Mane and Salah were expensive signings. Alison was most expensive GK in history when signing was made, same for Van Dijk. Kaita was overpriced for them and many thinks he is sort of their own Dembele.
It is important to spend big but you have to spend right, you can't do one and forget the other.
Suarez was the most expensive number 9 in the history and no one cares about his price, Gomes was supposed to be bargain deal for future starting midfielder who we stole from Juve/Manu/RM
FDJ was money well spent, Arthur too if he stays healthy even if he turns as 4th great midfielder. It isn't about the cost tbh, it is bout being worth it for the team.



That is why you need a sporting project, a guy who is able to scout and connect the dots. That is why I always talk about sporting project, this is where you start.
I think Txiki was the unsung-hero of Barca brilliance, his impact to this club might be even larger than Pep/Rijkaard/Laporta. People forget he played influential role in convincing both Laporta and Pep for the later's hiring. He knew how to build the team and was even willing to take responsibility when manager wants to fuck up -cough Adebayor cough- or take his ego for sake of pleasing manager (Ibra when he wanted Villa).
Managers are essential part of that, but as you finally starting to understand, they are still employees and have bosses who will give or take authority from them.

Managers need quality players, and sometimes managers aren't even aware of the quality of the player they want, Ibra & Chygrynskiy deals were prime example of that. Pep 2008-2011 was probably greatest coach our generations have witnessed and yet he thought those 2 are great for his game when they clearly was bad fit. Klopp for example talked plenty of time of the scouting departments who give their ok before any signings, they tell him he fits the criteria he wants in a player. Pep now works in more harmony with his SD, I guess that is where experience plays a role.

Now back to Frenkie, he is a guy who has the potential to be a "core" player for the team. A player who makes things easier for his teammates and manager and add flexibility to the team rather than being a tactical dilemma like we have with many of our players. He isn't their yet and that is fine considering his age and the fact that he is still developing.

Only thing I hate about him;is the fact he was openly against EV, I know I know EV was the devil, but he is a professional player, a starter -if not a star- in the team and to semi-openly be
against the manager on social media because you doesn't like him isn't professional IMHO. I don't like that mentality. Even if you don't like your boss suck it up and work as hard as you can. Don't act like a salty teen girl who had a break up. It makes me feel he might turn into next generation club de amigo.

 

[JPM85]

Barca will need to make a shift towards basics and get rid of parts of possession and trade it for a faster, more direct, more vertical and more risky game.

....

What Setien is doing, seems to be another step in the wrong direction with even more possession and even less risks and a killer punch in the final third.
And also, how we are building our team (too many sterile, build-up based midfielders and attackers) is also not the right direction.

Absoletely agree. I see a lot of parts you post I disagree on but too lazy to post, but this is spot on
We need to play faster, we need movement and we need a lot more players who want to play here not only for the pay check and weather.

Looking at the Valencia game, their built up and combinations where that much faster towards our goal and gave them 8/9 direct changes versus 2 of us.
The only time our possession play is helpful is when we are leading the game and we want to tire the opposition.
I do believe tho that Griezmann shows the correct spirit for the game. He works his ass of, doesn't stand still all the time and seeks combinations.
There is some connection between Griezmann & FDJ happening that I noticed the last months, first 2 players that dare to pass by Messi when seeing better opportunities.

Reason for me that I would like R. Koeman as our next coach. He had enough failures in the past on which he had learned a great deal, is a past star who has direct respect from the players and dares to challenge the way our current system is (plays double pivot in NL squad, because it accomodates FDJ best).

 

[Riordon]

Its actually funny because I used to think that Txiki was a bad director in 2008. Oh how I was wrong.

I agree with you Khaled that Txiki role in the Pep years is probably underestimated.

 

[Sultan]

Could use a goal or few assists in this game.

 

[te amo barca]

He was poor. Not in a very great form in 2020 so far.

 

[Hardy]

Busi is ruining him

 

[Sailor Mars]

Might just be a guy who plays better when there is more movement around him. Ajax last year played a more total-football style with lots of movement and interchange of positions between players. Barca play a more static, and mostly sterile possession style.

 

[FinBarcelonafan]

Might just be a guy who plays better when there is more movement around him. Ajax last year played a more total-football style with lots of movement and interchange of positions between players. Barca play a more static, and mostly sterile possession style.

Who actually plays better in Barcelona "system"? Maybe slow ass Suarez and lazy Messi.

 

[mc_lovin]

We need him making runs though (aka taking far too offensive positions). Vidal and him are the only ones capable of doing these, especially with Griezmann, Messi and Fati up front. Hes just a support player right now.

Next season we hopefully give him full control of our midfield.

 

[BBZ8800]

Next season we hopefully give him full control of our midfield.

What control of midfield?

He can control workrate, off the ball movement, getting the ball from the back and press resistance.
In the attacking area and in the attacking third, both him and Arthur are braindead, scared and without any natural attacking instincts.

We can only hope that he will improve at defending and positioning and turn into a good defensive midfielder who can bring the ball into the attacking half.
For attacking, creation and making some impact in the attacking 3rd, we will need to buy midfielders with a different profile.

 

[serghei]

Agreed. We need to sign a box to box midfielder who would contribute in attack while not being terrible in defense either. De Jong will be playing deeper, without too much attacking input.

Main strong points of that player would be: athleticism, power, shooting ability, stamina, creativity in the final 3rd.

 

[clemente]

He excells at positioning and passing, he can drag opposition midfielders like no one else, it's just he is played in a completely different position right now, no need to call him braindead

 

[serghei]

De Jong is a top class DM. But he is not very effective in attack. Vidal is by a distance our most impactful attacking midfielder. We need to upgrade that position, box to box midfielder who appears in offensive zones and makes the difference, combining with the forwards. Vidal does that the best. Has the best understanding with likes of Messi, Suarez, Griezmann. Also, he is underrated from a technical perspective. Far from a brute with a bad technique.

 

[Havesaks]

They cost more than 100M, and if they were sold after the Neymar/Mpabbe deals they would have cost 250 in the market. Mane and Salah were expensive signings. Alison was most expensive GK in history when signing was made, same for Van Dijk. Kaita was overpriced for them and many thinks he is sort of their own Dembele.
It is important to spend big but you have to spend right, you can't do one and forget the other.
Suarez was the most expensive number 9 in the history and no one cares about his price, Gomes was supposed to be bargain deal for future starting midfielder who we stole from Juve/Manu/RM
FDJ was money well spent, Arthur too if he stays healthy even if he turns as 4th great midfielder. It isn't about the cost tbh, it is bout being worth it for the team.



That is why you need a sporting project, a guy who is able to scout and connect the dots. That is why I always talk about sporting project, this is where you start.
I think Txiki was the unsung-hero of Barca brilliance, his impact to this club might be even larger than Pep/Rijkaard/Laporta. People forget he played influential role in convincing both Laporta and Pep for the later's hiring. He knew how to build the team and was even willing to take responsibility when manager wants to fuck up -cough Adebayor cough- or take his ego for sake of pleasing manager (Ibra when he wanted Villa).
Managers are essential part of that, but as you finally starting to understand, they are still employees and have bosses who will give or take authority from them.

Managers need quality players, and sometimes managers aren't even aware of the quality of the player they want, Ibra & Chygrynskiy deals were prime example of that. Pep 2008-2011 was probably greatest coach our generations have witnessed and yet he thought those 2 are great for his game when they clearly was bad fit. Klopp for example talked plenty of time of the scouting departments who give their ok before any signings, they tell him he fits the criteria he wants in a player. Pep now works in more harmony with his SD, I guess that is where experience plays a role.

Now back to Frenkie, he is a guy who has the potential to be a "core" player for the team. A player who makes things easier for his teammates and manager and add flexibility to the team rather than being a tactical dilemma like we have with many of our players. He isn't their yet and that is fine considering his age and the fact that he is still developing.

Only thing I hate about him;is the fact he was openly against EV, I know I know EV was the devil, but he is a professional player, a starter -if not a star- in the team and to semi-openly be
against the manager on social media because you doesn't like him isn't professional IMHO. I don't like that mentality. Even if you don't like your boss suck it up and work as hard as you can. Don't act like a salty teen girl who had a break up. It makes me feel he might turn into next generation club de amigo.

Where did you see Frenkie openly being against EV?

 

[Havesaks]

De Jong is a top class DM. But he is not very effective in attack. Vidal is by a distance our most impactful attacking midfielder. We need to upgrade that position, box to box midfielder who appears in offensive zones and makes the difference, combining with the forwards. Vidal does that the best. Has the best understanding with likes of Messi, Suarez, Griezmann. Also, he is underrated from a technical perspective. Far from a brute with a bad technique.

Wouldn't Pogba or Kante be the best fit? Pogba would be possible. If he did cost 130m last summer, he wonuldnt cost more than 100m now.