Ivan Rakitić
- Thread starter Barcaman
- Start date
Potroh
New member
BBZ and agendas??? How dare you!
But I also have an agenda... Wanna know how TALL BBZ is...
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Because people are not honest here.
So:
1. we have seen that Frenkie-Roberto-Alena played better than any lineup in a preseason, fine
2. but also, we have seen that Frenkie worked way better with Roberto and Alena than with Arthur. Yet, people don't want to hear that.
I mean, 82 guys came to comment: no Raki=we played good.
But again, how our fluidity died once when the most desired midfield pair: Frenkie-Arthur started to play=we don't want to hear that.
Or, We will hear replies: it was their first match, give them time.
But then, is it fair to reply equally: but then, why not give time to Raki-Frenkie pair, maybe they will also click better with more time?
Then you will get a reply: no, Raki is shit, the end of story.
So, Frenkie-Arthur should get more time.
Frenkie-Raki shouldn't get more time.
If you get me?
Arthur already had problems with Busi and in the end of a season, rarely played with him.
Because Arthur was occupying the same space and Busi often needed to tell him: move there, go away from me.
Now you have Frenkie, who didn't play with Busi because they share the same position.
And now, we had Frenkie flourished at a pivot with two guys who move a lot.
And then, people have their own ideas in their heads how Arthur is an awesome allrounder, the next Xavi.
Yet, a guy is the best when he plays a double pivot for Gremio and Brasil in 4231, rarely runs into an attack and rarely makes vertical runs. And does absolutely nothing in the attacking 3rd.
People laughed at Raki because Frenkie was pissed with zero movement when he had the ball.
Now, Arthur was doing EXACTLY the same as Raki, or even worse.
Raki at least sometimes moves towards the attack, Arthur never does that.
But people won't laugh at Arthur, right?
Let's give him time, right?
Again, people started to draw conclusions after a friendly, so why not?
After this match it seems that Frenkie and Arthur can play only if Arthur is a pivot.
And then, we will have a slow pivot who is meh in defending and bad against counters.
And Frenkie won't play at his best position (pivot).
If Frenkie is a pivot, Arthur is not moving enough (as a CM) and he will be as frustrating as Raki (for Frenkie).
PLus he is moving too often into areas where Frenkie wants to run to.
I mean, if you watched last season, it was clear that Arthur likes "calma, calma" slow down type of football, where the main thing is to slow down and keep possession no matter what.
Yet, Frenkie likes a crazy fast football, full of counters, through balls, runs and risks.
Not to mention that Frenkie and Arthur play on the same position.
Yet, 90% of guys on forum decided that Frenkie-Arthur is our best duo.
Well, if we have learned anything from tonight, it is that Frenkie will click better with faster guys, who move a lot in ALL 4 DIRECTIONS, unlike Busi, Raki, Arthur.
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DonAndres
Wild Man of Borneo
Well, for starters, the team was trying to build real offensive rhythm in the first half and play effectively. And without Rakitic/Busquets stinking up the place, they did so amazingly.
By the time Arthur and them subbed on they were already having their 2nd water break and the score was 4-0, no one really tried after that and the subs were just thrown on without instruction. You could see because FDJ/Arthur switched positions on a whim, and then when FDJ went to support Coutinho who just ditched the LW completely and started dribbling in circles in the midfield like a blind idiot while everyone sat around and watched him embarrass himself. That was a team switched off, not on.
What's really funny is how you can stand year after year of visibly horrible midfield play from Raki-Busquets-Vidal or Iniesta-Raki-Busquets-Paulinho double pivot. Game after game for the entire seasons and on top of that, the 2 standout utterly embarrassing matches in Barcelona history against Roma and Liverpool. You have no qualms about insisting we use the same failed formulas which were proven to be way out of their depth.
Yet 15 mins of Arthur and FDJ running the clock out in a friendly is enough for you to damn that pair and say it's somehow too dangerous/irresponsible to ever play them together. Hmm.
Frenkie and Arthur are the 2 best midfield talents in world football. Thats why people want to see them together. Really not that hard of a concept to grasp. The rest is specualtion, we will see how it turns out. Maybe they are shit together, but we cant tell now. Thats the point. I will adapt my opinion accordingly.
YodaMaster
Member
Were you not the one licking Ivan’s ass after he scored 2 goals in this current preseason ? Telling us stories about how he is the only offensively threatening midfielder Barca has ? And that despite the fact that dude scored 6 goals all comps for Barca in the last 2 years, which is 3 goals per year lol.
Come on man.
Sorin
Well-known member
Weren't you stroking the workhorse Rakitic and how necessary he is for his workrate, strength etc. and that's what modern midfielders are about just few months ago? I swear I had some really long arguments with you about his uselessness until you back paddled after another humiliation at the hands of Liverpool? You change your tune faster than my 1 year old niece changes diapers.
Jadentheman
Active member
BBZ is a known troll
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Look, I want victories.
If we were without any bias, then the best lineup we have seen this preseason is: Frenkie-Alena-Roberto.
Look, if that midfield will be winning match after match, I have no problems with Rakitic playing 0 minutes in a whole season.
On the other hand, would YOU be fine with Arthur playing 0 minutes, as long as if we are winning with Frenkie-Roberto-Alena?
This was one match.
And even in the first 45 minutes, the midfield was good in pressing, defending and moving off the ball.
But we lacked a connection between midfield and attack.
Which resulted in our actions happening this way:
1. we win the ball
2. we move well and are avoiding press
3. we get into the attacking 3rd: midfielders stop moving and aren't entering into the attacking third: the ball is passed to Dembele or Griezz or Semedo/Alba.
If they do something=awesome.
If not, repeat the same for 30 times.
After 45 minutes, it looked as:
1. midfield moves nice. We have fluidity, legs, defending.
But then: who knows what will happen when Messi will play and drop deep (he will ruin fluidity).
Also, first 2 goals were scored from offsides.
If it stayed 0:0 then, the question would have been: midfield is fine, but we lack one guy who will be calmer in the attacking third and who will act as the 4tf striker. Who will pass, shoot, dribble, and lurk around the box for a chance to shoot.
That guy can be Alena, Coutinho, Raki or Rafinha.
So, you see, we scored 2 from offsides and then killed them.
And people forgot that problem.
But if it stayed 0:0, now we would comment on our forum how we need one guy in midfield (probably instead of Alena) who will be the 4th attacker.
Like Deco in Rijkaard's 433.
That would mean: the midfield was good, but we need some other options in midfield also.
Or, if we were leading 2:0 and we needed to calm down, then the ARthur is a perfect guy for "calma calma" football.
I mean, if we'll play the same team against Bilbao and if we'll struggle from the same problems in the first half: no connection between midfield and attack.
What then?
Will you guys say: let's continue with this midfield or we will need to try something different?
Anyway, 3 guys looked better than everything in this preseason and better than midfield from the last season.
But let's wait for a real match. And referees who know what is offside.
But also, a few other questions:
1. these guys played better than Raki. Fine
2. but, what about Busi?
If he will play, then Frenkie will have to be a CM which is not good. And then Arthur surely can't play. Plus, we will be slow with Busi either way.
3. and the 3rd question, as mentioned before: wasn't this midfield more fluid and faster than any midfield with Arthur in the last season?
Raki and Busi are the old turtles, but Arthur is quite similar to those two, except that he moves more, but only vertically.
If you want a fast paced football like Ajax or Klopp, then the best options currently are fast and mobile players like Frenkie, Alena, Roberto and even young Puig.
You guys are oriented only on hate towards Raki.
But again, how will you solve slow Busi playing?
And equally, very slow Arthur playing?
How ill fast Frenkie play with those turtles?
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I don’t remember having arguments with you.
Also I like the concept of a workhorse in general, and said that Rakitic fitted that mould. There’s a few players that also fit that mould but do it better though, including Vidal in our own team. In the post you referred to I suggested van de Beek as an upcoming workhorse player. I’ve not been a fan of Rakitic specifically in the past couple seasons per se. I’ve made some harsh posts about him in this very thread.
Even at the peak of his powers in 2015 when the likes of DonAK said he was “world class” I disagreed and said he was merely a good player. He had limitations.
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