Lionel Messi - v7

[Arnaez]

Messi used to drop so deep even when he played with Xavi and Iniesta, I think it's a flaw in his game tbh. The loss vs Chelsea in 2012 where he lost the ball on the halfway line comes to mind. He gets anxious and tries to hero mode it when the game's not going well.

 

[Riordon]

When do you guys think he will decide to step down? Im not saying im looking forward to it but when Messi call it quits then a new project can start. Until then, we are Messi FC and when Messi plays badly, then the whole team does because he is the system.

 

[FinBarcelonafan]

When do you guys think he will decide to step down? Im not saying im looking forward to it but when Messi call it quits then a new project can start. Until then, we are Messi FC and when Messi plays badly, then the whole team does because he is the system.

The situation kind of reminds me of the "The Last Dance", Michael Jordan documentary, where Chicago Bulls mamagemt wants to blow up the old successful core. I think they have valid reason but it didn't work out for Chicago in the long run though. Barca has won so much to us and given us insane experiences the past ten years but I think we are at the point, the sooner we change the players, sooner we can become top team again. I know it's not guaranteed and it will take time but we have to face the fact and do it..

And you are right, as long as we have Messi (our Jordan) we can't blow it up BUT we could start moving on from Busi/Raki/Vidal, I think those guys are obvious spot to improve our roster. Then Pique and Alba. Lastly Messi.

 

[Rory]

Drops far too deep and so often his position was basically next to Busquets and the left or right interior. He?s then expecting there to be someone to pass to, realises there?s Suarez who can?t control the ball, everyone in midfield is stood next to him. We can?t continue with Messi dropping this deep he?s genuinely ruining the positioning of the team. Midfielders need to step up and be more active on the ball.

 

[JamDav1982]

Drops far too deep and so often his position was basically next to Busquets and the left or right interior. He?s then expecting there to be someone to pass to, realises there?s Suarez who can?t control the ball, everyone in midfield is stood next to him. We can?t continue with Messi dropping this deep he?s genuinely ruining the positioning of the team. Midfielders need to step up and be more active on the ball.

Barca cant be a top side with Messi dropping deep as much as he does and that is on him as much as midfield.

He cant play as an attacking midfielder in that passing system as just plays it as a second striker even when 40-50 yds from goal and tries to take big risks to open game up but results in ball given away too much.

Personally think Barca should go with the Argentina formation or the intial formation under EV when it was more or less AM, CF and Messi in more free role that other two react to.

That would suit Griezmann and Lautaro if he came and leaves team less exposed defensively.

But folk are fixated with 433 and Barca feel for whatever reason that Suarez has to play.

 

[Rory]

Barca cant be a top side with Messi dropping deep as much as he does and that is on him as much as midfield.

He cant play as an attacking midfielder in that passing system as just plays it as a second striker even when 40-50 yds from goal and tries to take big risks to open game up but results in ball given away too much.

Personally think Barca should go with the Argentina formation or the intial formation under EV when it was more or less AM, CF and Messi in more free role that other two react to.

That would suit Griezmann and Lautaro if he came and leaves team less exposed defensively.

But folk are fixated with 433 and Barca feel for whatever reason that Suarez has to play.

I think a move to a different formation is a must. It?s just whether he actually follows that formation is the issue. A lot of people here think 4-3-3 is the only way to go for Barca but fail to admit we don?t actually play that formation. It ends up being 3-4-1-2

Frenkie paired with a hard working cdm in a double pivot, a box to box cam (griezmann would work there) would be a good start.

 

[Arnaez]

Messi is always play around the right half space no matter where you put him in principle

 

[raskolnikov]

Messi drops when we cant penetrate defence. Which is obvious with slow plodding safe passing.
Then he drops deep and everyone is static, you need neymar type runs behind the defense, or quick passing combibations to get trough it. Semedo aint Alves and Rakitic and Arthur aint Xavi and Iniesta.

So we have Messi at 33 as sole creator and main finisher with an half fit old Suarez assisting and nobody else.
Its not a strong side when you compare it to say Bayern, Liverpool or City.
Even Madrid in transition looks better.

 

[Toecrusher]

We are basically 10 players in the service of Messi. There were a couple of opportunities for Suarez to go for a long shot but then he passed to Messi who was in a worse position. Arthur had an opportunity for a through ball but Messi asked for the ball next to him so thats where it went.

Ofcourse none of this is new. However with Messi now 33, unless this is fixed games like this will be the norm. Only way I see this changing in the short term is if Messi adapts (unlikely), Messi leaves (unlikely), a top attacker/AM with unreal arrogance/confidence joins (none really affordable), or a coach who insists on a different way and that Messi will respect (Xavi?).

The squad issues are a whole different beast. That will take 4 years to fix.

 

[JamDav1982]

We are basically 10 players in the service of Messi. There were a couple of opportunities for Suarez to go for a long shot but then he passed to Messi who was in a worse position. Arthur had an opportunity for a through ball but Messi asked for the ball next to him so thats where it went.

Ofcourse none of this is new. However with Messi now 33, unless this is fixed games like this will be the norm. Only way I see this changing in the short term is if Messi adapts (unlikely), Messi leaves (unlikely), a top attacker/AM with unreal arrogance/confidence joins (none really affordable), or a coach who insists on a different way and that Messi will respect (Xavi?).

The squad issues are a whole different beast. That will take 4 years to fix.

Constantly passing the ball to Messi who is not a playmaker in terms of helping to dictate tempo makes it infinitely worse.

If Messi was trying to dictate tempo, probing for gaps and trying to build that attack of team fine but he doesnt. The ball is deferred to him deep with two banfs of four and he tries far too often to force the game open with a pass or a dribble and loses it.

Struggle to see how Barca build a top team around Messi unless he changes his games which I agree he wont or tell him he has to play in final third a lot more and wait for ball.

 

[serghei]

Messi drops when we cant penetrate defence. Which is obvious with slow plodding safe passing.
Then he drops deep and everyone is static, you need neymar type runs behind the defense, or quick passing combibations to get trough it. Semedo aint Alves and Rakitic and Arthur aint Xavi and Iniesta.

So we have Messi at 33 as sole creator and main finisher with an half fit old Suarez assisting and nobody else.
Its not a strong side when you compare it to say Bayern, Liverpool or City.
Even Madrid in transition looks better.

The problem is Messi and Suarez are old and their fitness is not good. When they stay up, they barely move, so both drop to get the ball. And when they do that, we lose our presence up top. They can score great goals, through their executions, but their basics are not very good anymore.

The midfield is in a tough spot, because for them to make their job, you need a front three moving a lot. And we just don't have that. You could use Messi in midfield, like some are asking, as an offensive midfielder in the Iniesta position, and have another striker up top. But it's a horrible idea for one reason: Messi is inactive off the ball. Just walks. You can't have that sort of thing in midfield. Iniesta was a hard worker. Messi is not. Teams would cut through a midfield with Messi there like a hot knife through butter.

 

[serghei]

You can switch our midfield right now with Bayern's midfield. And I guarantee you that with our slow attack instead of likes of Gnabry and Coman moving non stop, we won't create shit.

Or worse, if we get Liverpool's midfield, just the midfield, without Salah, Mane and Firminho moving so quick and creating so much dynamic up front, and use it with our lethargic slow attack, 80% of the users here watching the game would turn off the TV.

 

[Riordon]

The good thing is that our issue is both easy to see and easy to fix. Just get outlets who can run in behind ffs. There is plenty of them available. The top, top ones on the market right now are Haaland, Sane, Sancho, Havertz, Werner (Chelsea) and so on. And these players are emerging quite often. Just wait and see how good Adeyemi will become.

But it doesn't work with Messi. And of course requires cash.

 

[BusiTheKing]

Semedo might not be Alves, but it's not fucking easy when Messi refuses to be anywhere near him.

 

[wisconsincule]

There’s gotta be a match where he is rested. I’m genuinely curious as to how we will play.

Someone else will have to step up. The default pass to Messi and let him create option will not be there.

I want to say these players can think for themselves and go for goal in his absence. TBD.