Lionel "The Greatest of All Time" Messi V2

Don Juan Laporta Estruch

Well-known member
Recency bias to even compare Benzema with Suarez. Putting too much weight on the CL. It counts sure but it's not the be all and end all.

Benzema was a ghost until he hit 30. He's aged better that is clear but we now know that El Pistol was basically the modern day R9 with his knee problems.

When they were both fit and injury free El Pistol reached a level Benz could only dream of. I'm not sure there is any facet of football that Benz was better in when Chewy was in his pomp at Liverpool and early Barca days. Chewy was simply better at everything and is by a distance clear.
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
Dembele should score but still Messi/Suarez etc can score in Liverpool. The tie doesnt end there.

Even at 3-0 the tie should be over really.

Think Messi v Roma had something like 14 attempts on goal without scoring the year before also.
 

JohnN

Senior Member
still, that dembele chance.. just a disturbing miss on open goal.
let's forget about that though. dembele is shit and we know it, now he someone elses problem.
we could have won that tie despite that. so many things went wrong and it is now ancient history.
Goat went on to win the WC while dembele was subbed in half time in the final. a good felling.
 

Temptation

Well-known member
That day there was something special in the air at Anfield. I knew we'd win the moment we stepped onto the pitch.


We were playing without 2 of our best players Salah and Bobby but we were playing like a team that was possessed.


Nothing could stop us that night. I'm confident we'd have overturned a 4 goal lead too if we needed to.


Call me an old fashioned romantic, but that day it was just Liverpool and Anfield. Nothing else. There was only one team.
 

bismp

Well-known member
All being said, when you look at Messi vs Cristiano Ronaldo, Messi's been the better player by a clear margin.

I'd give Messi:

2008-09
2009-10
2010-11
2011-12
2014-15
2018-19
2021-22
2022-23

I'd give Ronaldo:

2007-08
2013-14
2016-17
2017-18

Missing seasons are close, with neither being that impressive vs their rival.

I'd have Messi up by a clear 8 - 4. It got a bit close at some point, especially in 2018, but since then Ronaldo kind of vanished at the top and Messi took Argentina to great heights.

Ronaldo's Juventus move cost him a lot in 2019 and 2020.
I don't think that CR was clearly better than Leo in 2016/17 and 2017/18. He surely performed better in big games, but he played with a team that was better assembled, coached etc. Evidenced for example by the fact that CR did not score or assist (iirc) both in the SF and the final of the CL in 2017/18 (and in 2015/16 iirc). The rest of the team rose to the occasion. Without the CL, I don't think that anyone would be clearly putting CR over Leo in 2017/18 for example. Though he was extremely clutch throughout the whole KOs in 2016/17. During their prime, I would say:

2006/07 CR >= Messi
2007/08 CR > Messi
2008/09 CR =< Messi
2009/10 CR < Messi
2010/11 CR < Messi
2011/12 CR =< Messi (though arguably this was CR's peak)
2012/13 CR = Messi
2013/14 CR > Messi
2014/15 CR < Messi
2015/16 CR >= Messi
2016/17 CR >= Messi
2017/18 CR = Messi
2018/19 CR < Messi
 

Don Juan Laporta Estruch

Well-known member
I don't think that CR was clearly better than Leo in 2016/17 and 2017/18. He surely performed better in big games, but he played with a team that was better assembled, coached etc. Evidenced for example by the fact that CR did not score or assist (iirc) both in the SF and the final of the CL in 2017/18 (and in 2015/16 iirc). The rest of the team rose to the occasion. Without the CL, I don't think that anyone would be clearly putting CR over Leo in 2017/18 for example. Though he was extremely clutch throughout the whole KOs in 2016/17. During their prime, I would say:

2006/07 CR >= Messi
2007/08 CR > Messi
2008/09 CR =< Messi
2009/10 CR < Messi
2010/11 CR < Messi
2011/12 CR =< Messi (though arguably this was CR's peak)
2012/13 CR = Messi
2013/14 CR > Messi
2014/15 CR < Messi
2015/16 CR >= Messi
2016/17 CR >= Messi
2017/18 CR = Messi
2018/19 CR < Messi
Have to disagree here. Messi was better than CR every year for me. Bar goal scoring, Messi does in one game what it takes Ronaldo 7 or 8 games to do.

And even with goal scoring, Messi's goals are of a far higher quality and he has a far better chance conversion ratio.

I feel you have been influenced by Ballon Dor here. In the old days it used to be about which player was the best individually throughout the season. But when Messi came along this gave France Football a problem because they realised that Messi would basically win it every year and as a result nobody would be interested in it.

Therefore, to milk their cash cow, they started to place more emphasis on team accomplishments so as to sway it towards other players who were not individually as good as Messi during that season, but won trophies like the UCL or league etc. This lead to some farcical situations where people were clamouring for players like Jorginho to win the Ballon Dor.

To be fair it was a brilliant strategy to drum up interest, unfortunately it lead to the mistaken belief that there were seasons where Ron was individually better than Messi. There wasn't. Messi is so superior as a footballer to Ronaldo that he would literally have to play a shit season for Ronaldo to have a chance to be better than him. And he didn't play a shit season. :messi:
 

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