Neymar Jr. - v5
- Thread starter El Flaco
- Start date
Ekul
New member
You make it sound like he doesn't influence games? He's scored and/or assisted in all but 1 of his games this season. And please, please, please don't try and tell me he's a 'stats player'.
Vlom
Previously known as Mehssi
Okey I won't say a thing, he's been outstanding.
I can't wait to see what he chooses to wear for the Balon d'Or podium
Consolation penalty or brace with man extra and game dead counts too in those stats so take numbers with scoop of salt.
Last season he was very good with Messi away, this season he disappeared. He's shown only glimpses of his last year's form and if he continues like this there's no chance for him to fulfill his potential.
Ekul
New member
Okey I won't say a thing, he's been outstanding.
I can't wait to see what he chooses to wear for the Balon d'Or podium
You're entitled to your opinion, so don't be like that... I just don't get why you're so eager to bash one of our best players. Even if he was rubbish it'd be harsh, but he's literally one of our best players. On more than one occasion he's been the best of MSN when he's played this season. And no, he's not better than Leo (or ever will be) before anyone tries to say that. I don't know who you'd want to replace him?
What would your Ballon D'or podium be?
Ekul
New member
Would you not say he's already fulfilling his potential? He's the best in the world in his position and he's probably in the top 5 players in the world. He's never going to be Messi.
Nope. He had one great season with Barca and now 2 months in his 4th where he's been below his reputation and potential.
If you think that beating a dead man with 2 goals or a penalty in next add up to great games you are wrong. They add up to good stats and thats all.
Messi and Suarez deserve it based on performances. Griezmann is a good candidate, carried France in Euro too. Ronaldo won a lot but played bad.
Neymar doesn't deserve to be there this year.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Messi, CR7 (but he should win it this year because of a CL and Euros).
3rd Bale
4th place equal: Suarez, Neuer, Buffon, Griezmann, Benzema, Kroos, Modric, Iniesta, Lewandowski, Neymar.
It is hard to compare players on different positions, but for example:
1. in what exactly was Neymar better than Neuer/Buffon in 2016?
2. in what was Neymar better than attackers like Griezmann (CL final, Euros final), Suarez (La liga title), Benzema (CL), Lewandowski (Bundesliga title)?
3. in what exactly was Neymar better in 2016 than midfielders like Iniesta, Busi, Kroos, Modric etc?
Neymar is the "shiniest" out of these players and has the best tricks and some magic moments.
But then again, since football is NOT only about magic moments:
1. was Neymar's influence on winning Barca's trophies (La liga) in 2016 bigger than the impact of Modric and Kroos in winning a CL (if people will start with Real's lucky draw, then there is no point in continuing at all)
Anyway, this is the difference between two sides probably.
One side probably sees Neymar as the 2nd or 3rd best player in the world.
While the other side sees him as a world class player and one of Top10 in the world, but nowhere near the heights of being the 2nd or 3rd best.
If you are looking at only 2016, what exactly "special" has Neymar done?
1. in La liga 2016 spring he was invisible and disappeared
2. in a CL 2016 spring, he was invisible against AM when we needed his and Messi's magic
3. in La liga 2016/17 till now, what is he doing?
= he is playing well when we trash teams 7:0 and similar, and in all tougher matches or when other teammates played meh, he was always meh also.
You can't find a single game since February 2016 when the whole team played meh and Neymar saved us with a moment of magic with a 1:0 or 2:1 win with a magic assist/goal in the last minutes.
On the other hand, Messi probably had 100-200 of those matches in his Barca's career, when the whole team plays like a crap, and Messi suddenly pulls something out of his hat and decides a match single handedly with a 1:0 or 2:1 win.
Suarez also had a lot of those magic moments in the last 2 years, especially in spring 2016 in La liga when he and Messi saved our asses.
So, is there currently a LW who would be better than Neymar?
= probably not
Are there other less shiny players who would bring some other pros on the table and improve our play in a different way (since they don't have cons like Ney)?
= probably there are some
Is Ney one of Top 10 players in the world?
= yes
Could he offered way more than he is currently offering?
= yes, he could have offered way, way more
Just look at autumn of 2016, when did Neymar stepp up when we needed him (like a Top3 player in the world would step up)?
1. Alaves 1:2, Mia (people will say: but the whole team played poor. Well, THAT exactly is the point. When a 30M Raki or 50M Busi play bad, you expect from your best guy, a 200M Neymar, to pull something out of the hat and save us. You need top players/leaders for that kind of moments. There is no point in having a 200M guy who shines only in 7:0 trashings against smaller teams)
2. Atletico 1:1, Mia
3. Celta 3:4, Mia
Even in other tougher matches:
Monchengladbach, he lost 16 balls and was absolutely horrible (he did make an assist in the end)
Valencia 3:2, 50:50 hot and cold match again
City 4:0, average or not abysmal at best
So, you see, in whole 2016 since February till today, can any of guys who defend Neymar name:
1. ONE match (against ANY opponent, weak or strong team) where he was the man who decided a match with his key move (assist or a goal) for a 1:0 or 2:1 win?
= it seems that a match against Monchengladbach can fit here, where he assisted
That seems to be the only match where he was a key man, even though he lost 16 balls in that match.
2. ONE match against a semi decent team (NOT Celtic) where he was better than just meh/average
If you look at his stats from this season, they look more or less like this:
1. Leganes, Celtic and similar matches: he will score 2-3-4 goals/assist in each match, when we trash teams 7:0 and 5:0
2. in any match against a stronger team, he is totally invisible, a non factor, unable to do any impact on a field.
Or in best cases, he is ok (people didn't need to yell at him too much while watching a match) like against City and Valencia.
So, if performances against City and Valencia are his 2 best displays against good teams in 2016, well then you have to wonder what happened with Neymar?
And you have to wonder how people still see him as a top3 player in the world?
People have quite a low expectations then...
People are probably blinded by assists/goals against smaller teams in 7:0 trashings (CR7's style), like LordLichtenstein and others who will post:
20 matches, 16 assists, 10 goals (or whatever number is) and say: 20 matches and 26 goals/assists!!
And they will ask us (the other guys): how can we be disappointed with Ney?
I am asking you and those guys again: Name a match (or matches) where he was a key man and saved our asses.
Or when was he good against ANY good team after February of 2016?
** I'll add another one: in how many matches he created magic at 0:0 and created a goal/assist?
Majority of his goals comes at 3:0 in the 2nd half, against 10 men, when the opponents are lying dead on the ground etc.
It is not that he isn't good, but he just "jumps in" when a team plays perfectly.
And when others are poor, he can't change a match alone, unlike other former legends or true leaders from random big teams.
Last edited:
snowy
Well-known member
The gauntlet has been thrown down. Ok, I'll give it a go
Just curious, why did you ask for any positive contribution after Feb. 2016?
So looking at the fixtures chronologically after February, we won the 1st 4 matches. I won't mention his performances in the 1st 3 against Rayo, Eibar & Getafe since they were sweeping wins and you specifically asked for difficult matches. So the 1st one that pops up is the match against Arsenal on March 16th, which we won 3-1. Neymar scored the 1st goal, breaking the ice, created chances with stellar passing (02:25 NFL!!! - 07.00 - 07:45 - 08.05 (pass to Iniesta who assisted Suarez) - 08.23 - ) + 08.37 and 08:58 Dang! so close but no cigar. And finally 09:33 not a direct assist but had defender number 5 on the floor which allowed Messi to pick up the ball and score.
So basically he had a hand in all 3 goals in a somewhat difficult match and looked cool in the process.
Does that meet your challenge good Sire?
Funny noone mentioned this (all over the European press btw.):
This summer, the Brazil international's agent, Wagner Ribeiro, claimed the French champions had offered his client €40m per year after tax and that a private jet and a chain of hotels bearing his name would be thrown into the deal.
However, L'Equipe say this information was wide of the mark. Instead, PSG were reportedly ready to activate Neymar's former minimum fee release clause of €192m but decided not to after the player's father got involved in negotiations and demanded the Ligue 1 giants pay the full €45m he owes Brazilian authorities.
Fears of falling foul of UEFA's financial fair play (FFP) rules contributed towards PSG deciding against the move. But the Qatari-owned European financial heavyweights were reported to be prepared to offer Neymar a yearly salary of €15m and a long-term deal.
The players' father also wanted a yearly wage of €25m, nearly €10m more than PSG were prepared to table.
This summer, the Brazil international's agent, Wagner Ribeiro, claimed the French champions had offered his client €40m per year after tax and that a private jet and a chain of hotels bearing his name would be thrown into the deal.
However, L'Equipe say this information was wide of the mark. Instead, PSG were reportedly ready to activate Neymar's former minimum fee release clause of €192m but decided not to after the player's father got involved in negotiations and demanded the Ligue 1 giants pay the full €45m he owes Brazilian authorities.
Fears of falling foul of UEFA's financial fair play (FFP) rules contributed towards PSG deciding against the move. But the Qatari-owned European financial heavyweights were reported to be prepared to offer Neymar a yearly salary of €15m and a long-term deal.
The players' father also wanted a yearly wage of €25m, nearly €10m more than PSG were prepared to table.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
The gauntlet has been thrown down. Ok, I'll give it a go
Just curious, why did you ask for any positive contribution after Feb. 2016?
So looking at the fixtures chronologically after February, we won the 1st 4 matches. I won't mention his performances in the 1st 3 against Rayo, Eibar & Getafe since they were sweeping wins and you specifically asked for difficult matches. So the 1st one that pops up is the match against Arsenal on March 16th, which we won 3-1. Neymar scored the 1st goal, breaking the ice, created chances with stellar passing (02:25 NFL!!! - 07.00 - 07:45 - 08.05 (pass to Iniesta who assisted Suarez) - 08.23 - ) + 08.37 and 08:58 Dang! so close but no cigar. And finally 09:33 not a direct assist but had defender number 5 on the floor which allowed Messi to pick up the ball and score.
I put in the times to prevent you from getting a Neymar overdose
So basically he had a hand in all 3 goals in a somewhat difficult match and looked cool in the process.
Does that meet your challenge good Sire?
When I said February, I meant matches against Arsenal.
So, my bad, AFTER the 2nd match against Arsenal (I know that he was good back then).
Try to find a match after Arsenal's.
This was his last good match against a top team for Barca.
After that, his freefall has started.
(Please don't put Copa Del Rey, Copa Catalunya, Copa of my street and similar matches).
La liga and Champions league, please.
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