serghei
Senior Member
I told you, if Simeone was managing this team, they wouldn't suddenly be crap offensively, just because the manager is making defensive minded calls.
Quique Setien
- Thread starter FC433
- Start date
I told you, if Simeone was managing this team, they wouldn't suddenly be crap offensively, just because the manager is making defensive minded calls.
JamDav1982
Senior Member
No you told me Barca set up like a Simeone team when they didnt.
I have told you exactly how they did not play like a Simeone team and you have not tried to refute a single part of it for good reason.
Now saying they didnt but it is because have different players...
Would rather he went 442 and with a defensive shape and on break.
If that meant even a more radical approach with Semedo LB and Alba LW for his pace and to cover TAA more.
That was the biggest failing of the approach... Barca assumed they would score and did not change approach enough then when conceded they shat it.
serghei
Senior Member
We saw that too vs Roma. Same shit, different flavour.
JamDav1982
Senior Member
Doesnt really have any relevance.
The best approach to scoring v this Liverpool team is to sit in shape and hit on break. Other team have shown that.
Roma was a huge fuck up but doesnt mean it is not right way to play a team like Liverpool.
Counter argument is they played 433 and more attacking way vs Liverpool and lost 4-0. So that clearly failed.
Could say should have played more attacking V Roma and less so V Liverpool. Each team is different.
Barca this year with FDJ/Arthur in midfield and Griezmann on the left would not get done like that by Liverpool even playing 433 in my opinion.
khaled_a_d
Senior Member
1st half in Anfield was the best half from us in that tie, we should have come winners from it but we came with 1 goal behind. 2nd half was our worst in any CL tie since 2013 at least.
We didn't go to just defend, and our attack failed us big time early on.
Defense collapse in goals was something else, and surely coach should take huge blame.
In general EV always had problem with aesthetics of the game. We didn't deserve 3-0 win nor the 0-4 loss. Has it been a 2-1 , 1-3 loss for example (same result, different aesthetics) which were more fair results to how teams played. It would not have looked that bad. Same for Roma games. But football is game of moments and you are judged based on tbose moments.
This aesthetics problem wasn't just in CL,he was able to win domestically but boring football that we aren't used to. This has always lead to him to not being judged fairly.
We will see how Quique does. He looks the opposite, tryong to please fans but far more clueless and less understanding of the game and reality of the team. But still early and he will get more chance to prove doubters wrong.
At the end, EV is now a history and he isn't coming back. Only thing worth discussing is how to benefit from the whole experience going forward
We didn't go to just defend, and our attack failed us big time early on.
Defense collapse in goals was something else, and surely coach should take huge blame.
In general EV always had problem with aesthetics of the game. We didn't deserve 3-0 win nor the 0-4 loss. Has it been a 2-1 , 1-3 loss for example (same result, different aesthetics) which were more fair results to how teams played. It would not have looked that bad. Same for Roma games. But football is game of moments and you are judged based on tbose moments.
This aesthetics problem wasn't just in CL,he was able to win domestically but boring football that we aren't used to. This has always lead to him to not being judged fairly.
We will see how Quique does. He looks the opposite, tryong to please fans but far more clueless and less understanding of the game and reality of the team. But still early and he will get more chance to prove doubters wrong.
At the end, EV is now a history and he isn't coming back. Only thing worth discussing is how to benefit from the whole experience going forward
Messigician
Senior Member
Setien just said he would love to train Neymar. Its happening dawg.
Setien to PSG
Setien to PSG
serghei
Senior Member
There's not much to benefit from EV era. He left nothing behind of note, he didn't build anything long-lasting, all he did was trying to milk the vets even more. Whatever problems we had in Lucho's last season, EV left them even bigger and harder to fix.
Ball is on the board's court now. We need full reconstruction. They seem to be going in the opposite way.
Ball is on the board's court now. We need full reconstruction. They seem to be going in the opposite way.
Messigician
Senior Member
He got rid off the deadwood. Gomes, Turan, past it Mascherano, Mina, etc
serghei
Senior Member
Got rid of nothing. That happens above him. Players who don't perform well or can bring in profit are sold, or traded since forever.
Malcom was a very good player that impacted almost every game he had the chance to play in. Ruined a great squad player we could have used for many years to come.
A player who barely plays, and when he has the chance to do so, scores great goals vs likes of Inter, Real Madrid, Villareal away, is one to keep.
Messigician
Senior Member
Not really valverde made it pretty clear he didn't like Malcom and Turan from the start. I am certain he had input on who should be kept or sold
serghei
Senior Member
Turan was a clear case, man came at Barca thinking it will be easier time than at Atletico. just a bad transfer. Treatment of Malcom was dumb as fuck. Malcom is basically similar profile with Willian, only much younger with brighter future. To freeze Malcom like that and to want 30 years old Willian instead just shows how limited Valverde was as a manager, he only cared about the present, didn't give a shit about the club in general. Truly a Bilbao/Sociedad level manager.
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JamDav1982
Senior Member
To be fair Willian is a level above Malcolm and they are not that similar in that Willian is much better dribbler.
Paying big money for Willian was never a realstic prospect though but would have been a good squad player.
Looked like one of reasons Barca let Malcolm go he struggled when one on one with a player and was not going to be a first team player.
To get money back on him was not all that bad.
Folk used to cry about Mina not being given chances by EV as well. Sometimes players are just not all that great as folk assume.
serghei
Senior Member
Willian is half a level above Malcom only, and he's also 8 years older. Which is a lot. Malcolm proved he should've played more on the field, but he never got the chance and the trust to do so.
No, Mina was a good sell because his value was too high to pass the chance to move him after a great World Cup. Malcom was not.
When Malcom had top games when given a chance, games with goals and assist, he was usually rewarded with several games in a row not getting any minute, that's how fucked up his treatment was. Usually, when a player is in good form, especially a young player, you play him in the next games, at least some minutes to give him confidence. With EV, all that followed after promising performance was loooong periods of bench time. Very good way of making sure a young player never gets a real chance to show his worth. Just play him when some starter is injured (Messi) and bench him almost permanently after that player is back. No matter if he played well in those games.
He never got a fair shot. EV never sensed how to treat the young players. That's why he was so shit at developing them.
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JamDav1982
Senior Member
Willian is the far better player in comparison to Malcolm.
Malcolm was decent nothing special maybe could have played more but EV played plenty of players in their early 20s as well.
Mina at the time he was at Barca had folk complaining on here about him not being played enough... by time he was sold most realised they were wrong and it was a good sale.
Dembele, Semedo, FDJ, Arthur, Lenglet all bought in early 20s and got plenty of time. It was nothing to do with EV picking on Malcolm as he was young. He gave Fati minutes at 16 as well.
Malcolm was a good sale as well for what he had shown and where would of been rated on market.
Malcolm was decent nothing special maybe could have played more but EV played plenty of players in their early 20s as well.
Mina at the time he was at Barca had folk complaining on here about him not being played enough... by time he was sold most realised they were wrong and it was a good sale.
Dembele, Semedo, FDJ, Arthur, Lenglet all bought in early 20s and got plenty of time. It was nothing to do with EV picking on Malcolm as he was young. He gave Fati minutes at 16 as well.
Malcolm was a good sale as well for what he had shown and where would of been rated on market.
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