Quique Setien

[BALUGA]

I side with the managers over pampered veterans who don't want to work hard anymore. 100%. If Valverde had the guts to do anything about the situation and show his discontent I would've backed him 100%. Sadly, he decided to accept these things and act like everything was fine.

Who doesn't want to work anymore and run should get the fuck out.

Sarabia only exercised his job. It's his right to express anger when the players fail to meet standards. Who doesn't like criticism when they play like shit should, again, fuck off. I'm tired of seeing Amigos running this club into the ground. Everybody has to treat them as if they're some sort of gods of football who can't be touched.

If only to put these players back in their place I want a hardman in charge. A manager like Simeone would take chunks out of them. I don't even care about style for now. Just bring someone who can bring back discipline and professionalism, and clear out the elements who refuse to align.

What standard, who's standard are we talking about ? What if the old Barca players can't do what they want them to do. I think those players understand the limit of their bodies are we going to force them to do what we want them to do just to meet the so called standard of Barca social media fans.

 

[serghei]

What standard, who's standard are we talking about ? What if the old Barca players can't do what they want them to do. I think those players understand the limit of their bodies are we going to force them to do what we want them to do just to meet the so called standard of Barca social media fans.

Sell them or let them go. Like Madrid did with Raul, Casillas, like we did with Xavi, Iniesta, and other club legends who got old and couldn't keep up with the standards anymore.

 

[KingLeo10]

I side with the managers over pampered veterans who don't want to work hard anymore. 100%. If Valverde had the guts to do anything about the situation and show his discontent I would've backed him 100%. Sadly, he decided to accept these things and act like everything was fine.

Who doesn't want to work anymore and run should get the fuck out.

Sarabia only exercised his job. It's his right to express anger when the players fail to meet standards. Who doesn't like criticism when they play like shit should, again, fuck off. I'm tired of seeing Amigos running this club into the ground. Everybody has to treat them as if they're some sort of gods of football who can't be touched.

If only to put these players back in their place I want a hardman in charge. A manager like Simeone would take chunks out of them. I don't even care about style for now. Just bring someone who can bring back discipline and professionalism, and clear out the elements who refuse to align.

We'll start competing for CL again when we start putting 110-115-120 km as a team in those games (which we did in the Pep era and in 14-15).

Last 4 years we've been averaging 100-105 km a game tops, home or away.

Effort matters so much in games of these level that it's inexcusable what the group of seniors are allowed to get away with (and lately the younger players too like Dembele, Arthur, Semedo etc. FDJ is the only exception) Bayern's first XI is not of the quality of their heyday but they've been putting strong showings because they finally moved past Robbery and the other deadweight anchoring them down for years and years.

 

[JamDav1982]

Sell them or let them go. Like Madrid did with Raul, Casillas, like we did with Xavi, Iniesta, and other club legends who got old and couldn't keep up with the standards anymore.

Xavi and Iniesta were allowed to leave when they wanted and the same will be the case with Pique, Busquets etc.

Their appears an arrogance in those players and likes of Alba, Rakitic, Suarez and Messi that they have won it all and are still the best around if it were not for their team mates/coaches.

 

[serghei]

We'll start competing for CL again when we start putting 110-115-120 km as a team in those games (which we did in the Pep era and in 14-15).

Last 4 years we've been averaging 100-105 km a game tops, home or away.

Effort matters so much in games of these level that it's inexcusable what the group of seniors are allowed to get away with. Bayern's first XI is not of the quality of their heyday but they've been putting strong showings because they finally moved past Robbery and the other deadweight anchoring them down for years and years.

That is not going to happen until we get rid of the oldies who don't want to work anymore. This is not a question of technique, or ability. Because if that was the case, Messi, Suarez, Pique these guys would still play no issues. It's a question of commitment and desire to work hard again to come back on top. These guys don't have that anymore, and that is why they need to be phased out. They are lagging behind in this area of the game, and athleticism, work-rate, commitment are key in the Champions League.

I would be more than happy to be contradicted, but imo the veterans are a lost cause. They just want to enjoy among themselves and have things easy.

I think there is one more thing that needs to be tried. A last resort solution. Bring in someone who is either a legend and has a big stature in our history, or someone who is a big name in the manager world. Someone who would impose respect either by being a club legend, or by being a recognized successful manager. And someone who doesn't take any shit at the same time. If they still throw tantrums and such, out with the lot of them.

 

[KingLeo10]

Xavi and Iniesta were allowed to leave when they wanted and the same will be the case with Pique, Busquets etc.

Their appears an arrogance in those players and likes of Alba, Rakitic, Suarez and Messi that they have won it all and are still the best around if it were not for their team mates/coaches.

Pique came out with a statement saying that this was the weakest RM he's faced...which is patently incorrect.

You're right about the arrogance. They've won too much and they've been pampered EVEN MORE.

 

[KingLeo10]

That is not going to happen until we get rid of the oldies who don't want to work anymore. This is not a question of technique, or ability. Because if that was the case, Messi, Suarez, Pique these guys would still play no issues. It's a question of commitment and desire to work hard again to come back on top. These guys don't have that anymore, and that is why they need to be phased out.

I would be more than happy to be contradicted, but imo the veterans are a lost cause. They just want to enjoy among themselves and have things easy.

I'm agreeing with you. I would still make an exception for Messi if he's willing to be tactically flexible and actually follow the gameplan of the manager. It's not like he ran tremendously in those heyday years (IIRC it was 8-8.5 km versus 7.5 these days). But the rest of the team has fallen off a cliff in terms of being able to compensate. Rakitic especially. He averaged 12-13 km!! in 14-15 and if you asked him to do that today, he'd probably die.

 

[JamDav1982]

Pique came out with a statement saying that this was the weakest RM he's faced...which is patently incorrect.

You're right about the arrogance. They've won too much and they've been pampered EVEN MORE.

Pique makes documentaries about players not signing for club.

Pique misses training to go to tennis tournaments.

Pique laughs about going out when instructed by coach not to.

Pique tries to tell the club who they should sign etc.

His ego is completely out of control and said it before but the best man manager ever was probably Sir Alex who would bin players for one occassion like that long ago.

 

[serghei]

I'm agreeing with you. I would still make an exception for Messi if he's willing to be tactically flexible and actually follow the gameplan of the manager. It's not like he ran tremendously in those heyday years (IIRC it was 8-8.5 km versus 7.5 these days). But the rest of the team has fallen off a cliff in terms of being able to compensate. Rakitic especially. He averaged 12-13 km!! in 14-15 and if you asked him to do that today, he'd probably die.

That's where we disagree. I do not think any exceptions can be made. The power of principle above all. We are a team, everyone should carry their weight in all areas. I don't mean they have to excel in every area, but they have to at least try and work hard.

Messi will soon be 33. I think it's not a smart solution to build around him anymore. Best way would be to try a diplomatic solution. Reduce his role bit by bit. Start by resting him more, force him to obey the rules more. And in 2-3 years, approach discussion about retiring or leaving somewhere else to make a lot of money, like USA, Arabia or whatever.

 

[KingLeo10]

That's where we disagree. I do not think any exceptions can be made. The power of principle above all. We are a team, everyone should carry their weight in all areas. I don't mean they have to excel in every area, but they have to at least try and work hard.

Sure, you're speaking sense and it's not like I feel as strongly about keeping Messi as I did as recently as last season. I'm going to see whether he's actually fallen of a cliff as in recent showings or whether there's extraneous factors at play (assess at the end of this season).

There's also the Messi curse where any incoming player automatically searches for him even when it's not the best move. That actually is almost as big of a problem as the workrate issue.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Pique came out with a statement saying that this was the weakest RM he's faced...which is patently incorrect.

You're right about the arrogance. They've won too much and they've been pampered EVEN MORE.

Don't think it was arrogance, I thought it was indirect criticism to the club, that even weakest RM in years beaten us and dominated us in 2nd half.

 

[serghei]

Sure, you're speaking sense and it's not like I feel as strongly about keeping Messi as I did as recently as last season. I'm going to see whether he's actually fallen of a cliff as in recent showings or whether there's extraneous factors at play (assess at the end of this season).

There's also the Messi curse where any incoming player automatically searches for him even when it's not the best move. That actually is almost as big of a problem as the workrate issue.

Sure, and even if I'm sometimes overly blunt, this is a really sensitive issue that needs to be treated with intelligence and tact by the future board. It's not like you tell Messi, that's it, pack your bags and out. But his role and influence need to seriously be reduced. And for everybody's sake they should have a talk with him and set these things.

 

[JamDav1982]

Don't think it was arrogance, I thought it was indirect criticism to the club, that even weakest RM in years beaten us and dominated us in 2nd half.

The arrogance is Pique not realising he was a fairly big part in the defeat and that he is part of an old clique that has too much power.

His behaviour is awful and no top coach worth their salt would put up with him.

 

[KingLeo10]

Don't think it was arrogance, I thought it was indirect criticism to the club, that even weakest RM in years beaten us and dominated us in 2nd half.

RM was weaker last season by nearly all metrics. We destroyed them effortlessly in 3 of the 4 Clasicos.

ZZ at the helm instead of Lope or Solari alone is a huge boost.

 

[serghei]

The arrogance is Pique not realising he was a fairly big part in the defeat and that he is part of an old clique that has too much power.

His behaviour is awful and no top coach worth their salt would put up with him.

One of the reasons why I don't want a new manager where the Barca job is their lifetime dream. I want somebody who's stature in world football is very solid and very influential without Barcelona. When your dream is coming true, humans tend to idealize that dream and in the process end up stepping on the very principles they believe in. Normally, in a healthy environment that wouldn't be an issue. But a troublesome environment filled with problematic veterans can always find ways to exploit that weakness.

I want someone who is rich already, and who if fired by Barcelona would casually move somewhere else and still land a top job at a big club. That's not a very long list.