Raheem Sterling

Hatem Ben Arfa

New member
who would want to go to a club where the fans are likely to turn against you, even if you score the decisive goals in 2 Champions League Finals including the best ever goal in a Champions League Final?

I think the fans will turn against Hazard so what hope will Sterling have there?

He should stay at City
 

Havesaks

Senior Member
No way city would consider that. Sterling is a perfect fit to their team, young and has wc quality while bale is injury prone (1/2 games), old and on extremly high wages while also not good a fit to peps favorite player profile. Bales market value is 20-30m, while sterling is 150m. For city he is worth above that, and I don't even think he would be that good in Real Madrid. Sterling is the player who profits most of topquality coach like Pep.
 

Copperpot

Banned
who would want to go to a club where the fans are likely to turn against you, even if you score the decisive goals in 2 Champions League Finals including the best ever goal in a Champions League Final?

I think the fans will turn against Hazard so what hope will Sterling have there?

He should stay at City

Agree, but i don't think it's even about Sterling. He's under contract for another 4 years and City don't sell their best assets unless they are finished with them, Madrid would be wasting their time, especially trying to throw Gareth 'sick note' Bale in any potential deal too, no club is going to take him on for £300k+ a week for 15 games a season, they had their chance to get rid of him for big money 15 months ago when Mourinho wanted him at United, United would have paid £100m for him back then.
 

Newcomer

New member
who would want to go to a club where the fans are likely to turn against you, even if you score the decisive goals in 2 Champions League Finals including the best ever goal in a Champions League Final?

I think the fans will turn against Hazard so what hope will Sterling have there?

He should stay at City

A lot of players would not think twice and sign hurrily the papers if they had a chance to sign for Real Madrid. Let's be honest here.

Regarding Sterling, City is not a selling club. Real or not, good luck.
 

Copperpot

Banned
A lot of players would not think twice and sign hurrily the papers if they had a chance to sign for Real Madrid. Let's be honest here.

Depends where they are from, traditionally Barcelona/Madrid basically have their pick from all the best players from Spain/Portugal and South America, a superstar from one of these countries will almost certainly play for Madrid or Barcelona.

French/Belgium (apart from Hazard)/Dutch/Italian/German/British/Swedish/Norwegian/Russian etc all don't 'dream' about Real Madrid and don't kick up a fuss to leave.
 
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Newcomer

New member
Depends where they are from, traditionally Barcelona/Madrid basically have their pick from all the best players from Spain/Portugal and South America, a superstar from one of these countries will almost certainly play for Madrid or Barcelona.

French/Belgium (apart from Hazard)/Dutch/Italian/German/British/Swedish/Norwegian/Russian etc all don't 'dream' about Real Madrid and don't kick up a fuss to leave.

Depends where they are from, traditionally Barcelona/Madrid basically have their pick from all the best players from Spain/Portugal and South America, a superstar from one of these countries will almost certainly play for Madrid or Barcelona.

French/Belgium (apart from Hazard)/Dutch/Italian/German/British/Swedish/Norwegian/Russian etc all don't 'dream' about Real Madrid and don't kick up a fuss to leave.

A lot of French players dream about Real Madrid. Especially with Zidane. It is just that Real wasn't interested in any french player (or maybe they were not good enough for them). When they spotted Benzema, it went quick. Mendy this year too. Pogba clearly let it know he wanted to go to Madrid. I have no doubt Mbappé will go to Real at some point too, bar any big injury.
Italian/German/British historically stay at home. Very few go outside of their league. Totti even said it was very hard for him to refuse Real Madrid. The only british who are going outside are the young guns who need playing time (Sancho for example). The superstars either stay at home or go to Real like Beckham or Bale. The good germans are the property of Bayern/Dortmund and recently PL clubs thanks to their financial might (Sané). Real Madrid don't think they are good enough or that they are worth the money. They prefer getting young brazilians because their value will definitely be sky high if they don't flop.

Swedish/Norwegian/Russian have almost no good players. A young Odegaard has agreed to go to loan right and left just because he is at Real Madrid. He would not accept this if he was at Liverpool, for example.
 

Copperpot

Banned
A lot of French players dream about Real Madrid. Especially with Zidane. It is just that Real wasn't interested in any french player (or maybe they were not good enough for them). When they spotted Benzema, it went quick. Mendy this year too. Pogba clearly let it know he wanted to go to Madrid. I have no doubt Mbappé will go to Real at some point too, bar any big injury.
Italian/German/British historically stay at home. Very few go outside of their league. Totti even said it was very hard for him to refuse Real Madrid. The only british who are going outside are the young guns who need playing time (Sancho for example). The superstars either stay at home or go to Real like Beckham or Bale. The good germans are the property of Bayern/Dortmund and recently PL clubs thanks to their financial might (Sané). Real Madrid don't think they are good enough or that they are worth the money. They prefer getting young brazilians because their value will definitely be sky high if they don't flop.

Swedish/Norwegian/Russian have almost no good players. A young Odegaard has agreed to go to loan right and left just because he is at Real Madrid. He would not accept this if he was at Liverpool, for example.

Latin countries La Liga is the league of choice, it’s the European league they watched the most growing up for cultural reasons.

German players it’s Bayern, Italian is Juventus/Milan/Inter, English don’t really travel, Dutch players aren’t really bothered, French traditionally England/Italy.

To back up what I’m saying when you think of all South American legends (Maradona/Di Stafano/L.Ronaldo/Rivaldo/Ronaldihno/R.Carlos/Messi) all have played for either Barcelona/Madrid.

Some of the greatest ever European legends (Cryuff/Platini/Zidane/Beckenbauer/Maldini/Baggio/Charlton/Van Basten/Eusebio/Best/Gerd Muller/Gullit) only Cryuff/Zidane (later in his career) played in for either Madrid/Barcelona.

You only have to look at De Ligt opting for a move to Juventus over Barcelona in the summer and you don't see the likes of De Bruyne (best midfielder in the world) ever coming out saying he dreams of Madrid, because being from Belgium he doesn't, same with Van Dijk (best defender in the world).
 
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Newcomer

New member
Latin countries La Liga is the league of choice, it’s the European league they watched the most growing up for cultural reasons.

German players it’s Bayern, Italian is Juventus/Milan/Inter, English don’t really travel, Dutch players aren’t really bothered, French traditionally England/Italy.

To back up what I’m saying when you think of all South American legends (Maradona/Di Stafano/L.Ronaldo/Rivaldo/Ronaldihno/R.Carlos/Messi) all have played for either Barcelona/Madrid.

Some of the greatest ever European legends (Cryuff/Platini/Zidane/Beckenbauer/Maldini/Baggio/Charlton/Van Basten/Eusebio/Best/Gerd Muller/Gullit) only Cryuff/Zidane (later in his career) played in for either Madrid/Barcelona.

You only have to look at De Ligt opting for a move to Juventus over Barcelona in the summer and you don't see the likes of De Bruyne (best midfielder in the world) ever coming out saying he dreams of Madrid, because being from Belgium he doesn't, same with Van Dijk (best defender in the world).

French traditionnaly go to PL because PL clubs like L1 players profile. L1 being highly physical means they would not suffer too much from the intensity of PL. Also, french players have almost never any wish to leave a legacy in their country or club (except for Mbappé recently) and they like the money. Ofc, they jump ship when even midtable clubs come knocking because the money is off the chart in PL compared to your average french club. French used to have a relationship with Italy (Juventus has a great tradition with top french players) when Calcio was the most powerful and richest league. Not anymore. French will go where the money is in majority. Only the best of best can have their pick and be able to attract the eye of Real/Barça (except recently with the catalan club willingness to buy cheap young french players).

Any french player would love to go to Barça or Real but they know they have no chance. When they have the chance, they will not let that chance pass. Varane at 19 didn't hesitate to go to Real. Benzema didn't hesitate either. Dembélé went AWOL to earn his move.
You have to understand that Zidane is a french legend and it has deeply influenced young players. Even Eden Hazard while not french (but being in France from very young age) has been a fan of Zidane and Real.

Football has greatly changed from the times of your legends list. Especially the economics behind the game. PL is the richest league and only few clubs can be relevant or even be more appealing than PL clubs.
Real and Barça are the pinnacle because they are the richest club, they are the clubs with the most success in CL in recent years, they are the clubs with CR7 and Messi legacies. The next generation have been influenced and Real/Barça will keep the lead.
Then, you have Bayern in Germany because they are rich and respected club in Germany, Juventus because they are rich and respected club in Italy and PSG because they are rich and only ambitious club in France.
That is all.
Now that it has been established you can see the hierarchy in the mind of the players when Coutinho feigns injury to join Barça, Pogba wants to leave for Real Madrid, Bale and CR7 the best players of the league wanted to leave for Madrid, Henry left his legacy club Arsenal to go win at Barça, Suarez left for Barça, Eriksen who dream to go to Real/Barça, Hazard and Courtois again showed recently they were willing to force Chelsea hand to get their dream move to Real. The only players who are leaving Real or Barça are the unwanted ones (except for Neymar circus and CR7 fiscal problem). Imo, only one club can resist Real and Barça and it is City because they don't care about the money offered for their players (like PSG) but they have PL appeal to keep their players happy even if they choke on CL.

Regarding de Ligt, it is obvious that his end game is Real/Barça later on. Hence why he insisted on a release clause. Juventus was a good choice for him as a stepping stone from Eredivisie and they offered good money too. His transfer is just a testament Barça wasn't as serious in his transfer as they were with de Jong. For the latter, they took a late minute plane and assured him playing time, improved financial deal and secured the deal (wich was even easier since he is a fan of the club).

The only reason Mbappé is in PSG is because PSG had the money, had an ambitious project and he cared about leaving a legacy in France/Paris. If not, he would have fucked off to Madrid already. And it won't be long before he really goes anyway.
 

Copperpot

Banned
Any french player would love to go to Barça or Real but they know they have no chance.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. Footballers are judged on talent, not by their place of birth, so why do French players have no chance at Barcelona or Madrid? :confused:

As for all the rest. I think Pogba just wants out of United or a pay rise, in my opinion his ideal choice would be Juventus again, he only wants to go to Madrid because of Zidane, Zidane won't be there this time next year, there's a good chance it will be Jose and then we'll see how much Pogba wants Madrid.

Hazard - No matter what, as spend his best years at Chelsea.
Henry - Spent his best years at Arsenal.
Eriksen - Spent his best years at Spurs.

But for all those, i can name Viera/Nedved/Davids/Scholes/Giggs/Keane/Gerrard/Del Piero/Rooney/Pirlo, modern day non-latin legends who recently retired who never had any ambition to play for Madrid/Barcelona, even Beckham never wanted to leave United.

The pull of Spain as always been Madrid, Barcelona wasn't all that glam for players pre-Ronaldihno era. Sure Barcelona have had some great players play for the club, but Barcelona didn't have the pull of a Manchester United/Milan/Juventus/Bayern/Liverpool/Madrid pre-2003.

Even the pull of Madrid wasn't as great as what it is now pre-galactico era, after the galactico era 2005-08 they had many players reject them, but got glammed back up 2008-2009 mainly because C.Ronaldo publicly 'dreaming' how wanted to leave Manchester United (best team in Europe at that time) for Madrid and they are still living off that glam now due to recent success.

It will go back to being flat again, if it can happen to Manchester United (biggest brand in football), it can happen to Madrid.
 
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Newcomer

New member
(1)I'm not sure what you mean by this. Footballers are judged on talent, not by their place of birth, so why do French players have no chance at Barcelona or Madrid? :confused:

(2)As for all the rest. I think Pogba just wants out of United or a pay rise, in my opinion his ideal choice would be Juventus again, he only wants to go to Madrid because of Zidane, Zidane won't be there this time next year, there's a good chance it will be Jose and then we'll see how much Pogba wants Madrid.

Hazard - No matter what, as spend his best years at Chelsea.
Henry - Spent his best years at Arsenal.
Eriksen - Spent his best years at Spurs.

(3)But for all those, i can name Viera/Nedved/Davids/Scholes/Giggs/Keane/Gerrard/Del Piero/Rooney/Pirlo, modern day non-latin legends who recently retired who never had any ambition to play for Madrid/Barcelona, even Beckham never wanted to leave United.

(4)The pull of Spain as always been Madrid, Barcelona wasn't all that glam for players pre-Ronaldihno era. Sure Barcelona have had some great players play for the club, but Barcelona didn't have the pull of a Manchester United/Milan/Juventus/Bayern/Liverpool/Madrid pre-2003.

Even the pull of Madrid wasn't as great as what it is now pre-galactico era, after the galactico era 2005-08 they had many players reject them, but got glammed back up 2008-2009 mainly because C.Ronaldo publicly 'dreaming' how wanted to leave Manchester United (best team in Europe at that time) for Madrid and they are still living off that glam now due to recent success.


It will go back to being flat again, if it can happen to Manchester United (biggest brand in football) it can happen to Madrid (2nd biggest brand in football).

(1) I didn't mean that french players can't hope to go to Real/Barça. I tried to say that Real and Barça (less recently with Abidal and his liking of french youngsters) are selective clubs. Therefore, most of them will just settle for Bundesliga for the playing time bar Bayern and PL clubs. It is not that french players prefer playing in England than in Madrid or Barça. It is just far easier. And they know they can join a midtable club in PL, win lot of money compared to a midtable club in a rival league and they'll be easily spotted if they do well. But give them the choice, i'm pretty certain most of them would pick Real/Barça over PL clubs.

(2) Yeah, when they feel like they need the final push/spark in their career, they instinctively battle to go to Real/Barça. It says it all. Despite being legends in their clubs, massive PL clubs (Tottenham not so much), they try their best to go to the very top clubs.

(3) Yeah, you talk about Italian and British who don't emigrate that much and players who were playing for some of the most financially potent clubs. Despite that, let's see what some of these players said about it :

Totti said it was very hard to refuse Real Madrid.
Vieira said this : Vieira himself has admitted he was close to joining the Liga powerhouses that summer.

"I was really close to leaving for Madrid the year before I left" he said.

"I didn't see any reason to leave, I don't know if it was lack of courage to go."

"If I knew I was leaving the year after, I was going to Madrid."


Pirlo : It may be hard to believe that arguably one of the modern game’s greatest regista, Andrea Pirlo, harbors certain regrets about his playing career. Although his trophy cabinet is flooded with domestic and European trophies while dawning the jerseys of two of Italy’s biggest clubs, Milan and Juve, along with having hoisted a World Cup, the bearded wonder did have one wish he would have loved to have fulfilled. In a interview with Spanish media outlet Marca Plus (via CdS), Pirlo revealed that he had an opportunity to join one of the world’s most renowned football clubs but his contract commitments did not permit him to leave:

In 2010, I could have became a Real Madrid player. There was Capello as manager and many players contacted me to try and convince me to go there. But I was under contract at Milan and there was nothing that could have been done to leave. They were 10 years at Milan in which I won everything that could be won and I am happy to have played for three of Italy’s biggest clubs. I am disappointed to not have played for great club like Real Madrid. I would have really loved to have played for Barcelona also.

Gerrard : Gerrard was tempted by Real Madrid's offer

In May, 2005, Real made an offer of 30 million euros. But the offer was rejected by Liverpool, who wanted 45 million euros, plus De la Red, Arbeloa and Javí García, in exchange for their captain. Gerrard, who was holidaying in Ibiza, waited patiently as the tense negotiations between the clubs played out. On July 1, he met with then-manager Rafa Benítez to tell him that he was tempted by Madrid's offer. Four days later on July 5, Liverpool released a statement that said that they had made an offer to keep him at Anfield, but Gerrard was not going to accept the offer because his desire was to leave the club.

Gerrard went on to tell UK broadcaster Sky that: "The last six weeks have been the hardest of my life". However, the situation took an unexpected turn and just four days later, the midfielder renewed his contract with the Reds until 2009.

(4) I totally agree with you on that point but the reality is that now there are some Super Clubs. Real, Barça, Bayern, City, Chelsea, MU, Juventus, PSG, Liverpool.
Those clubs are the one who can afford to attract top players because they have the financial backing. Among those Real, Barça are on a league of their one because they have the most success, the most iconic players, they left legacies. While current players were attracted by previous legacies, the next generation will feed on the current legacies being created.
Current times Juve, MU, Chelsea, PSG, Liverpool and even maybe Bayern don't have that recent legacy. Bayern has had Juup Heynckes treble winning side but it didn't have the impact of CR7 Real Madrid winning 4 CL in 5 years or Messi Barça or Guardiola Barça.
MU has lost their appeal with all their failure to replace Ferguson.
Juve and Liverpool are coming back to their places after years of bad management or corruption scandals. They are the closest to create a legacy (CR7 if he wins with Juve and Liverpool because they are coming back from sporting hell).
Chelsea seem to be happy to win PL from time to time and be a midtable club in CL.
PSG has achieved nothing in Europe under QSI.
City is the english PSG.

Thus, Real and Madrid will keep for the next generations their special pull. Only way to lose it is to pull off a Milan AC (but Real and Barça are too strong financially) or a MU (being mismanaged for almost a decade). And even then, MU can still afford any player in the world.
In a world with FFP which prevents to do a Chelsea (being able to outgun anyone), those Super Clubs, especially Real/Barça, will stay the top dogs for decades.
 

jamrock

Senior Member
I've realized copperpot talks a lot of strange stuff, is the best way I can put it.

If barca or Madrid come knocking, 8/10 players outside of German, Italy & England say yes, because transitionally those players stay home.

But even then there 2nd option will almost always default to Barca & Madrid.

They two clubs are the crown jewels of football

With juve, Milan( if they didn't come shit), Bayern & man utd, behind.

Then Liverpool & the likes.
 

Copperpot

Banned
If barca or Madrid come knocking, 8/10 players outside of German, Italy & England say yes, because transitionally those players stay home.

But even then there 2nd option will almost always default to Barca & Madrid.

They two clubs are the crown jewels of football

With juve, Milan( if they didn't come shit), Bayern & man utd, behind.

Then Liverpool & the likes.

"Almost always" are you just talking recent football or always as in this as always been the case?

If you are under 30, then yeah it will seem that way. But it isn't always that way and won't always be that way. Other than for historical reasons 1990's Madrid had zero pull, until 1998 they went 32 years without winning a European cup.

I stick to what i said originally, Spanish football have had (and will continue to have) their pick of the best of the best superstars from Latin America, Spain and Portugal and that's it, the rest of the world not so easy as players from Asia/Africa/North America and other parts of Europe might be more attracted to football in England/Italy/Germany/France (PSG) or other leagues.

And it's right what I'm saying because if it isn't the likes of KDB would already be in Spain and Spanish clubs would win the Champions League every single season due to having the best of the best, but this doesn't happen.

If we was to do a world 11 on a neutral football forum right now, the collective voice would be other than Messi no Spanish based footballer would currently get in world 11, so La Liga only has 1 player in the world who's currently the best in their area of expertise (GK/LB/CB/RB/CM/AM/LW/RW/CF). If Barcelona/Madrid have their pick of any player in the world 8 times out of 10 then why doesn't the world's best goalkeeper play for one of these clubs right now? World's best defender? Best midfielder? Best center forward? And why aren't they managed by the best manager/s in the world?
 
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jamrock

Senior Member
KDB is playing for the greatest manager in the world so he ain't leaving City, no one join city before pep because it has pull but for the crazy money, same goes for psg.

Lol at the best talent winning the champion league comment 😂

The Old WC XI challenge, haven't done one of those in a while, let's see

------------oblak

--AA------VVD-----?------Alba

--------------Kante

------KDB--------------?


-----Messi----Lewa-----Mane/Sterling.


Pretty even distribution there, I'd go with chielline beside VVD, though he is injured

I think Matip has been better than VVD for a good 6 months too, but VVD is a beast.

Midfield sucks these days honestly can't think of another player to put in midfield, would have put De jong but valverde is shitting all over him right now.

I know Liverpool fans think Allison is the best keeper in the world, but oblak has been consistently the best keeper in the world for a good 4/5 years.

You could make an argument for any of these 4 great keeper
Emerson
Allison
Mats
Oblak

But olbak has just been too good over the years
 

Newcomer

New member
"Almost always" are you just talking recent football or always as in this as always been the case?

If you are under 30, then yeah it will seem that way. But it isn't always that way and won't always be that way. Other than for historical reasons 1990's Madrid had zero pull, until 1998 they went 32 years without winning a European cup.


I stick to what i said originally, Spanish football have had (and will continue to have) their pick of the best of the best superstars from Latin America, Spain and Portugal and that's it, the rest of the world not so easy as players from Asia/Africa/North America and other parts of Europe might be more attracted to football in England/Italy/Germany/France (PSG) or other leagues.

And it's right what I'm saying because if it isn't the likes of KDB would already be in Spain and Spanish clubs would win the Champions League every single season due to having the best of the best, but this doesn't happen.

If we was to do a world 11 on a neutral football forum right now, the collective voice would be other than Messi no Spanish based footballer would currently get in world 11, so La Liga only has 1 player in the world who's currently the best in their area of expertise (GK/LB/CB/RB/CM/AM/LW/RW/CF). If Barcelona/Madrid have their pick of any player in the world 8 times out of 10 then why doesn't the world's best goalkeeper play for one of these clubs right now? World's best defender? Best midfielder? Best center forward? And why aren't they managed by the best manager/s in the world?

You are right about this but it is heavily related with financial clout.

Fans of "historical" clubs don't want to admit it but most of them became giants and historical because they had lot of money to attract top talent. Even very early into the European cup, Real could take away the best players of their rivals like Reims. With money, they built great teams and legacies.

Thanks to the galactico era and the great merchandising by Perez, Real Madrid is back as one of the richest club in the world. Naturally, they have a superior draw as they have the money + legacy.

The player you have mentioned are largely players from the dominant Calcio era. Since then Serie A has declined (and their clubs too) while Real and Barça keep raising their profile. The real rivals of the spanish giants are the PL clubs because the abundance of money is starting to pay off (4 clubs in european finals last year). First, those clubs had players but dumb coaches. Now, they are hiring the top coaches.
Football is kinda simple : money attracts good players and if you can attract a good coach = very good side = legacy = more money
 

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