Should Suarez be dropped from the Starting XI in the CL?
- Thread starter DonAK
- Start date
messi2140
6racies Xavi
Wasn't the point of my post.
This is what you said : Ronaldo has been better in CL though and way more consistent in the big games.
But you forgot to mention that Real Madrid was and still is a team stacked with quality. CR7 was the cherry on top. All Im saying is that if CR7 truly is the better the player in CL then he should have had no problem carrying this average Juve yesterday.
serghei
Senior Member
No. Because today a player's influence on the game is limited. Only Barcelona pretend otherwise. As if giving the ball to Messi can ever replace tactics and such.
Messi, Ronaldo, they can't compensate for much when key things are missing at a team level. They mostly make the difference when they receive very good support from their teammates and managers. Ronaldo did this more often in CL by being a better scorer in big games mostly.
serghei
Senior Member
You're right. More like best front three ever, which is how Messi, Suarez, Neymar were called.
tacticvarium
New member
And Best duo ever? Easily Xavi & Iniesta.
Football was at its peak in terms of the level of tactics, managers, and players in general during their hegemony. The only comparable eras would be 70s Ajax & Bayern, 80-90s Milan & Seria A.
Xavi & Iniesta and Barça & Spain raised the bar too high and now I can't enjoy football as much.
Football was at its peak in terms of the level of tactics, managers, and players in general during their hegemony. The only comparable eras would be 70s Ajax & Bayern, 80-90s Milan & Seria A.
Xavi & Iniesta and Barça & Spain raised the bar too high and now I can't enjoy football as much.
Leo_Messi
New member
Good posts overall [MENTION=15262]serghei[/MENTION] and agree with much of what you have written. Obviously not every single point but the majority.
Suárez's goalscoring form in the CL, in particular in the knockout stage and away from home, is not good enough and that has been the case for far too long but it is not like the seniors (Messi included) or most importantly the TEAM as a whole nor the tactical and motivational preparation of successive coaches (Lucho and Valverde) have set the world alight either.
It is IMO too simplistic to put the blame on 1 individual. There is nothing wrong with highlighting Suárez's dreadful stats but our recent failures in the CL are not down to him missing chances. It is much deeper than just that and there are numerous reasons for our failures in the CL.
I honestly believe that the 2 main issues are mental and a naive playing style that won't win you many CL titles if not executed perfectly or at the highest level as seen during Pep's tenure when all the stars aligned.
We are simply not a hard-working or pragmatic (smart) team. Never been the case. We cannot grind results out. Valverde tried last season and in return we had the epic defeat against Roma. We tend to be very one-dimensional in attack. We offer zero threats from set pieces to our opponents. One of the major strengths of RM in recent years. We are a weak team physically generally speaking. Little threat from outside of the box other than from Messi and Coutinho. Not this season's version of Coutinho. Lack of pace. No tactics other than giving Messi the ball and expecting him to do everything on his own to the detriment of the team and other players. Not hard-working enough without the ball etc. A weak mentality whenever down or whenever having a bad day and thus prone to epic failures and collapses as seen in recent seasons in the CL unlike pretty much most other elite teams.
I have been saying the above for many seasons (since the summer of 2016 more strongly) but it has been brushed aside by most fellow fans (in person) and online. Until lately that is.
The fantasy world that some of our fans have been living in where most of our seniors where what they once were (even when it has been clear that they have been declining for years and thus not the best players on their respective positions any longer) has not helped either. Failure of genuinely strengthening the team likewise as a result of this policy of hiding your head in the sand as an ostrich. Carlo's Milan all over again with the exception of us having much more money, having Messi around and to be fair a more visionary board than Berlusca and zio Fester post 2007. Not that this is saying awfully much on its own.
There is zero coincidence in both Messi and C. Ronaldo shinning more brightly during eras or for teams that worked better as collectives. It took Ronaldo 5 season for him to truly shine in the CL (in other words win) during his stint for RM. Likewise Messi, ever since Pep left, with the exception of the triplete season of 2014-15, have not shinned as much as he used to do under Pep.
No surprise seeing C. Ronaldo struggling for Juve in the CL this season either. Half the team compared to a prime RM if that can even do it. Their respective careers for their countries illustrate this very clearly. None of them have impressed even remotely as much as during their club careers. It's all about the team and collective in other words.
Suárez's goalscoring form in the CL, in particular in the knockout stage and away from home, is not good enough and that has been the case for far too long but it is not like the seniors (Messi included) or most importantly the TEAM as a whole nor the tactical and motivational preparation of successive coaches (Lucho and Valverde) have set the world alight either.
It is IMO too simplistic to put the blame on 1 individual. There is nothing wrong with highlighting Suárez's dreadful stats but our recent failures in the CL are not down to him missing chances. It is much deeper than just that and there are numerous reasons for our failures in the CL.
I honestly believe that the 2 main issues are mental and a naive playing style that won't win you many CL titles if not executed perfectly or at the highest level as seen during Pep's tenure when all the stars aligned.
We are simply not a hard-working or pragmatic (smart) team. Never been the case. We cannot grind results out. Valverde tried last season and in return we had the epic defeat against Roma. We tend to be very one-dimensional in attack. We offer zero threats from set pieces to our opponents. One of the major strengths of RM in recent years. We are a weak team physically generally speaking. Little threat from outside of the box other than from Messi and Coutinho. Not this season's version of Coutinho. Lack of pace. No tactics other than giving Messi the ball and expecting him to do everything on his own to the detriment of the team and other players. Not hard-working enough without the ball etc. A weak mentality whenever down or whenever having a bad day and thus prone to epic failures and collapses as seen in recent seasons in the CL unlike pretty much most other elite teams.
I have been saying the above for many seasons (since the summer of 2016 more strongly) but it has been brushed aside by most fellow fans (in person) and online. Until lately that is.
The fantasy world that some of our fans have been living in where most of our seniors where what they once were (even when it has been clear that they have been declining for years and thus not the best players on their respective positions any longer) has not helped either. Failure of genuinely strengthening the team likewise as a result of this policy of hiding your head in the sand as an ostrich. Carlo's Milan all over again with the exception of us having much more money, having Messi around and to be fair a more visionary board than Berlusca and zio Fester post 2007. Not that this is saying awfully much on its own.
There is zero coincidence in both Messi and C. Ronaldo shinning more brightly during eras or for teams that worked better as collectives. It took Ronaldo 5 season for him to truly shine in the CL (in other words win) during his stint for RM. Likewise Messi, ever since Pep left, with the exception of the triplete season of 2014-15, have not shinned as much as he used to do under Pep.
No surprise seeing C. Ronaldo struggling for Juve in the CL this season either. Half the team compared to a prime RM if that can even do it. Their respective careers for their countries illustrate this very clearly. None of them have impressed even remotely as much as during their club careers. It's all about the team and collective in other words.
Last edited:
FinBarcelonafan
Well-known member
Great post!!!
Sums up our problems very well. We don't look like a team. Bunch of individuals.
Pepe Silvia
Active member
Voted yes. He'd serve us better coming off the bench being in the spotlight having been benched by a junior squad member.
Well isnt it ment for this season? There are no options available. And he is still a top 10 ST imo.
If its from next season, its a bit different, still, with proper rest i would still prefer him to a player like jovic. Who looks good (on highlights) but he will be a totatly new addition, and he will need time to adapt to us and big club football. Also, all tho Suarez maybe havent been that good in CL for a longer period, he still offers a lot in workrate, position, assists, messi-understanding, power off will etc. Yes, he has underperformed in the scoring department, but i dont really blame him for our exit in chl, it was the midfield who underperformed.
If its from next season, its a bit different, still, with proper rest i would still prefer him to a player like jovic. Who looks good (on highlights) but he will be a totatly new addition, and he will need time to adapt to us and big club football. Also, all tho Suarez maybe havent been that good in CL for a longer period, he still offers a lot in workrate, position, assists, messi-understanding, power off will etc. Yes, he has underperformed in the scoring department, but i dont really blame him for our exit in chl, it was the midfield who underperformed.
serghei
Senior Member
A top 10 striker? He's top 3 easily.
Other than Kane, I wouldn't put anyone ahead of him tbh. Maybe Aguero. That's about it.
RIZALDINHO
Member
yes he should be dropped, he has been not playing well recently and he only has 4 goals in cl we should play coutinho messi dembele upfront in cl.since we are going win la liga we are going to be 10 points clear atletico (if we win against betis today) in la liga we should play dembele messi malcom up front. malcom might not be ready to play big gamnes in la liga or cl but this will give him expericnce that he needs to improve as a player
Home of Barca Fans
