Xavi Hernández

[Sumlit]

Please. He protects and distributes the ball as well as ever, and his positioning is impeccable. He has less through balls precisely because deep lying defenses don't allow that kind of passing (in fact, Xavi created some of the rare/best chances in games last season against well-structured deep lying defenses). He never was fast, has always jogged the entire game. Spain was beat by Netherlands precisely because they bypassed the midfield.

The biggest liability is that ALL the vintage Barça midfielders (Xavi-Iniesta-Busquets) are rather slow and dependant on possession for defense. As Xavi ages, this is most likely to be exposed by hard pressing teams who also have technical quality, or fast counter-attackers who quickly bypass the midfield to attack Barça's (as yet still) shaky back line.

Of course Xavi will eventually stop playing. But to say he is in "obvious physical decline" is very perplexing. Based on what? Injuries (not a problem last season, he managed himself well)? Slowing of pace (never had any)? Endurance (still covers more ground than the other players)? The biggest problem people have had with Xavi is OMG!! OMG!! SIDEWAYS PASSING!!- which is what happens when playing a possession game *against deep lying defenses*. Hate the game, not the player.

I'll be curious to see what Lucho brings, and I think Suarez will be an asset against parked buses. Messi is great, but creates goals in very specific ways, and Neymar is also very predictable. Suarez is much more versatile in his striking abilities, and will score some crazy goals, finding half a chance.

You're incredible. For such an ardent Xavi fan, you clearly have no recollection of the way the player played 5 years ago. He simply is slower, less quick, less mobile, and less impactful. This is apparent to all except you it seems. To continue to insist that Xavi plays now exactly like he played 5 years ago is a serious affront to the extraordinary level of play he displayed in his prime.

 

[La Furia]

of course he can't play every game anymore

I'm not sure Xavi himself knows this though, and there lies the problem.

 

[Irish_Cules]

I think last season and the World Cup might have made him realise that his career is near it's end. Of course he wants to play as much as possible, but the fact that he was so close to leaving this summer and that he almost certainly will in either January or next summer makes me think that he knows that he has declined as a player. Lucho has almost certainly been planning the team without Xavi in mind as a starter and I don't expect that to change. He'll still have a lot to contribute as a squad player but the days where he is our main midfielder are most likely over. I really do hope that this is the case anyway because we need to build our midfield for the future asap.

 

[linetty]

I'm not sure Xavi himself knows this though, and there lies the problem.

Rumours say he accepted restricted role Lucho proposed him, which indicates that he finally realised that.

 

[Flavia]

You're incredible. For such an ardent Xavi fan, you clearly have no recollection of the way the player played 5 years ago. He simply is slower, less quick, less mobile, and less impactful. This is apparent to all except you it seems. To continue to insist that Xavi plays now exactly like he played 5 years ago is a serious affront to the extraordinary level of play he displayed in his prime.

I agree. Xavi is nowhere near the player he was at his prime. Still very good, but the decline is evident. But Bernie also thinks Pedro is still as good as he was in 2010

 

[Neeraj]

I think Xavi staying another season to facilitate the transition should be a good thing, but I'm worried about a couple of things :

1.) We all know he has declined and SHOULD NOT be playing as many games as last season, but if he feels he should, he might make it difficult for Lucho to bench him as much as he should

2.) We are in a stage of a revamp. Players leaving, our style has been declining, the tiki taka system, when not played at its purest, has been defeated more often than not of late, it's one of those times you can see a change in the team which will reflect how we play for this next era of players..Will / Should Xavi have a heavy influence on this style? I think you can argue both ways. He's a legend, and our greatest player ever after Messi, and you'd think any advice would help. But some people find it hard to accept change, and he might still cling on to an older system which doesn't work anymore, leaving the team in-between 2 styles and sort of confused..more importantly not being able to make the necessary changes..

Either way, it is going to be his last season for sure, if at all he stays, and it will be so sad to see him go. What a legend!

 

[King Leo]

Xavi can save his energy and be played for those curcial games IMO. I'd trust him more on the field then without him. Besides this is his last year and I expect him to give it all before saying goodbye to the fans. I think he'll have a great season. Good news!!!

 

[BerkeleyBernie]

You're incredible. For such an ardent Xavi fan, you clearly have no recollection of the way the player played 5 years ago. He simply is slower, less quick, less mobile, and less impactful. This is apparent to all except you it seems. To continue to insist that Xavi plays now exactly like he played 5 years ago is a serious affront to the extraordinary level of play he displayed in his prime.

I don't know where to find 'distance covered' stats, but it just doesn't back up your assertions. I was able to find distances for the Barça- ManCity game. Xavi ran further than any other player, made more passes than any other player, had the highest pass accuracy of any player.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...t-Manchester-City-chasing-shadows-Etihad.html

Aging in one's 30s affects max heart rate, max speed, and recovery time, but not significantly endurance, which is the main thing Xavi relies on for his mobility. Eventually, this will decline (perhaps even this year), but the only thing that makes any sense in your assertions is that he is less impactful- *because the role he excels at is mostly superfluous when playing against deep-lying defenses*. You don't need a pivot player to connect defense-midfield-attack when the opponent yields you that territory. You don't need a through ball passer when the opponent is playing 10 players behind the ball in their own box.

I'm not making the argument Xavi should start, *except* where it is the best choice for the tactics Lucho selects for a particular opponent. Against deep-lying defenses, you likely need 1) more height for aerial game, 2) more dribbling attackers to diversify the points of attack, 3) fast midfielders who can run back to defend against the counterattacks- none of which are in Xavi's skill set.

Frankly, Barça was cringeworthy without Xavi on the pitch in 2013-2014. The "direct" experiment was ugly and Barça looked out-of-control and haggard, chasing the ball rather than controlling it, as they have been groomed to do. A more direct game can work (i.e. Dortmund) and be attractive, with the right players in the squad, but this was a complete mismatch with the available talent. As soon as Xavi entered the game, at least Barça had time to gather itself and work more deliberately. Now, under Lucho, with new players, new systems may be possible where the Xavi/Pivot is superfluous. But, if it is ever needed, Xavi still has it. Ideally, you'd want a Pivot with more pace/defending as well as attacking ability (cough-Thiago-cough), but Xavi still has the ability to lock down the midfield when called for.

Oh yeah- Xavi should take free kicks as often as Alves should cross. That's nothing new, we've all hated it for years.

 

[Sumlit]

I don't know where to find 'distance covered' stats, but it just doesn't back up your assertions. I was able to find distances for the Barça- ManCity game. Xavi ran further than any other player, made more passes than any other player, had the highest pass accuracy of any player.

Aging in one's 30s affects max heart rate, max speed, and recovery time, but not significantly endurance, which is the main thing Xavi relies on for his mobility. Eventually, this will decline (perhaps even this year), but the only thing that makes any sense in your assertions is that he is less impactful- *because the role he excels at is mostly superfluous when playing against deep-lying defenses*. You don't need a pivot player to connect defense-midfield-attack when the opponent yields you that territory. You don't need a through ball passer when the opponent is playing 10 players behind the ball in their own box.

I'm not making the argument Xavi should start, *except* where it is the best choice for the tactics Lucho selects for a particular opponent. Against deep-lying defenses, you likely need 1) more height for aerial game, 2) more dribbling attackers to diversify the points of attack, 3) fast midfielders who can run back to defend against the counterattacks- none of which are in Xavi's skill set.

Frankly, Barça was cringeworthy without Xavi on the pitch in 2013-2014. The "direct" experiment was ugly and Barça looked out-of-control and haggard, chasing the ball rather than controlling it, as they have been groomed to do. A more direct game can work (i.e. Dortmund) and be attractive, with the right players in the squad, but this was a complete mismatch with the available talent. As soon as Xavi entered the game, at least Barça had time to gather itself and work more deliberately. Now, under Lucho, with new players, new systems may be possible where the Xavi/Pivot is superfluous. But, if it is ever needed, Xavi still has it. Ideally, you'd want a Pivot with more pace/defending as well as attacking ability (cough-Thiago-cough), but Xavi still has the ability to lock down the midifield when called for.

Well Berkeley man, you just don't want to see it. You watch Xavi play 5 years ago vs how he played last season, and the difference is beyond appreciable. He is a quiet controller now whereas before he was a dynamic and mobile controller. Distance covered is meaningless when we're comparing the rate and intensity of his movements, and not just the movement alone. His game style might still be the same, but now it is more than few notches slower than it used to be.

No one is saying Xavi is a scrub now, far from it, but again, to continue with the blind assertion that he is just as good now as he was 5 years ago is just perplexing when you watched him play both back then and now.

 

[Lomar1o]

when xavi was at his best he was in ballon d'or top 3 list and rightfully so, many times it was said that he deserved one, but no one can say that he deserves any individual award for the performance of the last two years.

 

[KingMessi]

To say that today's Xavi is the same as 5 or even 2 years ago is an insult to Prime Xavi.

 

[BerkeleyBernie]

Well Berkeley man, you just don't want to see it. You watch Xavi play 5 years ago vs how he played last season, and the difference is beyond appreciable. He is a quiet controller now whereas before he was a dynamic and mobile controller. Distance covered is meaningless when we're comparing the rate and intensity of his movements, and not just the movement alone. His game style might still be the same, but now it is more than few notches slower than it used to be.

No one is saying Xavi is a scrub now, far from it, but again, to continue with the blind assertion that he is just as good now as he was 5 years ago is just perplexing when you watched him play both back then and now.

You're the one saying that that is what I'm saying; I'm saying nothing of the sort. What *I* am saying is: 1) the main difference between 5 years ago and now is how teams played/play against Barça, which allowed Xavi a more prominent role in attack then, 2) whatever decline age has brought to Xavi hasn't impacted the basic skill set he uses to such a degree that others are now better at it, 3) any new system that requires a faster midfielder would rightly exclude Xavi, who has never had pace.

As far as "intensity" of movement, that's what you do when the opponent chases you. In most games, the opponent no longer chases Barça, which results in a much slower possession game played around the opponent's box. You are focusing on the symptoms, rather than the cause. Understandable, but wrong.

 

[JamDav1982]

You're the one saying that that is what I'm saying; I'm saying nothing of the sort. What *I* am saying is: 1) the main difference between 5 years ago and now is how teams played/play against Barça, which allowed Xavi a more prominent role in attack then, 2) whatever decline age has brought to Xavi hasn't impacted the basic skill set he uses to such a degree that others are now better at it, 3) any new system that requires a faster midfielder would rightly exclude Xavi, who has never had pace.

As far as "intensity" of movement, that's what you do when the opponent chases you. In most games, the opponent no longer chases Barça, which results in a much slower possession game played around the opponent's box. You are focusing on the symptoms, rather than the cause. Understandable, but wrong.

Xavi has declined and is not just because teams have worked out how to stop him.

His legs are not what they used to be and in the past he along with Alves would be the Barca player that covered most ground. It is almost impossible for a player his age to continue to play that way and to the same standard.

 

[Sumlit]

You're the one saying that that is what I'm saying; I'm saying nothing of the sort. What *I* am saying is: 1) the main difference between 5 years ago and now is how teams played/play against Barça, which allowed Xavi a more prominent role in attack then, 2) whatever decline age has brought to Xavi hasn't impacted the basic skill set he uses to such a degree that others are now better at it, 3) any new system that requires a faster midfielder would rightly exclude Xavi, who has never had pace.

As far as "intensity" of movement, that's what you do when the opponent chases you. In most games, the opponent no longer chases Barça, which results in a much slower possession game played around the opponent's box. You are focusing on the symptoms, rather than the cause. Understandable, but wrong.

No, here's what you're saying

Xavi still does pretty much what he always has, and does it pretty much as well as he ever has

which is untrue and everyone, but you it seems, is aware and realizes this. You continue to blame deep defenses, other teammates and coaches, but continue to overlook the all too obvious reality that simply, Xavi's physical skills have deteriorated appreciably due to age. This is a fact that everyone but you has come to understand.

You are in total denial of reality, forget about symptoms and cause.

 

[BerkeleyBernie]

His legs are not what they used to be and in the past he along with Alves would be the Barca player that covered most ground. It is almost impossible for a player his age to continue to play that way and to the same standard.

FACT: Look at the stats FFS, or simply the link from the ManCity game I posted above- he is *still* the player that covers the most ground, still rarely misplaces passes, still rarely gets dispossessed or otherwise turns over the ball. Of course I agree he has/will decline, but it is a matter of what degree- he is essentially a distance runner who jogs all game. He is not affected in the same way as a player who requires pace, for the same reason top distance runners are often successful well into their 30s. The main difference is that older bodies require more time to recover. With proper rotation *and only where the tactics demand his skill set*, he can still be effective, as in the ManCity CL game last spring where he dominated (of course, they are minnows, right?).