11 - Neymar Jr. - v4

[BBZ8800]

@BBZ8800

So kind of you to calculate those statistics.

But it would be instructive if you did the same with the EPL/Serie A/Bundesliga as well.

It is not just La Liga that is oligopolistic, but all the major leagues.



Edit: And having said that La Liga is a two-horse race (not really during the past 2 years or so) that league at least involves a "race". Other major Euro-leagues are done before they even begin, all of them basically.

Ok. A reasonable argument.

Let's see the stats:
Seria A:
1994: Milan: 19 wins in 34 matches:
-- Goals 36 in 34 rounds, LOL
-- they were champions of Europe, winning against Barca 4:0 in Athens
-- so, champions of Europe scored only 36 Goals in 34 rounds
-- top scorers, LOL, check this stat:
= Massaro 11 goals, Boban 3 goals, Albertini 3, Papin 3, Simone 3
-- so, if you look at current stats, CR7 alone is much better than the whole Milan's team from 1994, right?
-- even Pedro looks better than European champions from that era

1995: Juventus 59 goals in 34 rounds
-- Batistuta 26 Goals from 61 of total Fiorentina's league goals
-- top scorer of champions Juve: Vialli 17 goals

-- let's travel through time:
-- 2004' year:
-- Milan champions, 65 Goals in 34 matches
-- Shevchenko 24 Goals in 34 matches, out of 65 from Milan (League only)

2014:
-- Juve 80 Goals in 38 rounds (so, they raised the number of rounds by 4)
-- top scorer Immobile 22
-- Juve's top scorer Tevez 19

Let's go to English PL:
1994: Man. Utd champions
-- 80 Goals in 42 matches (a lot of matches)
-- that would be around 65 if they played 34 rounds, like in Italy
-- top scorer Andy Cole, Newcastle 34
-- top scorer from Man Utd: Cantona 18 goals

-- let's travel through time to 2004:
-- Arsenal 38 matches, 73 Goals
-- Henry 30 Goals

-- let's travel through time to 2014:
-- Man city 102 goals in 38 matches
-- Suarez 31 goals
-- Man city: Yaya 20 goals, Aguero 17

So, the sample is not as good as with La liga:
-- but you see that richest countries, like England and Spain are changing
-- top teams are richer and richer and much stronger than other teams
-- instead of scoring 2 goals per match, they are now scoring 3 goals per match
-- thus, they are now scoring 100+ Goals per Season, and of course that their FCs are banging 30-ish goals per Season

But now, compare those number to Seria A in 1994:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993–94_Serie_A
-- I mean, even Pedro in the last 2-3 Seasons scored more Goals than any Milan's player from that era
-- with logic how "Ney is scoring more Goals than any other Barca's FC in the last 20 years, except Messi", then we could say that also Pedro and Alexis are better than all players from Milan in 1994
-- also, even Alexis who is having troubles with running and not tripping over the ball, scored more Goals in La liga than Ronaldinho EVER
-- plus, Alexis was close to Rivaldo, lol.

Rivaldo, come on, guys.

Just look at this, Brasilian Ronaldo was trolling with the opponents in every match when the league was much more even, and when we were allowed to have only 3 foreigners:

According to stats from the current era, CR7 is a better player than "the real Ronaldo"
-- imagine if Ronaldo would play today and have 20 years
-- lol, the internet would explode from the hype
-- he would be hailed as 10x times better than CR7 and similar players

Also:

CR7 is a much better player than Rivaldo, according to statpad goals from a last few years?
And Ney is already at Rivaldo's prime level?

Those were different times with waaaaaaay less Goals.

 

[JamDav1982]

BBZ is Messi a stat padder in an easier time to score?

You have tried to set out rules for Neymar he can never succeed in. Score to few and he is not doing his job. Score to many and its stat paddin in an easy era. It's a farce or trolling I really can't decide.

Tell me - what number of goals does Neymar need to score to get credit from you?

 

[Gasgas]

BBZ may you resend your photo, i deleted it accidentally

 

[LordLichtenstein]

Neymar is at 30 & 5 asssists, not 9.

 

[BBZ8800]

BBZ is Messi a stat padder in an easier time to score?

You have tried to set out rules for Neymar he can never succeed in. Score to few and he is not doing his job. Score to many and its stat paddin in an easy era. It's a farce or trolling I really can't decide.

Tell me - what number of goals does Neymar need to score to get credit from you?

Neymar gets credit from me.
He is in top 4-5 players in the world currently (Messi, Suarez, Cr7, Neymar and 2-3 other guys like Reus, Hazard etc)

But what is, imo, insane is that some football fans probably think that two best players who have ever lived are:
1. Messi
2. CR7
-- and that Ney is already maybe one of the greatest players in football's history, and especially in Barca's history.

This post with stats is not actually bashing (only) Ney, but bashing all current players because their stats are seriously inflated.
I love Messi and he is the greatest player ever, but seriously, Romario and Brasilian Ronaldo would surely score 40-50 League goals each Season in current times.

So, NO, current players (except Messi) are not better than players from other eras.
Plus, even Messi's numbers are inflated.
He is the best, but other circumstances like 2-horse-race La liga, more foreigners allowed, much richer Barca today, also inflated his stats, as can be seen in CR7's numbers.

So:
Point of my post is:
-- best players in the world TODAY are:
-- Messi, Cr7, Suarez, Ney etc

But best players of all time are:
-- Messi, Brasilian Ronaldo, Maradona, Ronaldinho, Rivaldo, Cruijff etc
-- imo, CR7 is not even close to these guys above, even though he has much better stats. Again, I explained why he has inflated stats.
-- the same about Ney, he is awesome and already in Top 4-5 players in the world today, but posts how he is better than more or less any Barca's attacker in the last 20 years (except Messi) are just like: wtf have I just read?

Some fans are acting as if football's history started in 2009 or in 2013, and as if all football legends from history are nothing compared to current football gods.

 

[Vlom]

And here we go again .. nothing is good enough!

Neymar, since BBZ thinks you're read barcaforum haha, please do not care for his bashing, he just doesn't like you because you're rich, beautiful, and an excellent footballer

Seriously, Neymar is being wonderfull for us, hope he keeps it up, he was amazing in defence, he was amazing in offense, he was amazing against city in camp nou but still didn't score, goals aren't everything.

Please guys, let's not fill a new thread with hundreds of pages of false data and arguments.

 

[JamDav1982]

Neymar gets credit from me.
He is in top 4-5 players in the world currently (Messi, Suarez, Cr7, Neymar and 2-3 other guys like Reus, Hazard etc)

But what is, imo, insane is that some football fans probably think that two best players who have ever lived are:
1. Messi
2. CR7
-- and that Ney is already maybe one of the greatest players in football's history, and especially in Barca's history.

This post with stats is not actually bashing (only) Ney, but bashing all current players because their stats are seriously inflated.
I love Messi and he is the greatest player ever, but seriously, Romario and Brasilian Ronaldo would surely score 40-50 League goals each Season in current times.

So, NO, current players (except Messi) are not better than players from other eras.
Plus, even Messi's numbers are inflated.
He is the best, but other circumstances like 2-horse-race La liga, more foreigners allowed, much richer Barca today, also inflated his stats, as can be seen in CR7's numbers.

So:
Point of my post is:
-- best players in the world TODAY are:
-- Messi, Cr7, Suarez, Ney etc

But best players of all time are:
-- Messi, Brasilian Ronaldo, Maradona, Ronaldinho, Rivaldo, Cruijff etc
-- imo, CR7 is not even close to these guys above, even though he has much better stats. Again, I explained why he has inflated stats.
-- the same about Ney, he is awesome and already in Top 4-5 players in the world today, but posts how he is better than more or less any Barca's attacker in the last 20 years (except Messi) are just like: wtf have I just read?

Some fans are acting as if football's history started in 2009 or in 2013, and as if all football legends from history are nothing compared to current football gods.

BBZ you are doing what you usually do and manufacturing an argument to argue against Neymar.

No one is saying goals solely determines the best players.

Can you tell me what Neymar needs to do to get credit for goal soring?

 

[Kuchi]

Is it just me or did he start defending a little bit, at least trying to get in the way of the attacking winger...

 

[Vlom]

BBZ you are doing what you usually do and manufacturing an argument to argue against Neymar.

No one is saying goals solely determines the best players.

Can you tell me what Neymar needs to do to get credit for goal soring?

I think if his face gets burned and he's not sexy enough anymore to be in ads and on instagram then BBZ will start seing him as a footballer, other than that, I'm guessing the hate is gonna continue even if Neymar scores 100goals a season.

 

[Topolino]

Neymar gets credit from me.
He is in top 4-5 players in the world currently (Messi, Suarez, Cr7, Neymar and 2-3 other guys like Reus, Hazard etc)

But what is, imo, insane is that some football fans probably think that two best players who have ever lived are:
1. Messi
2. CR7
-- and that Ney is already maybe one of the greatest players in football's history, and especially in Barca's history.

This post with stats is not actually bashing (only) Ney, but bashing all current players because their stats are seriously inflated.
I love Messi and he is the greatest player ever, but seriously, Romario and Brasilian Ronaldo would surely score 40-50 League goals each Season in current times.

So, NO, current players (except Messi) are not better than players from other eras.
Plus, even Messi's numbers are inflated.
He is the best, but other circumstances like 2-horse-race La liga, more foreigners allowed, much richer Barca today, also inflated his stats, as can be seen in CR7's numbers.

So:
Point of my post is:
-- best players in the world TODAY are:
-- Messi, Cr7, Suarez, Ney etc

But best players of all time are:
-- Messi, Brasilian Ronaldo, Maradona, Ronaldinho, Rivaldo, Cruijff etc
-- imo, CR7 is not even close to these guys above, even though he has much better stats. Again, I explained why he has inflated stats.
-- the same about Ney, he is awesome and already in Top 4-5 players in the world today, but posts how he is better than more or less any Barca's attacker in the last 20 years (except Messi) are just like: wtf have I just read?

Some fans are acting as if football's history started in 2009 or in 2013, and as if all football legends from history are nothing compared to current football gods.

So you are telling us that IF Cruijff, Maradona, Rivaldo, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho etc etc were to play now, they would have higher stats? Maybe
So you are telling us that IF Cristiano Ronaldo, Neymar, Hazard, Reus, Suarez etc etc were to play at the time those mentioned above played, they wouldn't have had stats atleast as good as the players mentioned above?

You're arguing over things that can not be argued about in a meaningful way without a time machine.

Statistics isn't football. If football were statistics, teams would be lead by a computer geek with an excel sheet.

 

[Vlom]

Is it just me or did he start defending a little bit, at least trying to get in the way of the attacking winger...

Of course he did, in both games against PSG he defended well.

Both him and suarez were running everywhere yesterday.

 

[pacp_96]

Is it just me or did he start defending a little bit, at least trying to get in the way of the attacking winger...

Yeah I thought he was fantastic defensively. Great workrate from him last night.

 

[klc123]

So you are telling us that IF Cruijff, Maradona, Rivaldo, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho etc etc were to play now, they would have higher stats? Maybe
So you are telling us that IF Cristiano Ronaldo, Neymar, Hazard, Reus, Suarez etc etc were to play at the time those mentioned above played, they wouldn't have had stats atleast as good as the players mentioned above?

You're arguing over things that can not be argued about in a meaningful way without a time machine.

Statistics isn't football. If football were statistics, teams would be lead by a computer geek with an excel sheet.

 

[ZenI]

Neymar gets credit from me.
He is in top 4-5 players in the world currently (Messi, Suarez, Cr7, Neymar and 2-3 other guys like Reus, Hazard etc)

But what is, imo, insane is that some football fans probably think that two best players who have ever lived are:
1. Messi
2. CR7
-- and that Ney is already maybe one of the greatest players in football's history, and especially in Barca's history.

This post with stats is not actually bashing (only) Ney, but bashing all current players because their stats are seriously inflated.
I love Messi and he is the greatest player ever, but seriously, Romario and Brasilian Ronaldo would surely score 40-50 League goals each Season in current times.

So, NO, current players (except Messi) are not better than players from other eras.
Plus, even Messi's numbers are inflated.
He is the best, but other circumstances like 2-horse-race La liga, more foreigners allowed, much richer Barca today, also inflated his stats, as can be seen in CR7's numbers.

So:
Point of my post is:
-- best players in the world TODAY are:
-- Messi, Cr7, Suarez, Ney etc

But best players of all time are:
-- Messi, Brasilian Ronaldo, Maradona, Ronaldinho, Rivaldo, Cruijff etc
-- imo, CR7 is not even close to these guys above, even though he has much better stats. Again, I explained why he has inflated stats.
-- the same about Ney, he is awesome and already in Top 4-5 players in the world today, but posts how he is better than more or less any Barca's attacker in the last 20 years (except Messi) are just like: wtf have I just read?

Some fans are acting as if football's history started in 2009 or in 2013, and as if all football legends from history are nothing compared to current football gods.

Neymar is exceptional - how he drops players, his technique. He has tons of flair, you can expect he will get past his marker or do some crazy shit almost every time he gets the ball. In that department he is already better than Robben, Ribery, Reus or any other winger almost. He still has to win titles to get a receipt that his skills are beneficial for the team, but he already plays like a top baller' against difficult opposition like Atletico, RM, PSG or whatever comes in his way. And mind you, he's still young and will improve further - both his vision, decisions making and overall football intelligence.
Now, what is your problem? I read like every 30th of your posts, they are made up scenarios and stats that support 'your case' - real wall of texts, and those bullet points. Man, just chill.

 

[Vlom]

Man I can't even imagine what this thread will be like when Neymar has the next bad game ... seriously!!