7 - Philippe Coutinho - V1

[Sumlit]

I understand the allure of Coutinho, but he's an attacker, not a CM. The comparisons with Iniesta are not accurate. Coutinho is not a natural replacement for Iniesta and if forced to play in his position, will take a while to adapt, if he can do so at all. Rafinha is a similar attacking style of player, and look how much he is struggling to do well as CM.

 

[DonAK]

Coutinho is a typical #10/SS

We don't play with one.

If not Pogba then get Gündogan if he keeps up with his awesome start of the season.

 

[ZenI]

I understand the allure of Coutinho, but he's an attacker, not a CM. The comparisons with Iniesta are not accurate. Coutinho is not a natural replacement for Iniesta and if forced to play in his position, will take a while to adapt, if he can do so at all. Rafinha is a similar attacking style of player, and look how much he is struggling to do well as CM.

I like Coutinho, but I agree.

 

[raki]

Like it or not, but it seems like we'll be going all in for Pogba next summer. There probably won't be too much money left for a hyped BPL player like Coutinho.

Mr 80M is not hype? lol

 

[jonxxxj]

I understand the allure of Coutinho, but he's an attacker, not a CM. The comparisons with Iniesta are not accurate. Coutinho is not a natural replacement for Iniesta and if forced to play in his position, will take a while to adapt, if he can do so at all. Rafinha is a similar attacking style of player, and look how much he is struggling to do well as CM.

While i agree with this and rather see coutinho playing as a cam or ss, he has played as a CM in the 2013/2014 season, when suarez, sturridge and sterling were making the front three, and he did well, really well for someone playing out of position. Good games specially against city and arsenal playing as a CM, there are complitations available.

I know that he is not a perfect replacement for iniesta because their styles are different, but still think coutino is a good player for barcelona, since he has the ability and mentality to link well with players like messi, neymar and suarez.

And about him being better than James and Isco, i really think this way because i've seen enough of their games. Coutinho only problem is consistence, but he is young and his team is inconsistent as well, so in a different team, in two years of experience, this flaw will be corrected.

 

[Sumlit]

While i agree with this and rather see coutinho playing as a cam or ss, he has played as a CM in the 2013/2014 season, when suarez, sturridge and sterling were making the front three, and he did well, really well for someone playing out of position. Good games specially against city and arsenal playing as a CM, there are complitations available.

I know that he is not a perfect replacement for iniesta because their styles are different, but still think coutino is a good player for barcelona, since he has the ability and mentality to link well with players like messi, neymar and suarez.

And about him being better than James and Isco, i really think this way because i've seen enough of their games. Coutinho only problem is consistence, but he is young and his team is inconsistent as well, so in a different team, in two years of experience, this flaw will be corrected.

This is not a slight on Coutinho or your evaluation, but I would be extremely wary of awarding high evaluation value to his stint as CM last season because of EPL's open and back-and-forth style of game. It's a lot easier to not look out of place at CM there for a player of the technical qualities of Coutinho, than it is at a slower paced, overall more technical league like La Liga, and specially a complex role like Barca's CM.

Coutinho could very well adapt if given enough time, however the fact remains he is not a natural CM, would not be a natural replacement for Iniesta, and might struggle, at the very least initially, to adapt to the role. Remember Fabregas was a great CM at Arsenal, but struggled in the same position here, and once again looks a lot more comfortable there with Chelsea.

I do understand the allure of him though, he's very skilled and is playing well. I also understand the initial Iniesta comparison's as they have almost exact body builds and Coutinho exhibits good technical skills.

 

[Flavia]

How long before people start calling Coutinho for better than Iniesta?

I can see it coming

Already happened. In Iniesta's thread, IIRC.

 

[Mythical Revolution]

This is not a slight on Coutinho or your evaluation, but I would be extremely wary of awarding high evaluation value to his stint as CM last season because of EPL's open and back-and-forth style of game. It's a lot easier to not look out of place at CM there for a player of the technical qualities of Coutinho, than it is at a slower paced, overall more technical league like La Liga, and specially a complex role like Barca's CM.

Coutinho could very well adapt if given enough time, however the fact remains he is not a natural CM, would not be a natural replacement for Iniesta, and might struggle, at the very least initially, to adapt to the role. Remember Fabregas was a great CM at Arsenal, but struggled in the same position here, and once again looks a lot more comfortable there with Chelsea.

I do understand the allure of him though, he's very skilled and is playing well. I also understand the initial Iniesta comparison's as they have almost exact body builds and Coutinho exhibits good technical skills.

I agree with you that playing Coutinho as CM would be a waste of his talents, and a waste of a spot for us (given that there are better alternatives for CM).

But I don't agree with the premise of your argument. Iniesta has been playing as a CM since the start of last season to compensate for our lack of control in midfield. Even though our style has changed, possession and passing remain critical elements of our game, and with Rakitic replacing Xavi in the XI, we needed someone who could still coordinate our play and that's why Iniesta was deployed in a deeper role. That's also the reason why Messi was making more assists than goals at the beginning of last season: he had to fill the creativity void left by Iniesta, and act as a link between our attack and midfield.

So assuming that we can find a world class CM (and that should be the priority IMO), I don't see why Coutinho can't play for us as an AM. Besides his qualities as player, he would be an ideal fit for us, given our current play style: his through balls would make Neymar and especially Suarez even more dangerous than they already are; and his vision, creativity and workrate would help us both offensively and defensively by providing Messi with more freedom, and improving our pressing game.

 

[DrPepper]

get Gündogan

This

 

[anguy]

tbh ,I am not sure about it anymore .Since signing Arda rumors has been cold now
I think we might not go for a CM/Am next summer unless Rafinha leave or Arda failed there .think that we will have a quit summer next year with no big signing

We definitely need midfielder, but more controlling than attacking type - Gundogan, Verratti, Pjanic, Koke maybe even Herrera (who may be cheap). Also backup for LB, backup forward (can be solved in winter).

 

[Sumlit]

I agree with you that playing Coutinho as CM would be a waste of his talents, and a waste of a spot for us (given that there are better alternatives for CM).

But I don't agree with the premise of your argument. Iniesta has been playing as a CM since the start of last season to compensate for our lack of control in midfield. Even though our style has changed, possession and passing remain critical elements of our game, and with Rakitic replacing Xavi in the XI, we needed someone who could still coordinate our play and that's why Iniesta was deployed in a deeper role. That's also the reason why Messi was making more assists than goals at the beginning of last season: he had to fill the creativity void left by Iniesta, and act as a link between our attack and midfield.

So assuming that we can find a world class CM (and that should be the priority IMO), I don't see why Coutinho can't play for us as an AM. Besides his qualities as player, he would be an ideal fit for us, given our current play style: his through balls would make Neymar and especially Suarez even more dangerous than they already are; and his vision, creativity and workrate would help us both offensively and defensively by providing Messi with more freedom, and improving our pressing game.

Iniesta has always played CM. Barcelona's 3 man midfield needs 3 CMs, all with different focus roles, but 3 CMs nonetheless. Iniesta's focus role might have shifted a bit last year, but he's always been a CM for us. AMs are pure attacking midfield positions, and that's what Coutinho is. His role and responsibilities would increase exponentially if he were to be played as CM for Barca.

 

[Ghostmaster]

Iniesta has always played CM. Barcelona's 3 man midfield needs 3 CMs, all with different focus roles, but 3 CMs nonetheless. Iniesta's focus role might have shifted a bit last year, but he's always been a CM for us. AMs are pure attacking midfield positions, and that's what Coutinho is. His role and responsibilities would increase exponentially if he were to be played as CM for Barca.

Didn't Iniesta played as LW under Tito? I believe in his first year at Barca he also played as winger.

 

[Sumlit]

Didn't Iniesta played as LW under Tito? I believe in his first year at Barca he also played as winger.

Yes he played some LW to accommodate Cesc under Tito. Might have played there too under Pep some times, can't recall. Just meant his position in midfield is a CM position and always has been. With a more attack focus role as CM than the CM role of Xavi's or the defensive CM role of Busquets, but always a CM role.

 

[Co0ter]

He played on the LW a bit under Tito and Pep. He CAN play there, but he's nowhere near his best being playing along the end line. We can't get stuck back into playing players where they don't belong...that is part of the reason why our team struggled the last few seasons against decent opposition. Play players where they shine or don't play them at all. The same attitude should go towards buying players....buy them to play where they play best.

 

[anguy]

Coutinho is too attackminded and IMO "soft" for Luis Enrique. Based on his transfers he likes his midfielders to be more physical than Xaviniesta and able to constantly win the balls, not just distribute. I don't think Coutinho has a chance coming here as long as LE is a coach. Pogba has higher chance simply because he is ... bigger.