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FlaFCB
Guest
Roberto isn't really doing that great. Both are bad defensively, but Vidal can attack much better. He should get more chances to see if he can improve on his defensive duties too.
Aleix Vidal
- Thread starter Behrox
- Start date
Roberto isn't really doing that great. Both are bad defensively, but Vidal can attack much better. He should get more chances to see if he can improve on his defensive duties too.
Potroh
Member
I think Vidal can attack better as a winger (a bit closer to Alves's style) but Roberto is a much more intelligent player who is overall much better if he doesn't have to play close to the line. He IS a midfielder and a good one, regardless the "cosmetic surgeries" that the management tries to force upon him to become a transvestite...
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FlaFCB
Guest
Roberto is a good cm, but he's not a good rb. He's being wasted there, and it's also hurting our right side, both in defense and attack. That's why I'd like Vidal to at least have a shot, to see if he can improve defensively.
xXKonan
Senior Member
Lucho's system requires the fullbacks to do a lot of the creating as well+MSN. It works on the Left hand side on the pitch... but on the right hand side it was setting up Roberto for failure from the get go. I thought maybe within time Roberto could improve going forward and Lucho changing up the right side tactics to make Roberto more comfortable for his current skill set but as we can see it's not working.
It worked when we had Alves because he possessed the right skill set in order to work and he was Dani fucking Alves. He could work better as a RB in a system that has the RCM and RW doing more of the creative duties than he is right now and he could focus more on improving his defensive game.
Right now however Lucho, has Roberto shoulder the creative Burden in Alves old role while the RCM is pretty much a soulless pedestrian that is only there to play as a false defensive RB while Roberto is the one going forward. It's pretty much no wonder why it's not working and why Messi is more interested in being in the middle and on the left because that's where all the action is.
Roberto is intelligent no doubt It's just he doesn't have the right skill set to truly flourish in the old Alves role, if the right hand side was a lot more balanced then perhaps he can but in this current system he can't.
Vidal is suspect defensively but he fits the role better as he's much better going forward.
It worked when we had Alves because he possessed the right skill set in order to work and he was Dani fucking Alves. He could work better as a RB in a system that has the RCM and RW doing more of the creative duties than he is right now and he could focus more on improving his defensive game.
Right now however Lucho, has Roberto shoulder the creative Burden in Alves old role while the RCM is pretty much a soulless pedestrian that is only there to play as a false defensive RB while Roberto is the one going forward. It's pretty much no wonder why it's not working and why Messi is more interested in being in the middle and on the left because that's where all the action is.
Roberto is intelligent no doubt It's just he doesn't have the right skill set to truly flourish in the old Alves role, if the right hand side was a lot more balanced then perhaps he can but in this current system he can't.
Vidal is suspect defensively but he fits the role better as he's much better going forward.
snowy
Well-known member
his dashes and crosses against Eibar conjured up reminiscences of Alves. Might be a better combination since Messi likes to stay in the centre...
yaaaiiiks hope we're just talking botox or the whole Franken shebang
Potroh
Member
Yeah, that's what I tried to say too...
But Vidal is simply not good enough for that nostalgic Alves role, even if could have some moments against relatively bad opponents.
So imagine him playing against Marcelo or Filipe Luis... I seriously think the picture becomes nightmarish...
God Serena
New member
The problem in choosing between Roberto and Vidal is one is not a RB, and the other is... not a RB. No matter how we look at it Lucho and the board seem to have intentionally fucked us on this one when they refused to sign a RB when Alves left and refuse to this day to use a B team RB even in a dead rubber or easy win to see how he does.
Potroh
Member
You are right, none of them are real RBs, that's the root problem.
But the huge mistake was committed before Alves has left and the entire management was more than certain that Vidal is the new Alves for the team.
The problem with this is that all of them had a long time to observe Vidal's actual skills both at his old club and later for half a year in training during his ban. If none of them could see the difference, it means they were/are either visually impaired or pretty bad at judging what type of players could actually and practically fit into this team.
Nevertheless, this brings another question, namely who is the 'real' captain of the team, who among the players are strong enough to at least notify the coach in advance, sincerely telling their opinions. We just hear about the players having the biggest mouth in the locker room, but we don't actually know who is the one(s) who can sit down with the management and tell them straight away the doubts and opinions of the players themselves.
The players want to win titles and truly know it (as well as we observers do) that under the umbrella of the constant changes and often rather primitive experiments this will NOT come through, so they also want their opinions to be heard or listened to - at least.
That's why the constant rotations or internal fights for a given position can be very counter productive, because a pending/rotated player fights for himself and his position in the team, whereas only those will be able to fight for the team (as a whole) who don't need to worry for their present individual statuses and future.
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FlaFCB
Guest
He really should get more chances. His confidence is high and he's been playing better than Bob.
behindbrowneyes
Well-known member
I would say the situation is good how it is. Nice to have him on bench as joker to bring him in to have some impact with his fresh legs against tired opponents.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
I would currently play him in majority of Camp Nou La liga matches against midtable and bottom table teams.
Against those opponents, even Bartra and similar players always looked like world class players.
(Since those opponents rarely attack, and when they DO attack, those attacks are like: 5 Barca's players vs 2 opponents).
In short:
-- against stronger teams, Roberto at least can defend to some extent. But our attack will be dead with Roberto.
-- against weaker teams who defend all the time, those teams won't even create any chances and Vidal won't have too defend. In those circumstances when we have to attack and create actions, Vidal is Messi compared with Roberto in attacking actions as a RB.
So, against better teams, we have to see whether Vidal can improve in defending.
Against weaker teams, he currently offers more than Roberto.
Something like Mascherano vs Roberto/other players as a Cdm.
Masch is better in defense, but offers nothing in attack and in build up play.
So, against any team who isn't too strong, Roberto and similar players (who are good in attack and build up, but weaker than Masch in defense) are way better options than a defensive-minded Cdm Mascherano.
Against crappy teams, with Vidal as a RB, our Rcm will be better, and Messi will maybe stay on a RW, since he will finally have someone to whom he can pass the ball (Rcm who doesn't need to babysit for a RB+Vidal).
Against those opponents, even Bartra and similar players always looked like world class players.
(Since those opponents rarely attack, and when they DO attack, those attacks are like: 5 Barca's players vs 2 opponents).
In short:
-- against stronger teams, Roberto at least can defend to some extent. But our attack will be dead with Roberto.
-- against weaker teams who defend all the time, those teams won't even create any chances and Vidal won't have too defend. In those circumstances when we have to attack and create actions, Vidal is Messi compared with Roberto in attacking actions as a RB.
So, against better teams, we have to see whether Vidal can improve in defending.
Against weaker teams, he currently offers more than Roberto.
Something like Mascherano vs Roberto/other players as a Cdm.
Masch is better in defense, but offers nothing in attack and in build up play.
So, against any team who isn't too strong, Roberto and similar players (who are good in attack and build up, but weaker than Masch in defense) are way better options than a defensive-minded Cdm Mascherano.
Against crappy teams, with Vidal as a RB, our Rcm will be better, and Messi will maybe stay on a RW, since he will finally have someone to whom he can pass the ball (Rcm who doesn't need to babysit for a RB+Vidal).
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FlaFCB
Guest
This could also give Vidal some time to see if he can improve as a defender. But I don't think the dynamics will change at this point. Lucho will only give Vidal chances if Bob keeps regressing or gets injured.
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