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Flavia
Guest
For the casual watcher, surely. Rakitic, Pique and Busquets all made a huge difference for our treble too. And I rate them all above Alexis.
For the casual watcher, surely. Rakitic, Pique and Busquets all made a huge difference for our treble too. And I rate them all above Alexis.
But Busquets is 10 times the player Alexis is. Thats just how it is.
serghei
Senior Member
Mascherano, Alves, Iniesta also made a huge difference for our treble. That can't be the deciding factor IMO. Alexis has dragged Arsenal to top 3, and Aguero did the same with City. Hazard also did the same with Chelsea (better team though). All three are more valuable players than Rakitic, Pique and Busquets IMO. The reason Rakitic, Pique and Busi are more important for us than Alexis would be is because we have the stellar MSN up front, and everyone of them is better than Alexis.
No. He's just better for Barca. If you give Busi to Arsenal in exchange for Alexis they would never accept.
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You have a funny way to rate which players are the best players in the world.
serghei
Senior Member
If by funny you mean trying to be unbiased, then yes, I do.
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Flavia
Guest
No, it's because you don't win anything with only good forwards, even MSN. Rakitic, Busquets and Pique had a better season than Alexis. Other non forwards players from other teams too.
Nah... you're surely biased when Alexis is the subject.
serghei
Senior Member
I'm sorry, but I don't agree. If we judge like this, 8/10 best players in the world are from Barca, because they had a better season. They were important, but we are the best team in the world because of the MSN first and foremost. If we didn't have MSN, and we had Pedro, Sandro and Munir up front, I would trade Rakitic for Alexis in a heartbeat. And I really like Rakitic. Rakitic plays a suporting role. If the stars up front are no longer there, his importance drops. Of course that for Barca Alexis wouldn't seem very important. We have the luxury of lining up the most destructive attack since maybe ever.
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Flavia
Guest
This season, they are. Alexis is one of the top 10 forwards, but he is not one of the top 10 players.
serghei
Senior Member
We have different measuring units then. I'd put them in team of the season, but I wouldn't put them in top 10 players of the season.
Just a little. I won't say Alexis is better than Ronaldo or anything, even though I really like Alexis and I don't like Ronaldo. And I don't think my bias has anything do with my arguments. Most of the top 10 lists I've seen on other forums include Alexis, which makes me wonder why on Barcaforum that is perceived as crazy? Must be the hate. Just as with Alves. It's not my fault other comments have put me in the position of having to defend Alexis repeatedly. Or Alves for that matter. Now it's gonna be Neymar, because people start hating on him, until Alves has a couple of bad games and he becomes public enemy numer 1 again. It's just how it goes here.
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Flavia
Guest
If we had MSN up front, with villarreal's midfield and defense, no treble. Same with Pedro, Sandro and Munir instead of MSN. That's why it's a collective sport, you need a team. Alexis wouldn't make any difference in that case. Rakitic's "supporting" role was simply fundamental for the treble. Take him out and we'd also wouldn't have won it.
We surely do... Alexis as a top 10 player can't be taken seriously, imo. He's a top 10 forward, but player? Most of these "lists" only include forwards, anyway. They're not really valid to me.
serghei
Senior Member
Of course they're not really valid. Neither is the Ballon D'Or for that matter. They include forwards most of the time, but you have to agree that forwards are the most valuable players in general. We can talk about this being right or wrong, but it is a reality that forwards take the cake when you talk about most valuable players. The value of the player is being decided by the market. Alexis probably worths around 60m euros now, that is the sum he'll go for if Arsenal decide to sell him.
Of course it's a collective sport, the whole talk is theoretical, and in practice you never know how important player X or Y really was, since you can't know for sure what would've happened with another player instead of him. But to me at least, I think we would have won the treble with other good players instead of Raktic (same goes for other 3-4 players in the team). Rakitic wasn't quintessential for our treble, like Messi, Suarez and Neymar. I love Rakitic. I think he's our most improved player since the start of the season (not counting Suarez), and he did have an impact in the team, but not the kind of impact other top players couldn't have provided as well.
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Flavia
Guest
Pogba is worth 100m in the market. That doesn't says much, really. And to me Rakitic was essencial, yes. As Pique and Busquets also were. MSN scored the goals, but the other 3 had a huge impact in making that possible. No wonder Barça had a rough patch when we had problems in defense and midfield, in the previous seasons.
Icarium
Lifestealer
Even if you consider only attacking players he just barely makes top 10. Messi Ronaldo robben neymar Suarez hazard aguero James are all better than him. On his day di Maria is also better but consistency is very important for a player and I would Alexis over di Maria any day. If you consider other players too, neur lahm busi modric.... He is not top 10 Imo.
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