clemente
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so desperate
Arthur
- Thread starter Jair Ventura
- Start date
so desperate
Arizona Scott
New member
It may even be the physio telling EV that under no circumstance play Arthur more than x minutes. He has had a lot of muscle injuries this year, to be fair this is his 1st year anywhere near the intensity of what he experienced.
Please show me your pages of stats to prove this
How the hell a player who EV isn't happy with started almost all the matches of the season over his beloved prodigy son Vidal
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BBZ8800
Senior Member
I was replying to 2-3 posts where users posted ideas that Arthur didn't play against Liverpool due to an injury.
Then my reply was in sense: no. Ev rates Busi and Raki the highest.
Then Arthur, then Vidal, then Alena.
But for this match he opted for Vidal due to a fighting spirit.
The part from my post how Arthur was subbed off in each of 25 matches when he started, indicates:
1. That he has Stamina problems
2. Or again, that in EV's eyes among 3 midfielders, he is the weakest part and the first one to get subbed
I mean, I posted yesterday
Interceptions this season:
Rakitic 68
Busquets 65
Vidal 36
Coutinho 20
Arthur 11
Suarez 9
Messi 6
Dembele 6
Now, compare the amount of interceptions of Rakitic, Busquets and Vidal with Arthur.
Even Coutinho has way more interceptions than Athur.
And Arthur is almost equal to Suarez who is an attacker.
So, out of 3 defensive areas: interception of opponent's passes, tackles and headers, Arthur is ok only in tackles.
And then, we played against Liverpool who are running like crazy, and isn't it obvious that EV picked 3 guys in midfield who are the best defenders, plus Coutinho, who defends better than Dembele?
But here on forum, if you dare to say that Arthur has stamina problems or that he is the weakest defender out of 4 midfielders (paired with the lowest amount of end product like goals and assists), you are a mortal enemy.
Arthur is a good player.
But his numbers are weaker than the numbers of Busi and Raki. And in some areas Vidal is better. That's it.
Arizona Scott
New member
Very accurate. I'll add two more elements. One, as you pointed out he never plays a full game. That is just fine, with his muscular issues in his 1st year in Europe and how much he works--this is reasonable and may even be on physio orders. With our depth in midfielders not a problem. Playing ball out for 60-70 minutes, running yourself into needed a sub, should be more seen as a badge of honor. 2nd I would add Roberto in the discussion. I think in general he is preferred to Alena and somewhere with Vidal and Arthur depending on the situation and need.
Those stats don't prove that EV isn't happy with Arthur though.
In contrary it seems that EV is bias towards him.
Despite of the stats aren't as good as Vidal plus the muscular issue EV still started him most of the matches when he was fit to play, why?
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xXKonan
Senior Member
Well, Valverde did say during his press conference that Arthur has been struggling with Physical problems for a while now.
Don't think this is a case of Valverde not being happy with Arthur. He's probably trying to manage him to make sure whatever issues he may have don't get any worse. Valverde is a guy who you can tell who he likes and doesn't like and even when Arthur as going through that poor form he still started.
Don't think this is a case of Valverde not being happy with Arthur. He's probably trying to manage him to make sure whatever issues he may have don't get any worse. Valverde is a guy who you can tell who he likes and doesn't like and even when Arthur as going through that poor form he still started.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
You took my words literally.
When I said: EV doesn't like him, I meant: EV doesn't like him/rate him as highly as Barcaforum.
For Barcaforum, our midfield lineup pecking order is:
1. Arthur
2. Busi
3. everyone else
For EV, our midfield pecking order is:
1&2. Busquets and Rakitic
3. Arthur
4. Vidal
5. Alena
About your question why EV played Arthur more than Vidal, that is quite obvious: EV is not as dumb as his haters thinks.
La Liga is a competition where the opponents are usually light, technical and not that phyisical. And opponents are way inferior than us.
So, more possession and less defense is a logical pick and a trade-off.
So, if you play against Girona or Rayo, it is way better to play Busi-Raki-Arthur than Busi-Raki-Vidal if everyone are fit.
You can survive even with Busi-Arthur-Cou and similar combinations in La Liga, especially at Camp Nou. Remember Iniesta-Rafinha-Busi lineups under Lucho.
You can play Rafinha-Iniesta ta Camp Nou vs bottom table team.
But can you play that lineup vs Atletico, Liverpool or Bayern? No.
On the other hand, in some other matches, like against Liverpool, it is 50:50 between Vidal and Arthur.
If you want to have possession no matter what=pick Arthur.
If you want defense no matter what=pick Vidal.
EV picked Vidal.
Anyway, my post was more about: EV doesn't rate him as highly as fans from our forum.
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I didn't see many of people with that opinion here
Everyone and their mothers who watched enough of Barca's games know that EV always rate the senior player higher. At the beginning of the season, despite that Rakitic had very bad form EV started him almost all the matches even for not important matches in Copa
While I don't think it is right to rate Arthur higher than Busquest or Rakitic, I see no problem with people have high hopes and the hype for him. Considering the level of Barca team, a young player likes him made it into the team in the first year in Europe is a huge achievement and that's definitely deserved the praises. Sometimes your comments sound like you were trying to kill off the positive opinions for Arthur here. Why not let Barca supporters have some wild dreams for our young players?
Also I think using defensive stats only doesn't correctly reflect the contribution of our midfielders to the team. It's obvious that players with small physiques like Arthur, Xavi, Iniesta will have disadvantage against players like Rakitic, Busquest and Vidal in that regard. In Arthur case, his biggest contribution is keeping possession in many matches it's needed more than Vidal's defensive contribution, it doesn't reflect in your stats at all.
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Gnidrologist
Senior Member
Silly stats merchant BBZ. Ronaldo has more goals than Messi in CL therefore Ronaldo > Messi. Hurr durr derp!
Shayan_barca
Member
he was holding his groin a few times during this game
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