Barca Transfers and Rumors
- Thread starter Barcaman
- Start date
spark
New member
As you said he is one of the finest players to have walked this earth. I can see Roberto doing Rakitic's role but football fan in me would silently weep if a true magician such as Andres' position was filled by Roberto , no offense to him who has his own strengths.
khaled_a_d
Senior Member
That is what Robert has done.
This past summer was his 1st and he found himself with a team of average age 29. Buying those youngsters was the only way to get balance back
And we bought 6 players and one of them wasn't young player (Cillessen) he is a good back up GK for the team who is now at his prime.You can bet that GK signing is Unzue choice
I don't think any of the other 5 looked bad either with the exception of Paco. All of them look like players who will fit their role for now at least.
Way to early for such comments man.
Why dont you judge players based on their quality, and not their age, nationality, former club etc etc?
I've said all along that only Umtiti has what it takes. But people are obsessed about "proven La Liga" players so they are very happy when we sign players like Arda, Vidal, Paco, Gomes etc etc. We've spent 130m euros on those players. The sane option would of course have been to expand our vision. Players like Gabriel Jesus, Boufal, Fabinho, Sidibe, Gundogan, Ricardo Pereira, Mustafi and Franco Vazquez were all available for good prices. Good options that would actually strengthen our squad.
Barcilliant
Senior Member
Ditto
Barcilliant
Senior Member
We need to buy for the future.
Our golden generation is ñear 30 or past it.
Even decent players will cost an arm and leg in the future.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
There is a difference between just buying young players and buying for the future.
The fact that we bought 5-6 youngsters doesn't have anything with building our future if none (or 1-2) of them will stay here in 3 years time.
These are all just "attempts" of building a future.
26 years old (proven or semi proven) player who will stay here for 4-5 years is a way more solid and certain future than a 22 years old youngster who will prove as not good enough (or to be a squad player at best) and who will be shipped in 1-2 years, and then we'll buy 5 new youngsters in 5 new "attempts".
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Masch dead and old (in Robert's eyes).
Mathieu dead and old.
It is clear that Rorbert's plan is to rejuvenate a team in extreme way (for my taste).
We are yet to see how will it will look after 2-3 years. We'll buy tons of new, young players. We will see over time how much quality has he actually bought.
Don't be surprised if we'll buy at least 2 young, new Cbs in the next 2 summers.
Marlon won't play. Tarin won't get a chance.
Expect 2 random Cbs aged 19-22 from a French league, Valencia, Celta and similar.
BBZ8800
Suggest better, obtainable players we could have obtained
Who are in your preferred age range
And willing to play the same role
why random players? Why 19-22?
Gomes is not a random player, he's a top top prospect chased by RMA, and other top teams
Denis was our own player, he impressed at Villareal so we gave him a chance to succeed here just like Madrid with Carvajal
Digne perfect backup, good enough to start in absence of Alba, can't complain when benched
Paco may be [MENTION=20770]Raketa10[/MENTION] can help here
But a transfer window can't be 100%
None of these signings suggest that we are on track towards buying Random players aged 19-22
It's all in your mind
Unless you name better players that find the description
these were the best players that could be obtained for the role needed
not some random douglas or cacerea
Suggest better, obtainable players we could have obtained
Who are in your preferred age range
And willing to play the same role
why random players? Why 19-22?
Gomes is not a random player, he's a top top prospect chased by RMA, and other top teams
Denis was our own player, he impressed at Villareal so we gave him a chance to succeed here just like Madrid with Carvajal
Digne perfect backup, good enough to start in absence of Alba, can't complain when benched
Paco may be [MENTION=20770]Raketa10[/MENTION] can help here
But a transfer window can't be 100%
None of these signings suggest that we are on track towards buying Random players aged 19-22
It's all in your mind
Unless you name better players that find the description
these were the best players that could be obtained for the role needed
not some random douglas or cacerea
khaled_a_d
Senior Member
Aren't those true? Do you really want Mathieu for another season? I liked what he has given us so far but he always looked like a guy who will give us 3 years maximum.
By next season he is probably dead weight.
Mascherano? Love the guy but he is on a steep decline as it look right now and even if he regained his form the guy wanted to leave last summer and will probably ask to leave again next one. He is known to be one of the players who wants to be a coach in the future and those players tends to try new type of football later in their playing career. We won't be able to keep him most likely even if we wanted to.
If this was the case then he would have allowed players like Mathieu & Mascherano to go,we could have collected around 15M from both if rumors to be believed which could have got us Lemos for example. but we rejected offer for both players and kept them.
The only starting player in Europe oldest starting squad who left was Alves and Robert could have nothing to do with it.
That is pure assumption as it get.
We had 6 signings,one of them were a GK who were most likely Unzue choice after Bravo wanted to leave.
Another was a player that no sane person on his right mind would pass on getting him for 3M in Denis Suarez. Those were deals that any sporting director would have done.
After that he has done 4 more deals. Umtiti,Gomes,Alcacer & Digne. 3 of them are 23 years old players and one will be 23 b4 the 12th Liga game.
Most players have their primes between 24&31 most likely,so we are buying players who are 1 year away from hitting their prime. That is a perfect age for signing players who won't walk into the starting line up b/c they will accept playing from the bench with an eye on a starting spot in the future
Out of those 4 players are Umtiti & Gomes who you like so 50% of Roberto work you already like so I don't find a reason for the rant.
The 3rd is is Digne who is a proven player in Roma,and honestly I think he is the best back up for LB position we had in few years.
Alcacer is the only reason to complain,but Roberto himself already admit that most of our targets in that position didn't want to come. we were in the market for a back up striker since day one and we pulled this deals one day b4 the window is close. It seem that at the end Alcacer was the only potential target that we could get.
Again,way too early for any judgement on Roberto,the guy had only one summer and we can't just judge it after 7 weeks from its end.
And btw,the guy himself said there will be big signings if needed,but that wasn't needed last summer and I tend to agree with him.
And again,with the average age of the squad last year youth was needed one way or another and I actually like he did it with back up players who has the potential.
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BBZ8800
Senior Member
[MENTION=11668]khaled_a_d[/MENTION], I know, Masch and Mathieu are old and almost finished.
But what annoys me is this:
You can buy these type of players for more or less any position:
1. 18-19 years old, high potential, unproven, huge risk, like Halilovic, Jesus etc
2. 22 years old like Denis, Digne etc. Still a lot of risk, but they have potentially a nice resell value
3. proven players at their prime, aged 25-26, who can still play on a top level easily 4-5-6 years. They cost more than 22 years, but they bring much less risk and they can add an immediate impact to a team right now
4. players aged 28, who aren't a (too huge) risk, since they are proven already. A con is that they can play "only" 3-4-5 years and that they cost more
5. short term replacements, aged 30, 31, 32, 33 who can jump in and play awesome for 1-2-3 seasons (Larsson, even Mathieu etc)
Now, in my eyes, a player is a player, no matter if he is aged 18, 22, 25, 28 or 32.
If we need a RB right now, to win La liga and compete for a CL while we have Messi and MSN, I am not interested in Cancelo and guys who are yet to learn how to play as a RB, and who are yet to have some world class performances and similar and who could be potentially good in 2021'.
A youngster may seem like a nice longterm future (he will be our player for the next 10 years, as people here like to dream), but a 28 or 32 year old guy will offer a right-now, short-term fix and can be a decisive factor right now in winning some title.
Since we have no idea what we will do with a RB in a future, since:
1. Roberto may turn awesome
2. Roberto may turn as not good enough after we see him play 50+ matches as a RB
3. we may turn to Bellerin
4. we may turn to god knows who
Since our board has zero ideas what will happen with a RB spot in the next 2-3 years, isn't it better to buy Srna (or even Lichtsteiner, even though people say that he is not good enough, so ok) than Cancelo or some similar guy?
Imagine a CL semis and Roberto is injured again.
Would you be happier with Srna/Licht against Bayern, or against Cancelo who will probably end as a new Vidal, a winger who will try to learn defending eventually.
So, would you rather have a NT player who played for 15 years on NT level as a RB, or a guy who will try to learn some basics of defending in the next few Months?
This is just one example.
We don't need to suddenly buy 10 players aged 22.
Players aged 25 are good also.
Players aged 28 are good also.
Players aged 30-32 can help also.
About our current signings, I know that it is way too early.
Umtiti looks like a potential starter.
Gomes has a potential to end as an awesome midfielder, but he will need to work and learn a lot till then.
I gave up personally on Denis long time ago (as a future starter material).
Paco, if he'll improve he can be a squad player. He doesn't look as Barca's next Suarez at all. (We need world class Cfs always. Nothing less is good enough for us).
Digne, a good squad player, overpaid a lot.
Cillessen, it seems that he won't play too much at all.
So, not all Robert's transfers are bad.
But he is overpaying a lot for young squad players who are ONLY squad players and don't bring too much to a team currently (except Lucho's rotation which isn't working at all currently).
Further, about youngsters having a good resell value, look at Vidal.
Bought for 25-30 M (right?), failed here, and now we will sell him for probably 4-8 Millions.
His resell value is gone.
We will lose 15-20 Millions on him.
That way, we could have easily bought a 29 years old proven, world class RB, had him for 2-3-4 season, paid 10 Millions for him (transfer fee) and lose 10 Millions on him (resell value).
At least we would get some product and some impact on a field.
If we can buy an oldie for 5-10 Millions and if he will offer an impact an improvement to our team for 2-3 seasons, then that money is not a lost money, and it is imo worth more than 18M for Digne, 30M for Vidal and similar.
About Denis, and about 3M transfer, isn't his transfer in the end more like 12-15 M (money paid to Manc City, then money paid after 2 loans and after Villareal-Sevilal switch, plus additional money which will be paid to Manc City for each 10-20 matches played)?
So, if Denis will be a 12-15M guy, then his transfer also isn't such a straightforward and simple win-win deal (if he ends as a squad player and get shipped in 2 years).
For my taste, Robert is buying too many squad players for a lot of money (since they are young and they cost a lot) and we have too less actual impact on a field currently.
If he'll now buy a young RB Cancelo for a lot of money, then 2 young expensive (and unproven/risky) Cbs, well, we'll see how his reign will end in the end.
** I know that it is way too early, but some questions can already be asked, imo.
But what annoys me is this:
You can buy these type of players for more or less any position:
1. 18-19 years old, high potential, unproven, huge risk, like Halilovic, Jesus etc
2. 22 years old like Denis, Digne etc. Still a lot of risk, but they have potentially a nice resell value
3. proven players at their prime, aged 25-26, who can still play on a top level easily 4-5-6 years. They cost more than 22 years, but they bring much less risk and they can add an immediate impact to a team right now
4. players aged 28, who aren't a (too huge) risk, since they are proven already. A con is that they can play "only" 3-4-5 years and that they cost more
5. short term replacements, aged 30, 31, 32, 33 who can jump in and play awesome for 1-2-3 seasons (Larsson, even Mathieu etc)
Now, in my eyes, a player is a player, no matter if he is aged 18, 22, 25, 28 or 32.
If we need a RB right now, to win La liga and compete for a CL while we have Messi and MSN, I am not interested in Cancelo and guys who are yet to learn how to play as a RB, and who are yet to have some world class performances and similar and who could be potentially good in 2021'.
A youngster may seem like a nice longterm future (he will be our player for the next 10 years, as people here like to dream), but a 28 or 32 year old guy will offer a right-now, short-term fix and can be a decisive factor right now in winning some title.
Since we have no idea what we will do with a RB in a future, since:
1. Roberto may turn awesome
2. Roberto may turn as not good enough after we see him play 50+ matches as a RB
3. we may turn to Bellerin
4. we may turn to god knows who
Since our board has zero ideas what will happen with a RB spot in the next 2-3 years, isn't it better to buy Srna (or even Lichtsteiner, even though people say that he is not good enough, so ok) than Cancelo or some similar guy?
Imagine a CL semis and Roberto is injured again.
Would you be happier with Srna/Licht against Bayern, or against Cancelo who will probably end as a new Vidal, a winger who will try to learn defending eventually.
So, would you rather have a NT player who played for 15 years on NT level as a RB, or a guy who will try to learn some basics of defending in the next few Months?
This is just one example.
We don't need to suddenly buy 10 players aged 22.
Players aged 25 are good also.
Players aged 28 are good also.
Players aged 30-32 can help also.
About our current signings, I know that it is way too early.
Umtiti looks like a potential starter.
Gomes has a potential to end as an awesome midfielder, but he will need to work and learn a lot till then.
I gave up personally on Denis long time ago (as a future starter material).
Paco, if he'll improve he can be a squad player. He doesn't look as Barca's next Suarez at all. (We need world class Cfs always. Nothing less is good enough for us).
Digne, a good squad player, overpaid a lot.
Cillessen, it seems that he won't play too much at all.
So, not all Robert's transfers are bad.
But he is overpaying a lot for young squad players who are ONLY squad players and don't bring too much to a team currently (except Lucho's rotation which isn't working at all currently).
Further, about youngsters having a good resell value, look at Vidal.
Bought for 25-30 M (right?), failed here, and now we will sell him for probably 4-8 Millions.
His resell value is gone.
We will lose 15-20 Millions on him.
That way, we could have easily bought a 29 years old proven, world class RB, had him for 2-3-4 season, paid 10 Millions for him (transfer fee) and lose 10 Millions on him (resell value).
At least we would get some product and some impact on a field.
If we can buy an oldie for 5-10 Millions and if he will offer an impact an improvement to our team for 2-3 seasons, then that money is not a lost money, and it is imo worth more than 18M for Digne, 30M for Vidal and similar.
About Denis, and about 3M transfer, isn't his transfer in the end more like 12-15 M (money paid to Manc City, then money paid after 2 loans and after Villareal-Sevilal switch, plus additional money which will be paid to Manc City for each 10-20 matches played)?
So, if Denis will be a 12-15M guy, then his transfer also isn't such a straightforward and simple win-win deal (if he ends as a squad player and get shipped in 2 years).
For my taste, Robert is buying too many squad players for a lot of money (since they are young and they cost a lot) and we have too less actual impact on a field currently.
If he'll now buy a young RB Cancelo for a lot of money, then 2 young expensive (and unproven/risky) Cbs, well, we'll see how his reign will end in the end.
** I know that it is way too early, but some questions can already be asked, imo.
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