Champions League

[iniestaGOAT]

[MENTION=20930]Messi983[/MENTION], there is no doubt CL is a bore until the semis. Every match is with the winner already known, with very few exceptions, and the groups are tragically bad.

Now that they took out the away goal rule, it's even worse. At least that made it more unpredictable and dramatic.

They need to revamp this and make the average CL game count more. A league + playoff format is badly needed.

CL is falling behind the EPL for me. EPL has more consistently top games and every game counts for something. The best game I've seen in weeks was City - Tottenham.

Nah, 4 ties are predictable right now, any team can win the other 4. All quarter finals matches will be great.

Every EPL game does not count for something. In fact this year might be only the second time in six years they have had an entertaining title race. Before that it was 3 years back when city won the title by one point.

Their top 4 race is interesting but thats interesting in every league.

 

[malvolio]

Super League can't come soon enough. CL groups are worthless and then most big teams play EL level opponents in first KO round.

For elite teams it's basically quarters and semis to play for. So 4 games to reach the final and you don't really have to be excellent in all of them.

 

[RF20]

Super League can't come soon enough. CL groups are worthless and then most big teams play EL level opponents in first KO round.

For elite teams it's basically quarters and semis to play for. So 4 games to reach the final and you don't really have to be excellent in all of them.

Super League will finish any risk of the clubs not being in the competition. So no risk of missing out on the competition for a year. Not sporting merit.

You are probably just upset because Barcelona aren't in the knockouts this year?

The Super League concept is a joke.

 

[malvolio]

Super League will finish any risk of the clubs not being in the competition. So no risk of missing out on the competition for a year. Not sporting merit.

You are probably just upset because Barcelona aren't in the knockouts this year?

The Super League concept is a joke.

Nope, I'm against the current CL format for quite some time. Even before the SL project came to light, I was writing in here how the CL groups are shit and it's all about KOs for big clubs.

The original SL concept had flaws and was rushed, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved. League + play-offs with a relegation/promotion system will probably be implemented.

What's the 'sporting merit' in Bayern beating the likes of Dynamo Kiev 11-0?

 

[Porque]

[MENTION=20930]Messi983[/MENTION], there is no doubt CL is a bore until the semis. Every match is with the winner already known, with very few exceptions, and the groups are tragically bad.

Now that they took out the away goal rule, it's even worse. At least that made it more unpredictable and dramatic.

They need to revamp this and make the average CL game count more. A league + playoff format is badly needed.

CL is falling behind the EPL for me. EPL has more consistently top games and every game counts for something. The best game I've seen in weeks was City - Tottenham.

Tonight there are key EPL games at the same time as the CL, which surprised me.

Would be very interesting to know which games get a bigger global audience.

 

[fergus90]

Tonight there are key EPL games at the same time as the CL, which surprised me.

Would be very interesting to know which games get a bigger global audience.

I think the CL is seen as the primary competition to win in just about every other top European league rather than England. I don't know if it's because of UEFA's past with English clubs or the fact that obviously, the PR behind the PL is strong and always has been in this country anyway since its inception back in 1992.

For example, I know quite a few United fans (even though I live near about 15 PL or Championship clubs, you're never far from a United fan anywhere in England) but the easiest tickets for them to get were Champions League games, whereas getting tickets for Man United or Liverpool in the premier league is nigh impossible unless you know someone who's season ticket you can borrow for a game.

So it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if Liverpool vs Leeds for example pulled in more viewers in the UK than United vs Atletico but everywhere else I expect CL will pull most viewers.

Also it doesn't help that the CL used to be on terrestrial TV back in the 90's and 00's and then moved to Sky, but since has somewhat been tucked away on BT Sport which requires additional viewing packages to be bought. Another issue with the CL is the somewhat predictable outcome until the QF stage. But yeah for whatever reason, it doesn't seem to hold the same allure in England.

 

[El Gato]

Nope, I'm against the current CL format for quite some time. Even before the SL project came to light, I was writing in here how the CL groups are shit and it's all about KOs for big clubs.

The original SL concept had flaws and was rushed, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved. League + play-offs with a relegation/promotion system will probably be implemented.

What's the 'sporting merit' in Bayern beating the likes of Dynamo Kiev 11-0?

Why do groups in particular need sporting merit? Dont see anything wrong with current system considering you have NT in autumn these days and players have enough games to focus on.

Folk need to stop being obsessed about every match mattering. It's what compels national teams to play stronger 11s in the Nations League set up mostly so that teams at bottom of hierarchy have a way out where in reality you don't need to win every game. But managers remain convinced they must compete for every title.

Players need rest and comparatively easier sets of fixtures.
Not going all out throughout the length of season.

What IS wrong is giving leeway to underperformers like UEFA are with the new format.
But previously proposed SL is not a resolution.

 

[malvolio]

Why do groups in particular need sporting merit? Dont see anything wrong with current system considering you have NT in autumn these days and players have enough games to focus on.

Folk need to stop being obsessed about every match mattering. It's what compels national teams to play stronger 11s in the Nations League set up mostly so that teams at bottom of hierarchy have a way out where in reality you don't need to win every game. But managers remain convinced they must compete for every title.

Players need rest and comparatively easier sets of fixtures.
Not going all out throughout the length of season.

What IS wrong is giving leeway to underperformers like UEFA are with the new format.
But previously proposed SL is not a resolution.

Then why should teams play for real in their domestic leagues over the same period? After all the CL brings in more money and is the 'premium' competition for most clubs right?

If it's the 'premium' competition I would expect premium games, not the big teams flexing their muscles and barely breaking a sweat. Right now it's just a boring warmup for big clubs, with the medium/small clubs being glad to get some fat breadcrumbs from participating.

It's not my business as a fan to setup the footballing calendar and juggle between NT games, club competitions, league competitions etc. UEFA can't handle it? Tough luck, let others do it.

 

[El Gato]

It's not a 'premium' competition. Only if you think of it as something you're supposed to want to watch all the time it would be.
At its core it was a cup for title holders across Europe.
Which has then morphed into a competition for the clubs with most pull and money to sustain football growth enabling them to provide the games folks will want to sit in front of the TV for.
And honestly in my mind should lean towards the roots rather than 'making every game a premium you must switch on'.

As for domestic leagues - dont see why teams should be forced to play for real anywhere.
Let them play for real whenever they choose to.
If they want to field 2nd team and beat BATE Borisov 5-0 then that's their prerogative.
If they want to bench first 11 in a league game vs Rayo to focus on CL, that's their choice.

You say it's not your business and they control calendar, but it is your business to acknowledge that wanting a tougher calendar where every game 'must mean something' will not be without consequence.
Can't really do the international calendar very differently. Can't shift NT games to winter as some countries will have absolutely horrendous conditions other places will never have to face hence autumn and spring is optimal

Others won't do it either. All you'll end up getting is some competitions getting scrapped because SL will ALWAYS prioritise personal gain for each founder club over whatever there should be on idealistic ground (i.e. most of national team football). Have to be delusional to think Perez or Mansour will do better setting out a fair calendar than cohorts of people doing it currently.

 

[fergus90]

Kind of ironic that it was called the European Cup when it was strictly full of league champions. Then when it was rebranded and remodeled as the Champions League it's mainly composed of teams who didn't win their league.

Alexa, play Ironic by Alanis Morissette.

 

[Morten]

Kind of ironic that it was called the European Cup when it was strictly full of league champions. Then when it was rebranded and remodeled as the Champions League it's mainly composed of teams who didn't win their league.

Alexa, play Ironic by Alanis Morissette.

A song that isn't at all ironic, btw.

 

[fergus90]

A song that isn't at all ironic, btw.

Trivia I unfortunately already knew sir but thank you all the same.

 

[Birdy]

It's not a 'premium' competition. Only if you think of it as something you're supposed to want to watch all the time it would be.
At its core it was a cup for title holders across Europe.
Which has then morphed into a competition for the clubs with most pull and money to sustain football growth enabling them to provide the games folks will want to sit in front of the TV for.
And honestly in my mind should lean towards the roots rather than 'making every game a premium you must switch on'.

As for domestic leagues - dont see why teams should be forced to play for real anywhere.
Let them play for real whenever they choose to.
If they want to field 2nd team and beat BATE Borisov 5-0 then that's their prerogative.
If they want to bench first 11 in a league game vs Rayo to focus on CL, that's their choice.

You say it's not your business and they control calendar, but it is your business to acknowledge that wanting a tougher calendar where every game 'must mean something' will not be without consequence.
Can't really do the international calendar very differently. Can't shift NT games to winter as some countries will have absolutely horrendous conditions other places will never have to face hence autumn and spring is optimal

Others won't do it either. All you'll end up getting is some competitions getting scrapped because SL will ALWAYS prioritise personal gain for each founder club over whatever there should be on idealistic ground (i.e. most of national team football). Have to be delusional to think Perez or Mansour will do better setting out a fair calendar than cohorts of people doing it currently.

One of the few - MAYBE the only - things I agree with Malvolio here is about the SL.

It's the logic of the development of the sport, it's going there, it can't (and shound't IMO) be stopped.

The strong teams and clubs are becoming stronger every year, in every aspect: be it money, players, top coaches and tactics.
The less strong ones can't simply compete with them and the gap is widening with every passing year.
Even rotating the first XI of the strong team is not enough to get points against them -> we are seeing more and more groups where the first gets 15-18 pts

What's the point of having those games, where only the small club gain something (prestige of playing with the 'big boys', and the illussion of being 'in the same league and bracket'), whereas the big do not ??

Isn't it much better to have gradations of strength in all comps,
so you have good but not top teams in a competition where most have a shot and can compete fairly well,
and the same for very small clubs?

 

[RF20]

Nope, I'm against the current CL format for quite some time. Even before the SL project came to light, I was writing in here how the CL groups are shit and it's all about KOs for big clubs.

The original SL concept had flaws and was rushed, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved. League + play-offs with a relegation/promotion system will probably be implemented.

What's the 'sporting merit' in Bayern beating the likes of Dynamo Kiev 11-0?

But if there was relegation and promotion then it would not be the Super League.

Why would big clubs accept it then. The reason they are accepting is because they'll be untouchable.

Relegation would mean no guaranteed SL revenue. That's definitely not what the clubs agreed to

 

[malvolio]

But if there was relegation and promotion then it would not be the Super League.

Why would big clubs accept it then. The reason they are accepting is because they'll be untouchable.

Relegation would mean no guaranteed SL revenue. That's definitely not what the clubs agreed to

no, big clubs just want to cut out the middle men aka UEFA. by doing this they can negotiate directly with sponsors and make their own rules.

i think they figured out already that their first proposal was kind of stupid as you have to get on board the smaller clubs too.

let's be honest, the initial clubs that were on the list for the SL already got CL action nearly every season.