Ernesto Valverde - V1

George_Costanza

Active member
Valverde is going to have to make a decision on Messi and Suarez. I see no other alternative... Bringing in Griezmann is only going to further complicate things so we best stay clear of that.

.

I have been saying this in Griezmann thread but no one is listening. We only need a replacement for Suarez after maybe 18/19 season, having two world-class fwds for the same spot doesn't make any sense. Now add to that the attacking power of Messi, Dembele, Coutinho. Can't have the desired balance by overcrowding the team with forwards.
 

Zincubus

Banned
Come on guys ... Is it sooooo bad of me to care !!

I've drooled over Couthino's play for four years+ then we spend a king's ransom on the lad only for this guy to give him his full debut and play him out of position in tandem with an low in confidence Samedo who hasn't been playing ..


The manager should at least explain his thinking ..
 
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MessiCam

Guest
Come on guys ... Is it sooooo bad of me to care !!

I've drooled over Couthino's play for four years+ then we spend a king's ransom on the lad only for this guy to give him his full debut and play him out of position in tandem with an low in confidence Samedo who hasn't been playing ..


The manager should at least explain his thinking ..

Valverde has already said that they need to see where Coutinho fits in because he can play in various different positions. You can’t do that on the training ground... It’s just unfortunate that this experiment came up against a stubborn Alavés.
 
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MessiCam

Guest
I have been saying this in Griezmann thread but no one is listening. We only need a replacement for Suarez after maybe 18/19 season, having two world-class fwds for the same spot doesn't make any sense. Now add to that the attacking power of Messi, Dembele, Coutinho. Can't have the desired balance by overcrowding the team with forwards.
It’s due to the price in an insanely inflated market. I won’t lie. In a business sense it’s a no-brainer but in a sporting sense it will cause all sorts of issues.
 

Mitchell1978

Senior Member
The last time Messi was truly a right wing was under Rijkaard. Fact is both need to play in a central position and due to that this side will continue to lack balance. Who's to blame for it is beside the point but it must be resolved...

And no, Valverde didn't solve it, circumstance did with Dembele's injury because up until then it 4-3-3 False 9. Now Coutinho is here, Dembele will join him soon, and Valverde is sitting with the same issues.

Contrary to popular belief a 4-2-3-1 is not going to work with our heavy possession and passing style. No way.

Many on here will laugh at me but the only way to get them all on the field and in their preferred positions while maintaining balance is switching to a 3-4-3 diamond.

I more or less expect Coutinho to replace Iniesta as a starter next season for most of the games, don't forget He turns 34 this season so there will be no need to accomodate the both if that is the problem.
 
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MessiCam

Guest
I more or less expect Coutinho to replace Iniesta as a starter next season for most of the games, don't forget He turns 34 this season so there will be no need to accomodate the both if that is the problem.
It’s not about Iniesta but rather Coutinho. He is too attacking to play as a CM. He plays very high up the pitch so you may as well play him as a LW.

He basically plays just behind the forwards.

But my argument is 4-4-2, 4-2-3-1 with any 2 of Coutinho, Iniesta and Dembele is just a terrible idea. 2 CM’s (the pivots) result in little to no control in an area of the pitch that is critical to a possession based passing game. For that to work we’d need 3 in midfield but then we sit with a situation of Messi and Suárez both wanting to play through the centre.

Valverde could find balance earlier because Coutinho and Dembele weren’t available and he could use 2 workhorses alongside Busquets and Iniesta. Ie. play with 4 CM’s with all the width coming from the full backs. He can’t do that any longer.

Why do you think Pique and Umtiti played so high up last night? Because there was a Grand Canyon sized hole in midfield caused by effectively having only 2 CM’s.
 

FCBfan22

Senior Member
Why do you think Pique and Umtiti played so high up last night? Because there was a Grand Canyon sized hole in midfield caused by effectively having only 2 CM’s.

No. They played high, because the team was probably ordered to go all-out attack and finish this one early. Gerard Pique thinks that this means, run to the opponent's box, wait for a cross and don't give a fuck about defence.
 

Horatio

You're welcome
It doesn't matter.
We need to change our formation and tactics asap.
442 is just not working ;)

#Equilibrium


To be fair though, records like that can be misleading and don't like to put too much weight on them. Just a novelty. But 4-4-2 definitely working.
 
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MessiCam

Guest
No. They played high, because the team was probably ordered to go all-out attack and finish this one early. Gerard Pique thinks that this means, run to the opponent's box, wait for a cross and don't give a fuck about defence.

I find it hard to believe that Valverde would issue such an order when he is reliant on his fullbacks getting forward. It was corrected in the second half to a certain extent.

Only Man City play that high up but they have precision counter pressing to make it work.
 

henias

New member
No. They played high, because the team was probably ordered to go all-out attack and finish this one early. Gerard Pique thinks that this means, run to the opponent's box, wait for a cross and don't give a fuck about defence.

You cant play high with two attacking fullbacks in a 4231 formation, its bound to be a fucking disaster. Same with the 442 against Celta Vigo but at least Messi doesnt drop too deep. 2 CMs will be terribly isolated and cant help with defence. Eveything is too narrow at the back. 433 is the most ideal for an all-out attacking.
 

Gnidrologist

Senior Member
Despite of what someone said (not sure if in this thread) that the oversaturation of midfield was bad, i actually liked the Alaves game. It was a bit chaotic and final passes finishing always somehow failed, but it felt more like a "one of those nights" thing + not yet oiled enough understanding among new and old players. ON the other hand there was this effortless flair in how we possessed (almost in demonic possession way) that i haven't seen from Barca since pep. There was always that feeling something magical could happen any moment now and they circulated the ball on pure intuition and improvisation and it still looked great. Coutinho, even if failing some final touches, did immensely with absorbing any pressure that was ditched out to him. Nor Rakitic or Poulinho ar as badass in this department. Of course, i don't think we should now play all Iniesta, Cou, Messi at the same time now, but against some opponents it can work wonders, especially with Busi and better fullbacks back.
 

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