FC Barcelona: Win of the youth system

BarçaBarça

BarçaBarça

New member
Messi983 said:
He's driving his price up. In the end Betis will have to offer us Firpo and 10m to get Miranda. :p
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What do you think about the latest structural changes of La Masia?
Surely it is good to get rid of Pep Seguras ideas and back to Laureano Ruiz-based La Masia, but are the proposals sufficient, you think?

Valdes back is fine, imo, but the most important thing is not to import others, who hasn't got the education from within. It really feels like Bartomeu has realized that Masia 360 and his other plans were a big mistake and that the academy needs a turn-around. I would of course like more funding as well, but we will see.
 
Messi983

Messi983

Senior Member
BarçaBarça said:
What do you think about the latest structural changes of La Masia?
Surely it is good to get rid of Pep Seguras ideas and back to Laureano Ruiz-based La Masia, but are the proposals sufficient, you think?

Valdes back is fine, imo, but the most important thing is not to import others, who hasn't got the education from within. It really feels like Bartomeu has realized that Masia 360 and his other plans were a big mistake and that the academy needs a turn-around. I would of course like more funding as well, but we will see.
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To be fair I don't know. There were a lot (too many) changes over the last few years which could be a sign they don't know what they are doing but on the other hand they could also be aware something is not right so they want changes. We'll see. Good to see VV back, Kluivert will apparently took over as a "director of La Masia" (I like him but don't know if he's the right person for that role and I would prefer a La Masia graduate).

I don't like Segura either mainly because of his stupid words in summer 2017 about Coutinho and Dembele's transfers but as an outsider I don't know exactly what his role is/was with La Masia. Is he really a villain like some reporters and most (online) fans are believing? Is situation really as bad as reported only because of him? Our younger teams are still having good results overall from what I know, we are still having a lot of talented players in La Masia but people's expectations were/are just set too too high after our Golden generation.

Nowadays every kid is compared to Xaviesta and Messi which is putting additional pressure on them and then people are disappointed when at the end we only produce a squad player like Alena for the first team. But getting Alenas and Robertos out of La Masia is much more normal and likely then producing another Iniesta let alone Messi in next 20-30 years or ever.

I've stopped to "care" and give a lot of attention to our hyped 13-16 yo kids a long time ago. I think Bojan was the last one who I was really hyped about when he came through to the first team but we know what happened. I still watch Barça B (though not as much than when we were in Segunda A) and some of the younger teams when possible and like some kids but I won't jump on a Xavi Simmons, Fati etc. hype train until they are playing and possibly dominating at Barça B (but even then they could easily turn into next Deulofeu).

I like and respect some of the Barça "twitter-verse" people who are watching those kids more regularly and I believe them when they say this or that kid is good. But they are often exagerrating and overhyping calling them worldclass talents etc.. They could be dominating in their league but Barça is often playing only against other teams from the same region. Those kids are not often playing even against the other best players of the same age group from Spain let alone from other countries like France, Brazil,... Sure, there are international tournaments but those are just a few games in a year and even then some of the most talented kids starts playing for big clubs like PSG, Lyon, Gremio,.. later and they could still be at smaller teams (some of them we've never heard of) at the time Barça U14/15 team is playing against those bigger clubs.

Development of players is a complicated process with a lot of factors influencing on how good players will become so is it really fair to put all the blame on just one person like Segura who is not even directly involved in a day-to-day development of the players when things are not going as people want/expect?

I'll give a few examples and use FM terminology like CA(PA (current/potential abilities). I usually don't like to use some made up numbers but think it will be easier to explain this way.

Let's say Messi's CA/PA is 99/99 (I won't give him 100 because he still has some flaws like defending but he's so superior in other atributes that this doesn't matter much) and Xavi and Iniesta were 95/95 in their prime. So these are players who were the most/among the most talented players we've ever seen and they have fulllfilled their potential and become what they are/were.

Now if we go to Alena for example and assume that his PA was 80 when he was around 16-17 which could be a potential borderline starter but more likely a good squad player at a club like Barça. Nowadays let's say his CA is around 70 but his PA has dropped to 75. Which means while he's still young enough to improve a bit he probably doesn't have a longterm future at the club though he could still make it.

Whose fault is this? He didn't have any longterm injuries (like Rafinha) so we can't put most blame on them. Are La Masia/Barça B coaches or maybe first team coach the most responsible? Or was it maybe just a natural regression for whatever reason. Maybe he never had as much potential as people believed when he was younger? Or maybe his own flaws are limiting him from reaching his potential.

Technical and/or physical strengths/weaknesses can often be seen quickly but there is also a more "hidden" mental aspect of the game that usually separate great players from good ones. I'm not saying this is the case with Alena but it could be.

Most Barça youth players are technically good enough to at least be considered as a first team potential one day so their mentality (and in some cases like Riqui Puig also their physicality) will be what will often make or break their future at the top level. Are they strong enough to go through adversity in their careers that will undoubtely happen? How is their work ethic? If we have two players with a similar talent level and one is always giving 120% at every training/game (like Pedro for example) while the other one thinks his talent will be enough to take him through his career (I think G2S is a pretty good example) then it's obvious who has the better odds to make it at the top level. Even less talented players with better work ethic/professionalism will usually make better careers than more talented kids who don't take things seriously enough.

So while overall club philosophy and structural changes are important and have influenced some of recent La Masia products I don't think we can only blame current board for the lack of potential first team products out of La Masia. Golden generation was more the exception to the rule than something we should normally expect. Comparable to them we are getting less talented players (with lower PA) into La Masia so it's impossible to produce the same players even if the club would do everything right. We should lower our general expectations about La Masia players a bit imo but at the same time still do more to help (because that's the club's role here, at the end there are always the players who are the most responsible for their own careers) developing the existing talent as close to their full potential as we can but it's still questionable if this will be enough for them to have a first team future at the club.

Only time will tell if replacing Segura and other changes the club is planning this summer will bring better longterm results and let's hope for the best.
 
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Messi983

Messi983

Senior Member
It was already reported in January/February as a done deal and now Barça has officially confirmed signing of Chadi Riad (16, CB) from Real Mallorca. He'll start playing for Juvenil B.

[tw]1154453929348014081[/tw]

Can't find much about this kid but welcome and good luck anyway.
 
Leo_Messi

Leo_Messi

New member
[youtube]cQYioqQ59v4[/youtube]

7 years and 2 months has passed since that historic game was played.

11 canteranos on the pitch all at the same time. Historic.

MMD_1060103_e97b42b6febd47f48bd2e4a18ff6235d_futbol_25_11_12_el_dia_que_el_barca_jugo_con_11_canteranos.jpg


Those were the days.

Thiago was one of the substitutes as well.
 
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Messi983

Messi983

Senior Member
Juvenil A will play against Inter in 40 minutes. Ilaix starting on the bench.

[tw]1179377992008699904[/tw]

[tw]1179378648979312640[/tw]
 
Sorin

Sorin

Well-known member
Inter leads after a nice free kick. Absolutely deserved as they already had about 3 big chances before this goal.

A lot of fluff without any substance from our team today. Also getting physically dominated. Too early to tell but so far no one looks like a standout from this team.
 
Messi983

Messi983

Senior Member
There are some early question marks about Valdes but don't know if it's fair to only blame him. This team is pretty young and besides Ilaix (who's still only 16) I don't think there is any specially talented player in the lineup we've played with yesterday. Fati is with the first team and VV also didn't call up some Barça B players like Jandro Orellana and Marques who could still play in UYL. Louie Barry and Konrad De La Fuente were also ineligible to play.
 
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