Valverde wont be long in taking away all the good traits the boy has.
Frenkie de Jong
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Valverde wont be long in taking away all the good traits the boy has.
serghei
Senior Member
I do not think him replacing Busi would be a very good idea under present conditions. I'd rather get a stronger DM, in the Yaya Toure mold, and use Arthur and Frenkie next to him.
His license to move from his position and attack space under Valverde as a DM will be virtually non existent. Some of his biggest traits of his game would remain hidden in that positions.
People need to understand that, the more rigid a system is, the more it reduces players to the core qualities traditionally associated with that position. Without fluidity and freedom of movement, prime Busquets is a worse defensive midfielder than Makelele, Casemiro, Gatusso, Essien types at their peak. Because many of the things Busi is much better than those mentioned at would never get the same exposure under Simeone, Mourinho, Valverde types, as it did under a proactive, total-football fanatic like Pep.
Players like Busi and De Jong bring a lot of technical qualities to that position that are left largely unused without playing fluid football where players are allowed to move in and out of space.
And issue is fluid football and Valverde are like water and oil. They don't mix. De Jong is only 'good' at defending. You can find better and more physical DMs for that who can still be decent passers.
People who say De Jong is the next Busi forget that if Valverde ever had to choose between Yaya and Busi at DM back when that was the choice to make, he would've chosen Yaya no doubt. Hell, If we had Ernie in 2009 chances are we wouldn't know the name Sergio Busquets very well today.
The profile of Toure fits the system Valverde uses better than that of Bus/De Jong. People need to realise we're playing a football where core qualities are more important for a position, than being well-rounded or having many secondary skills. Those types of things become much more important when you add off the ball movement, which we have abandoned since Guardiola left more or less. When the movement is low, the main, traditional qualities tied to a position are the most important.
Core qualities for the DM positions are good strenght, great workrate, very good tackling ability and use of the body to stand off opponents. Whatever DM we play under Valverde is better off with that type of main qualities. Busi has neither arguably. How many of those does De Jong have?
His license to move from his position and attack space under Valverde as a DM will be virtually non existent. Some of his biggest traits of his game would remain hidden in that positions.
People need to understand that, the more rigid a system is, the more it reduces players to the core qualities traditionally associated with that position. Without fluidity and freedom of movement, prime Busquets is a worse defensive midfielder than Makelele, Casemiro, Gatusso, Essien types at their peak. Because many of the things Busi is much better than those mentioned at would never get the same exposure under Simeone, Mourinho, Valverde types, as it did under a proactive, total-football fanatic like Pep.
Players like Busi and De Jong bring a lot of technical qualities to that position that are left largely unused without playing fluid football where players are allowed to move in and out of space.
And issue is fluid football and Valverde are like water and oil. They don't mix. De Jong is only 'good' at defending. You can find better and more physical DMs for that who can still be decent passers.
People who say De Jong is the next Busi forget that if Valverde ever had to choose between Yaya and Busi at DM back when that was the choice to make, he would've chosen Yaya no doubt. Hell, If we had Ernie in 2009 chances are we wouldn't know the name Sergio Busquets very well today.
The profile of Toure fits the system Valverde uses better than that of Bus/De Jong. People need to realise we're playing a football where core qualities are more important for a position, than being well-rounded or having many secondary skills. Those types of things become much more important when you add off the ball movement, which we have abandoned since Guardiola left more or less. When the movement is low, the main, traditional qualities tied to a position are the most important.
Core qualities for the DM positions are good strenght, great workrate, very good tackling ability and use of the body to stand off opponents. Whatever DM we play under Valverde is better off with that type of main qualities. Busi has neither arguably. How many of those does De Jong have?
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Vilarrubi
New member
Agreed.. Ndombele would be nice for CDM. Physical, technical and decent pace.
serghei
Senior Member
He would fit the profile that is needed. Kondogbia, Kante, Casemiro are other types who would fit well with Ernie's tactics. Lucrative strong midfielders who are solid on defense in an individual way. When you play 4-3-3 without a lot of off the ball movement and fluidity it means the DM is often isolated form his teammates. Which is what happens with Busi. Most of the cases when he loses the ball are down to him not having support quickly and not being strong enough to hold off other players on his own. Opponents know this very well. As soon as an opponent is very close to Busi he can just strip him of the ball with relative ease. This is because, he is neither quick, strong, nor does he know how to protect the ball. Which is why he loses the ball in physical duels and then cries four fouls. This would not happen in a mobile midfield where players move off the ball to provide him with options before the pressing on him becomes hard to deal with. Nor would it happen with a strong and aggresive DM who is very hard to be stripped off the ball by way of a standard physical contact.
It is important to see Todibo in action at defensive midfield position too. Based on the short highlights he seems strong, fast, and not bad with the ball at all. Some key qualities for a classic DM the way Valverde would probably want. If he's great, and I understand he played DM before being a central defender, then we can have options for a Todibo - Arthur - Frenkie de Jong midfield, with Todibo as the strong DM type and Arthur - De Jong as our creative center in midfield. Similarly to how Casemiro - Modric & Kroos worked under Zidane.
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wisconsincule
Senior Member
Looks like he got hurt today. Unreal luck for Ronaldo and Juve
Marchisio8
Banned
Unreal luck for Ronaldo and Juve
For the first tie: Chiellini, Emre Can, Cuadrado, Caceres, Barzagli was out
Ronaldo just made it for the game and wasn't match fit, same for Douglas Costa who was injured for months before his first game in Ajax, Dybala, Spinazzola, Perin and De Sciglio had knocks/doubtful before the game aswell.
Khedira just made it back after heart surgery, not matchfit neither and Matuidi even got injured in the game.
Lucky Juve
Marchisio8
Banned
Oh no, Ajax missing one player, god damn Juve and their luck. Those bastards.
Leets see a fully fit Juve destroy Ajax.
Leets see a fully fit Juve destroy Ajax.
gregorrin10
Senior Member
He also got hurt right before the 1st leg (he didn't need to be subbed off then true) and he still played the 1st leg no problem, hopefully this is something similar in terms of being minor and that he was only taken out of precaution (remember they were already leading at this point too) and that he'll be ready on Tuesday.
Ajax has a really small squad compared to Juve.
Ronaldo alone costs more than their whole squad lol.
Frenkie is one of their best players. So, ya, it has nothing to do with luck. But without Frenkie Juve has a 'bigger' chance to win.
Juve is clearly top favorite with or without Frenkie.
Still think Ajax has a fair chance vs Juve (even against a fully fitted squad). The pressure is on Juve.
Ajax will just do what they always do in these kind of games; Attacking and pressing like hell.
Let's hope for another entertainment game (the other quarter finals were pretty boring). May the best win.
Another fucktard
wisconsincule
Senior Member
What are you doing here again you fucking douche?
Marchisio8
Banned
Having a civil conversation, I doubt you know what that is, but I don't blame you, most people from favelas don't.
wisconsincule
Senior Member
FCBfan22
Senior Member
He is Jair's alternate personality... Only appears when PSG gets shafted by a bunch of youngsters in the CL.
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