Gerardo "Tata" Martino

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Flavia

Guest
I just don't get how people can turn their backs on players there were so important to Barça. Selling Iniesta? I'll give him more time before asking for his head. Puyol and Xavi got older, but there's no one to give a rest to Xavi in the squad.

Barça needs reinforcements, but sometimes to me you guys go to far.

And it's not about being trapped in the past. The motivation issues weren't there until recently, and I'm sure the players can overcome this.
 

Sumlit

San Claudio Bravo
Like I said, great post. There are some things still I do not agree. E.g non scoring wingers- stats of this season tells something different and I also would not say they lack speed. But, of course, they have their limits, but I think Neymar has very important role to play to overcome this.
Anyhow, this eternal idioliziation of Pep and golden era is getting out of hand. To use a word "spoiled" might be a strecth and also it has been used a bit overwhelmingly to point a finger to some posters here, but really, Barca cannot have a golden era non-stop. owever, this has been said again and again, no news here. My concern is that this "golden era" serves as a measure for every single game that Barca plays. You can't be pragmatic nowadays, you can not grind out results, no, no, this is Barca and we have to trash every parking bus, we have to run over every opponent in Copa, La Liga and CL group stages, otherwise we are doomed etc etc. At the same time same people are overjoyed if we manage to win against Madrid Real even if we play pragmatically and rely on a bit of luck. Hypocrisy?
Let's face it- we are in transition and so far we are doing it by still competing for trophies and still winning games and still producing some magic here and there. We have been extremely lucky to see some unbelieveable things couple a years ago but as always things change and you have to adapt as well. It could be much much worse, but I really do not see much patience in this forum, everything should delivered into gold as it once was in point blank and in blink of the eye, otherwise it is incompetence or just averageness.


Our wingers are not reliable scorers, even Neymar. You take 2 games away from each of these players, and you effectively cut their scoring output in half. Then you see an unreliable scoring bunch. What that says is stats show they have a nice scoring number, however that is inflated by a couple of games where they scored a hattrick and a brace. Aside from those two games, they are very inconsistent in scoring. You see a blip and spike of 3 goals in a game, in the middle of a 5 or 6 stretch of games where they did not score at all. That's a problem.

You need forwards you can depend on to score for you on most days. You need forwards who can score for you from situations that they themselves have created, not so much from situations handed to them by the team creating a scoring play. How many goals has Alexis scored where it just gets served for him by a great team play? VS tough opponent the likelihood a team play will succeed in creating a tap in for a forward is much, much reduced. In those games you need forwards who create scoring out of nothing. The team had that once, when they had a Villa, an Eto'o, a Henry.

I agree with the rest of your post though.
 

Sumlit

San Claudio Bravo
I just don't get how people can turn their backs on players there were so important to Barça. Selling Iniesta? I'll give him more time before asking for his head. Puyol and Xavi got older, but there's no one to give a rest to Xavi in the squad.

Barça needs reinforcements, but sometimes to me you guys go to far.

And it's not about being trapped in the past. The motivation issues weren't there until recently, and I'm sure the players can overcome this.


Selling Iniesta is truly going too far. He has still a lot to offer, and even though he has been up and down, you see he still has years of great football to come. The team just needs reinforcements in other areas to allow for the players who are still here and capable of still delivering, to deliver.
 

serghei

Senior Member
I just don't get how people can turn their backs on players there were so important to Barça. Selling Iniesta? I'll give him more time before asking for his head. Puyol and Xavi got older, but there's no one to give a rest to Xavi in the squad.

Barça needs reinforcements, but sometimes to me you guys go to far.

And it's not about being trapped in the past. The motivation issues weren't there until recently, and I'm sure the players can overcome this.

Like Bojan said, change sometimes means letting some of your favourite players go. That is if we want to win titles. If we don't, than we mustn't do anything. We can play like we do now and we will still win 4-0 against Getafe.
 
I agree with Flavia... Xavi should probably play less but not be sold if he doesn't want to, or be forced into early retirement.
Selling Iniesta is waaaay to premature.
Truth is we need a CB , an great midfielder and a CF
 
F

Flavia

Guest
Like Bojan said, change sometimes means letting some of your favourite players go. That is if we want to win titles. If we don't, than we mustn't do anything. We can play like we do now and we will still win 4-0 against Getafe.

If we want to win titles, selling Iniesta or Messi is not the way to go.
When pep took over, he sold dinho and Deco because we had Xavi and Iniesta. So we sell him in whose behalf? Cesc? Roberto? I'm sorry, but no. Selling Thiago has already proven to be a terrible move. Iniesta is not like dinho and Deco were back then. Last season was his best, and yesterday the team improved as soon as he got in the pitch.
 

serghei

Senior Member
Selling Iniesta is truly going too far. He has still a lot to offer, and even though he has been up and down, you see he still has years of great football to come. The team just needs reinforcements in other areas to allow for the players who are still here and capable of still delivering, to deliver.

It's not about age, as it is about milleage. Iniesta's been playing on football's first stage since 2005. That almost 10 years. After 10 years doing the same thing day in day out. in the same city, against the same teams, it's easy to lose the motivation. Maybe he should not be sold - probably he won't be -, but it's pretty clear he's not the same player he was.
 

Sumlit

San Claudio Bravo
Me too. Atlético improved a lot, and with pretty much the same squad that was called patético.

Atletico had young players who needed motivation, guidance, experience and development. Barca are not in that situation.

Tata might very well not be the answer for Barcelona long term, however any manager you bring will face the same situation with the personnel in this team. I'd rather get him the freedom to make the changes he wants, and then judge him from that point.
 

serghei

Senior Member
If we want to win titles, selling Iniesta or Messi is not the way to go.
When pep took over, he sold dinho and Deco because we had Xavi and Iniesta. So we sell him in whose behalf? Cesc? Roberto? I'm sorry, but no. Selling Thiago has already proven to be a terrible move. Iniesta is not like dinho and Deco were back then. Last season was his best, and yesterday the team improved as soon as he got in the pitch.

Iniesta was just an example. The main idea is we need to let some stars go this summer.
 

serghei

Senior Member
Atletico had young players who needed motivation, guidance, experience and development. Barca are not in that situation.

Tata might very well not be the answer for Barcelona long term, however any manager you bring will face the same situation with the personnel in this team. I'd rather get him the freedom to make the changes he wants, and then judge him from that point.

Tata said he's happy with the team. I think he thinks our problem are less serious than they really are. He's not approaching the issue as he should IMO.
 

rixxer

New member
Me too. Atlético improved a lot, and with pretty much the same squad that was called patético.

And if they slip under the bus from now, considering how poor they were against Madrid in Copa, what then? Get a new manager instead of Cholo? After few difficult moments the solution is to change a coach? Even more, are we even in crisis?
Sorry, after great first half of the season, after couple of difficult setbacks just to say that we need a new manager... it is knee jerk.
 

Djab

New member
And if they slip under the bus from now, considering how poor they were against Madrid in Copa, what then? Get a new manager instead of Cholo? After few difficult moments the solution is to change a coach? Even more, are we even in crisis?
Sorry, after great first half of the season, after couple of difficult setbacks just to say that we need a new manager... it is knee jerk.

It's just my thought. Give Tata a season and give him the right to change everything that is not needed. We'll see the results when we do that.
 
F

Flavia

Guest
And if they slip under the bus from now, considering how poor they were against Madrid in Copa, what then? Get a new manager instead of Cholo? After few difficult moments the solution is to change a coach? Even more, are we even in crisis?
Sorry, after great first half of the season, after couple of difficult setbacks just to say that we need a new manager... it is knee jerk.

I just don't like the way things are headed. Simeone was just an example of what a more passionate coach can bring.
Tata is insisting with some bad choices, as playing Masch instead of Bartra. The bench is limited for cm, but he could try something to rest Xavi more. Also Cesc. But he doesn't seem to have the guts to do it.
 

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