Lionel Messi - v7

[Rory]

What's nice is this game showed we do have some sort of a team and unity. A lot of players were inexperienced, some back from injury and haven't really played together too much and the first half was evidence of this. Yes it's only Dynamo away but it shows if we add a couple of quality signings we can definitely be heading in the right direction to winning la liga and a respectable UCL campaign. Having Messi in the xi lifts the quality of incisive passes and chances created but reduces this team feling and unity. He simply needs to be used more conservatively. Leaving him out for this game is a great sign that maybe Koeman has realised this?

Also bbz we all know you're not even remotely sad writing these things about Messi. You seem to enjoy it. Also you were blaming coutinho's poor form and playing to the left on Messi but he still did that yesterday without him or Griezmann on the pitch.

 

[eaman]

Ronaldo can run and move off the ball so he can still play football to some extent.

Messi is more suitable for sports where you don't need to move.
Like chess or darts.

On one hand, I am sad to write these things about Messi, but he is not even a starter material anymore.

Come on messi still runs and makes runs. Maybe not as much as 5 years ago but it's not as little as people make out. A new team and challenge with a top manager like guardiola and you will more than likely see a different messi

 

[CatalinR10]

Let's hope The GOAT , The Best Fifa Football Player , Ballon D'or and Laureus award scores against Osasuna.


@Pedro



@KingLeo10



@Vilarrubi



@Hardy



@Devils



@Malvolio

The comeback starts Sunday.


The GOAT to score 2 goals.

HOPE.

 

[Andresito]

The comeback starts Sunday.


The GOAT to score 2 goals.

HOPE.

#rested
#FreshStart

 

[serghei]

Come on messi still runs and makes runs. Maybe not as much as 5 years ago but it's not as little as people make out. A new team and challenge with a top manager like guardiola and you will more than likely see a different messi

A new team and a new manager could remotivate him for a short while, like one or 2 years max. As far as his Barca level is concerned, he moves and makes runs like a retired player. Not anywhere near at least a decent level.

 

[Daniele]

Ronaldo can run and move off the ball so he can still play football to some extent.

Messi is more suitable for sports where you don't need to move.
Like chess or darts.

On one hand, I am sad to write these things about Messi, but he is not even a starter material anymore.

this is very disappointing of you:
you forgot clay pigeon shooting

 

[Marie-Antoinette]

Yea. More and more people are finally realizing how poor he is in several areas. When even Suarez works a lot more than you, it's time to retire or go to play in the US where fans cheer all goals, even the ones against their team.

Another dumb, condescendant and limit racist post.
I've been to the LA Galaxy Stadium, the mood was great, the game was more than watchable.
Plus it was 4th of July with the presentation of Gerrard.
Stay grumpy in you hole moron and don't judge what you don't know.

 

[BBZ8800]

A new team and a new manager could remotivate him for a short while, like one or 2 years max. As far as his Barca level is concerned, he moves and makes runs like a retired player. Not anywhere near at least a decent level.

I don't see how anything could revive him for more than 3 weeks.

He is absolutely finished on a level of Top20 clubs in Europe.

He is declining heavily week in and week out for the whole 2020.
Not only that it can't be reversed, but it will probably go even faster from now on.

2-3 Months ago: only a few of us were saying that he is done. People called us idiots.
Lately more and more people who defended him realized how much he has declined.
Today in November, some of us are already saying that he is not a starter material anymore.

Now, look at how much has he declined in the last 3 Months.
Now, if he will decline at the same rate in the next 3 Months, ask yourself how will he play in February.
Way worse than today.
And then, add 3 more Months of a decline from February to May.

Ok, a decline maybe won't be linear, but you get the point: till the end of the season, he will probably decline twice as much as in the last 3 Months where he has 1 goal from an open play in iirc 15 matches and zero goals in 11 vs 11.

Now, when you sum it all, how likely is that he will be able to play serious football in August of 2021, let alone improving his level?

 

[Daniele]

I don't see how anything could revive him for more than 3 weeks.

He is absolutely finished on a level of Top20 clubs in Europe.

He is declining heavily week in and week out for the whole 2020.
Not only that it can't be reversed, but it will probably go even faster from now on.

2-3 Months ago: only a few of us were saying that he is done. People called us idiots.
Lately more and more people who defended him realized how much he has declined.
Today in November, some of us are already saying that he is not a starter material anymore.

Now, look at how much has he declined in the last 3 Months.
Now, if he will decline at the same rate in the next 3 Months, ask yourself how will he play in February.
Way worse than today.
And then, add 3 more Months of a decline from February to May.

Ok, a decline maybe won't be linear, but you get the point: till the end of the season, he will probably decline twice as much as in the last 3 Months where he has 1 goal from an open play in iirc 15 matches and zero goals in 11 vs 11.

Now, when you sum it all, how likely is that he will be able to play serious football in August of 2021, let alone improving his level?

Good point.
There is a lot of mathematical wisdom here.
However, you do not consider that by adding two identical figures you get the square of their driving force divided by the age of Messi multiplied by the km he travels during the games

 

[Luftstalag14]

I don't see how anything could revive him for more than 3 weeks.

He is absolutely finished on a level of Top20 clubs in Europe.

He is declining heavily week in and week out for the whole 2020.
Not only that it can't be reversed, but it will probably go even faster from now on.

2-3 Months ago: only a few of us were saying that he is done. People called us idiots.
Lately more and more people who defended him realized how much he has declined.
Today in November, some of us are already saying that he is not a starter material anymore.

Now, look at how much has he declined in the last 3 Months.
Now, if he will decline at the same rate in the next 3 Months, ask yourself how will he play in February.
Way worse than today.
And then, add 3 more Months of a decline from February to May.

Ok, a decline maybe won't be linear, but you get the point: till the end of the season, he will probably decline twice as much as in the last 3 Months where he has 1 goal from an open play in iirc 15 matches and zero goals in 11 vs 11.

Now, when you sum it all, how likely is that he will be able to play serious football in August of 2021, let alone improving his level?

Unless you put together a data science-driven model to predict the above, this is all mumbo jumbo, as to how fast he will further decline and to what point he will cease to play "serious football".

Yes he has declined a lot, yes he has become much less effective, but to say he is done is hyperbole. He can still have good games here and there (not necessarily scoring goals). If planned and used smartly he can be much more effective, which is what I think City will do, if they get him.

 

[Ritchie]

It would only be 2-3 years then off to America in the rumoured offer.

Can see him in Manchester if thinks that is best place for him to be on footballing side and financially.

It's not though. He hasn't got the legs for the PL and going there at 34 past his best won't help his legacy. Might give him a better chance of winning the CL again at least which he won't at Barca.

He should go to Italy or PSG.

 

[Ritchie]

I don't see how anything could revive him for more than 3 weeks.

He is absolutely finished on a level of Top20 clubs in Europe.

He is declining heavily week in and week out for the whole 2020.
Not only that it can't be reversed, but it will probably go even faster from now on.

2-3 Months ago: only a few of us were saying that he is done. People called us idiots.
Lately more and more people who defended him realized how much he has declined.
Today in November, some of us are already saying that he is not a starter material anymore.

Now, look at how much has he declined in the last 3 Months.
Now, if he will decline at the same rate in the next 3 Months, ask yourself how will he play in February.
Way worse than today.
And then, add 3 more Months of a decline from February to May.

Ok, a decline maybe won't be linear, but you get the point: till the end of the season, he will probably decline twice as much as in the last 3 Months where he has 1 goal from an open play in iirc 15 matches and zero goals in 11 vs 11.

Now, when you sum it all, how likely is that he will be able to play serious football in August of 2021, let alone improving his level?

He's obviously declined but the key is whether he can adapt his game to deal with the physical decline which has finally really hurt his level. Don't forget he was still the best player in the world in 2019 and carried a poor side to a title and the brink of a treble.

Ronaldo isn't the player he was but he's adapted his game to just stay in the box and feed off the service he gets and score lots of penalties. Messi by contrast goes deeper and deeper where he's less and less effective. If he does go to City you wonder what Pep has planned for him because Pep doesn't carry passengers.

Problem at Barca is staying up top and waiting for service isn't going to work. Same with Argentina. Partly because of the lack of service he'd get and quality around him but also he's small and not got the presence as a penalty box striker that Ronaldo and Zlatan have in Italy or Lewandowski or Haaland in Germany. What he could do in the right team is a similar job to Salah.

 

[serghei]

I don't see how anything could revive him for more than 3 weeks.

He is absolutely finished on a level of Top20 clubs in Europe.

He is declining heavily week in and week out for the whole 2020.
Not only that it can't be reversed, but it will probably go even faster from now on.

2-3 Months ago: only a few of us were saying that he is done. People called us idiots.
Lately more and more people who defended him realized how much he has declined.
Today in November, some of us are already saying that he is not a starter material anymore.

Now, look at how much has he declined in the last 3 Months.
Now, if he will decline at the same rate in the next 3 Months, ask yourself how will he play in February.
Way worse than today.
And then, add 3 more Months of a decline from February to May.

Ok, a decline maybe won't be linear, but you get the point: till the end of the season, he will probably decline twice as much as in the last 3 Months where he has 1 goal from an open play in iirc 15 matches and zero goals in 11 vs 11.

Now, when you sum it all, how likely is that he will be able to play serious football in August of 2021, let alone improving his level?

But, this is actually showing that some of his problems are form related as well. Because the certainty of physical decline is not visible to such a fine degree as from week to week. The thing that makes you play worse from week to week is maybe tiredness, loss of motivation, form etc. Physical decline is materialized and visible on longer spells. Don't think he is there yet physically. I think it's more a problem of attitude, mentality, and professionalism with him. Basically, he's more lazy, uninterested, and unprofessional, than done physically.

As you say physical decline is not linear. His current level is terrible. He might be able to improve that even if he is older if he changes how he treats his profession.

A move to a different club could be a spike in regards to these things, simply it's something new, and newness excites and motivates by itself. This will fade away, but it could still make him play better for 1-2 years than what he is showing now.

 

[malvolio]

The comeback starts Sunday.


The GOAT to score 2 goals.

HOPE.

 

[BBZ8800]

As you say physical decline is not linear. His current level is terrible. He might be able to improve that even if he is older if he changes how he treats his profession

Has Xavi ever returned to form after a decline in 2014/15?

Has Iniesta ever returned after his last season at Barca where he was mostly a ghost with a good games here and there?

9 out of 10 footballers are done at this age.
Except guys like Zlatan and CR7 who are physical beasts and motivated maniacs.

They both survived because they turned into some sort of targetmen in the box.
They don't dribble or sprint that much.
They don't rely on runs behind defense and pace.

They both rely on crosses/headers and smart movement in the box to get into a right place for a tap in.

Now:
1. Can Messi rely on crosses and headers like 195 cm tall Zlatan and 187 cm tall Cr7?
No
2. Can he rely on smart off the ball movement and tap ins?
Not really, he has never done that, since he was never on a receiving end of passes BUT the guy who was creating passes.
Zlatan and Cr7 are scoring tap ins for the last 10 years, Messi can barely score today.
3. Also, those two seem to be in a way better physical shape unlike Messi, so they had better chances to prolong their careers.

Messi basically don't know how to play anything else than a CAM role.
And yet he will be slower and slower each week and easier to tackle and dispossed which will lead to more and more counters and we will be killed by Messipendencia.
Not to mention his pressing and defending.

No offense to Messi, but I don't see how he could change his style and prolong his career.

That is a guy who doesn't allow you to bench him at 5:0 vs Levante.
He don't wanna change his CAM style, plus he'll be inefective as a striker due to his lost pace, being short and poor off the ball movement.

Messi as a striker is as crazy idea as him playing as Xavi.

He is a hybrid false 9-Cam and that's it.

And he don't have legs for it anymore.