Luis Enrique

[Behrox]

Those going on and on about how unlucky we were not to win today and how good we were while bashing everyone who says otherwise need a reality check. Let me lay out what I make out of Lucho's "tactics":
1) FBs provide width
2) Attacks go through the wing rather than the middle
3) Messi plays like a scoring 10
4) Forwards play narrower or a pseudo wingers
5) Mids cover for FBs
If you have any sort of imagination you can see just how much these tactics counteract each other. For example, you want a player like Messi, one that thrives on one-touch quick short passing football, to play in the middle of the pitch (in the hole) while you want the attacking plays going through the wing. You see what you have here thats right Messi getting isolated, he isn't the center of the plays dictating the transition to the attack but instead its has been Alves who thinks Crouch plays for our team meaning cross after cross after cross (replace cross with turnover). And if these turnovers weren't enough, you are also effectively stifling your best weapon i.e, the midfield. If anyone tells me Rakitic, the man that was running the show at Sevilla, is not creative enough to send one through ball to our forwards I would refer you to a psychiatrist for mental treatment. The problem is that the midfielders are so wide spread that they can't get any sort of short passing game going leaving the DM in the hole aswell. This is just only one of the things tactically wrong to the core of the team. Now based on this try judging last night's performance and you'll see the fundamental faults in the team that has nothing to do with personnel (expect Dani) and can be fixed with the proper tactical changes

 

[Icarium]

If he can't win against Ajax he should get the sack. At least if he tries to change somethings i would give him some more time. But if he repeats the same mistakes again there is no reason why he should stay.

 

[Behrox]

If he can't win against Ajax he should get the sack. At least if he tries to change somethings i would give him some more time. But if he repeats the same mistakes again there is no reason why he should stay.

its been 10 games (in the league) and I am yet to see a mistake rectified by Lucho till now

 

[Gohan]

I think we saw yesterday, how much Pedro really can offer for MSN. He is so much more dangerous than Alves (he is a striker/winger, i know).

Xavi did quite well on the offensive midfield.

Rackitic worked his ass off, but he was really not creative enough in that match. Lacked confidence?

Alves did close-to-nothing right.

Suarez is NO winger, and he HAS to play in the centre.

Now guys, take a look at Bayern Münich. 3-4-3 formation. 3 solid defenders, 2 wingers, 2 central midfielders (one more offensive minded and one more defensive minded) and 3 up top. The 3-4-3 formation can easyli be tweaked into a 3-4-1-2 formation. I think we should try it out.

------------ Bravo
- Bartra | Mascherano | Mathieu
Pedro | Rackitic | Busquets | Alba
------------ Messi
------ Suarez | Neymar

Pedro and Alba going wide and creating space. Rackitic going up next to Messi when attacking creating more danger in that area (two players who can really shoot and pass a ball). Busquets right behind them.

Also in counter-attacks this team would work really well due to the speed of Alba, Pedro, and MSN.

I agree, Pep's Bayern is creating alot in attack and they are solid at the back. But Bayern have different players keep that in mind. Players like Alaba and that Bernat provide full workrate 90 minutes. We can't expect that from Alves or our midfielders who rarely track back when the opposition are counter attacking. I am not saying we should copy Bayern or Pep's style. But what we can is make a system to bring the best out of players. And that is using Suarez as a real #9. I mean we payed 85million euros for the world's best striker to use him on the wing? I know we did it in the past with Henry and Eto'o but that just doesn't work anymore. I really hope Lucho sees this.

 

[Ghostmaster]

Cool story. If Klopp was here and 16th, there would be mass suicides on this forum.

Hell, Klopp would have been ditched weeks ago with insults and death threats.

I feel like with people here, you could get the best coach ever, at the first problem, you would sack him.

Seriously that was funny to read that some of you want Tata back after all the shits you all wrote here about him.

It's like running in circle. But yeah, get a new coach, it will be the same shit unless said coach has a "perfect" season.

We need continuity, new manager every season is hurting us.

 

[Hamzah]

For me, the formation would be

........ Bravo
Alves Bartra Mathieu Alba
.....Rakitic Busquets
Iniesta Messi Neymar
......... Suarez

We would get back to a clear philosophy based on keeping the ball and dominating the middle of the pitch.

Btw masch would come in for Busi or Bartra.

 

[Kasperroed]

For me one of the real problems of this team is workrate. We have 3 strikers who do absolutely nothing when defending. Busquets i quite slow. Alves is not fast enough to track back. Xavi/Iniesta are not good enough defensively.

IMO we have 4 players who give a 100% effort throughout a match; Rackitic, Mascherano, Mathieu and Alba. We need more of this!

I say pedro for RB or RWB.

 

[BBZ8800]

3 seasons in a row with coaching-gambles now. Getting tiring.

That is because the board doesn't want to hire a new coach who would implement his own style.
It seems that we will hire weaker coaches for the next 20 years in order to try to replicate Pep's style/Barca's Dna style/all that nonsense.

Pep's era is gone. Xavi is gone. Nobody will ever play as good as him.
Our Tiki-Taka is dead without Xavi in his prime. And without Messi who can score 100 Goals per Season.

And every single team in the world learned how to neutralize our 433.
It is not a godlike formation.
There are other decent formations also.
Move on.

We are worse and worse each new season with this poor replicas of Pep's era.

 

[Cholo]

Barca got the wrong Celta manager, just like Tottenham got the wrong Southampton manager.

 

[BBZ8800]

Is it just me or is it so hard to rewatch the damn match and see where the fuk our midfield stands? Is that so complex?
Midfield used to be our signature, but now it's a farcry, an averge and outclassed by anyone.

Midfield was our signature, but it is getting weaker and weaker each Season lately.
Tito's midfield was good enough for La Liga, but not good enough for Europe.
Tata's midfield wasn't good enough even for La Liga anymore.
Lucho's midfield has realistic chances to end on the 3rd or 4th place at the end of the Season.

People here are giving 1000s of proposals, Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets, Rakitic, Mascherano, Samper in 1000s of combinations.
But again, what if players aren't guilty anymore, and if it is system's fault? It is almost irrelevant who plays, it is the same crap in all combinations.
But not only Lucho's current 433 with Mcs covering for fullbacks is the problem, but our 433 with only 3 midfielders in general.

Last season our midfield wasn't babysitting fullbacks, but we were still a crap compared with Pep's era.
So, it isn't only Lucho's fault.
433 is deteriorating each Season.
Imo, even Pep would have problems today with his formation from 2008'.

In Pep's era, we had:
= only 3 midfielders, which is a dangerous thing, but we had:
-- Xavi on his prime
-- Iniesta on his prime
-- Busquets in good form
-- Messi in his prime who was helping to a midfield
-- Alves who was helping to a midfield

1. Xavi is not the same player. We lost the brain of 433
2. Iniesta is not the same player
3. Busquets is not the same player
4. Alves doesn't help offensively and defensively as in those days
5. Messi doesn't help either like in those days

My point is:
= 433 is a very risky formation and you can lose the midfield battle unless your players are on their prime and unless they are playing perfectly
-- with Messi, Xavi, Iniesta and Alves past their prime, our 433 is becoming a joke
-- we are outnumbered in midfield by any team, plus Alves and Messi aren't helping to a midfield as in the past

Add to this that everyone knows how we play and how we will play and how to neutralize us.
It is no wonder that we looked clueless against any stronger team in the last 2-3 Seasons.
And that players look without a faith whenever we are 0:1 down.

Over time, even midtable teams like Celta will start to dominate against us.

Who knows, maybe we will finally change something in our formation in 2020' after 8-10 Seasons of misery and realize that Pep's system is not working anymore?

(It's our DNA, and style, we can't change it! Lol)

 

[MagIX]

That is because the board doesn't want to hire a new coach who would implement his own style.
It seems that we will hire weaker coaches for the next 20 years in order to try to replicate Pep's style/Barca's Dna style/all that nonsense.

Pep's era is gone. Xavi is gone. Nobody will ever play as good as him.
Our Tiki-Taka is dead without Xavi in his prime. And without Messi who can score 100 Goals per Season.

And every single team in the world learned how to neutralize our 433.
It is not a godlike formation.
There are other decent formations also.
Move on.

We are worse and worse each new season with this poor replicas of Pep's era.

I agree.
Our 4-3-3 is over. As to say that the 4-3-3 system works eternally, just change sometimes the players: ridiculous. With the available players you create the system, your way to play, not the other way around. The problem is that Lucho and the board have made the transfer market (154mio) planning to continue to play a 4-3-3 formation: defense - Busquets / Iniesta / Rakitic - Neymar /Messi /Suarez.
If we want to play with the trio Neymar / Messi / Suarez, the midfield will be inevitably of 3 players. I do not believe in the 3-4-3.
Given the lack of our midfield, we could play an extra midfielder (4-4-2), but we should sacrifice a striker...

Good luck Lucho !

 

[Maria]

That is because the board doesn't want to hire a new coach who would implement his own style.
It seems that we will hire weaker coaches for the next 20 years in order to try to replicate Pep's style/Barca's Dna style/all that nonsense.

Pep's era is gone. Xavi is gone. Nobody will ever play as good as him.
Our Tiki-Taka is dead without Xavi in his prime. And without Messi who can score 100 Goals per Season.

And every single team in the world learned how to neutralize our 433.
It is not a godlike formation.
There are other decent formations also.
Move on.

We are worse and worse each new season with this poor replicas of Pep's era.

I don't see how Tata was supposed to be a copy of Pep or what "tiki-taka" as you called it(I hate this term) has to do with what we are playing right now. Probably Real Madrid is playing more "tiki-taka" than we do at the moment.

Pep's era is gone. Xavi is gone. Nobody will ever play as good as him.

I would buy this if we atleast had tried to replace him with someone remotelly close to his style. But first we decided to sell Thiago and keep Cesc and then we bought Rakitic instead of a CM who controles posession better, like Kroos.

Our Tiki-Taka is dead without Xavi in his prime. And without Messi who can score 100 Goals per Season.

Messi never scored 100 goals a season and when he was closer to that number we didn't won the CL. Actually in the 2 seasons we won the CL with Pep Messi scored half of those goals, so I don't get how the succes of our play is related with Messi's ability to score 100 goals/season.

Who knows, maybe we will finally change something in our formation in 2020' after 8-10 Seasons of misery and realize that Pep's system is not working anymore?

(It's our DNA, and style, we can't change it! Lol)

1. Pep changed his system every year..so to which system are you reffering?
2. I would have believed it that this was one of Pep's system if the midfield wouldn't be bypased constantly, leaving the defence completely exposed or if there would be even a slight try of positional play.

 

[Rahj]

it will be the same over and over if we continue bringing second rate coaches like lucho. be it mancini, bielsa, rudi garcia or whoever, they are all second rate coaches. there are also first rate coaches who won't be able to manage our team for example simeone, ancelotti, mourinho. the only coaches i can think of for barca right now are klopp, pep and jupp heynckes if the latter miraculously comes out of retirement. if we bring people like hiddink, capello, conte we're doomed. so i pray that klopp takes over.

i hate to break it to you, but i don't think klopp will ever be barca's coach due to the language barrier.

 

[abual3bed1]

Even Pep himself abandoned his 433 and started trying new things out last season, and this season he reached a style that suits his ideas with the set of players he got. Last night, Lucho looked to try and stop the counters by forcing Rakitic and Rafinha wide, leaving the 3 front men with no help at all. I liked the 343/352 thing towards the end and I hope it's the start of new things with Lucho. The same ideas of possession and total football can be done with other systems. I trust Lucho to find the answers soon. He just needs to reach the best XI ASAP to gain momentum and pick up the form. And btw, I now understand Pep's preference of the small but very fit squad.

 

[Ursegor]

Suarez is the hardest working player in the world. When he looks like he does "absolutely nothing when defending" it's because even Usain Bolt can't play centrally in the box with the ball and get goalside of the opponent's leftback in defensive transition without it. Scrubrique's idea to make up for this is that the central midfielders cover the wide areas but again the same problem. Midfielders can't defend wide areas in defensive transition and get back to contributing with intricate passes through the center with the ball. What you get is a shapeless team because CMs are tasked with the workload of 2 players, Alves has to provide wingplay when Suarez is in the center which further amplyfies the workload of the CMs and Neymar and Suarez have no clue which players to close down because they are positioned between CB and FB. Once the fullbacks advance and the CBs release the ball what are Suarez and Neymar supposed to do without the ball? 2 players hanging around in no man's land + Messi being naturally lazy = defending with 7 outfield players and the majority of these 7 aren't even good defenders. Which will never work against any top team. Or any half organized midtable team, baring some individual brilliance. Neymar's speculative long range shot and Messi freekick hitting the post doesn't consitute "playing well and being unlucky". It would have been lucky if they actually scored from those positions.

Scrubrique actually got it right yesterday when he made the subs. 4-2-3-1 is the way to go given the dynamics of the squad right now. Messi behind Suarez, Pedro on the right, Neymar on the left. Neymar and Pedro need to play deeper like wingers and not wide strikers, this way Neymar is also not misused as a poacher for Messi throughballs (such a 1-dimensional tactic) without adding anything else. Clear task for everyone. Suarez presses the centerbacks, Pedro and Neymar track fullbacks and form a bank of 4 with the CMs without the ball, Messi presses the DM, Alves doesn't need to play as a winger and pump in crosses to make up for a lack of real wingers. The team gets a proper SHAPE. Don't expect Scrubrique to make changes though. He'll continue the same tactics and hope that the players magically figure it out with more time.