Mavericky Puig

JamDav1982

Senior Member
No. out of Wijnaldum and De Jong, the one who would be DM the most is De Jong. It means De Jong is mostly DM.

What I wrote simply means that in case De Jong goes up, Wijnaldum would adjust to a more defensive position to keep shape.

Ah the old sole DM with freedom to roam that no team ever play.

I get it.

If that is set up it will be double pivot more or less.
 

serghei

Senior Member
Ah the old sole DM with freedom to roam that no team ever play.

I get it.

If that is set up it will be double pivot more or less.

The double pivot will get Koeman sacked if he tries that in the long run :lol:. 4-3-3 is the best system for Barca and has been so for decades.
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
The double pivot will get Koeman sacked if he tries that in the long run :lol:. 4-3-3 is the best system for Barca and has been so for decades.

Which is what you are describing or some fantasy false DM role that no team can play.

Barca have not played only played 433 for decades either have also played 4231 and 343 etc and other formations and been successful regardless of what suits team better now.
 
Last edited:

serghei

Senior Member
Which is what you are describing or some fantasy false DM role that no team can play.

Barca have not played only played 433 for decades either have also played 4231 and 343 and been successful regardless of what suits team better now.

It's not fantasy. Football is a fluid game with players adjusting positions all the time. It's only natural that when the DM goes up in space, somebody will make some adjustments near him to cover the space he leaves. Otherwise, massive holes appear that any top team will easily exploit.

Like Busi's blunder in the goal of Inaki a few days ago. Lazily staying between the CBs when the midfielders went out to press, leaving the whole midfield empty for Raul Garcia to exploit.
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
It's not fantasy. Football is a fluid game with players adjusting positions all the time. It's only natural that when the DM goes up in space, somebody will make some adjustments near him to cover the space he leaves. Otherwise, massive holes appear that any top team will easily exploit.

Like Busi's blunder in the goal of Inaki a few days ago. Lazily staying between the CBs when the midfielders went out to press, leaving the whole midfield empty for Raul Garcia to exploit.

It is fantasy and is not about players covering for one another or fluidity.

No team will set up with a sole DM that has a box to box role and freedom with it.

All you are doing is restricting FDJ and taking away freedom to play in way that suits him best.

That would be the Bilbao game where FDJ/Pedri helped dominate and you want that midfield dynamic to change to put FDJ back to DM. Aye same game.
 

serghei

Senior Member
It is fantasy and is not about players covering for one another or fluidity.

No team will set up with a sole DM that has a box to box role and freedom with it.

All you are doing is restricting FDJ and taking away freedom to play in way that suits him best.

That would be the Bilbao game where FDJ/Pedri helped dominate and you want that midfield dynamic to change to put FDJ back to DM. Aye same game.

Let me explain.

The DM will have moments where he can push up. For example, when not pressed and presented with some space, he will not hold a position like a robot. If he has the chance to gain space easily and draw markers (thus unlocking a teammate above him), he will have to advance with the ball. In those moments, one or more of the players near the DM will have to make some adjustments as not to leave the space the DM vacates open and vulnerable to counters when opponents appear in that space.

Like here for example. How do you explain that the DM finds himself in a more advanced position than both Messi and Iniesta, the "10" and the "8". Both of which are far more attacking players. The answer is "because he can". He is in the position to use space, and advance the play, and he does. The position you play in doesn't stop you from doing things when opportunities present themselves.

okokbusi.jpg


Your comments don't account for the vast amount of inter-positional movements that happen in football. When you play DM you can still move up, to generate dynamism and superiority, exploit empty spaces, and all that stuff. You just do it less than in more attacking positions, because you have other, more important roles, and not least because the opponent doesn't allow you to.
 
Last edited:

JamDav1982

Senior Member
I get what you are saying but it wont happen as not realistic.

FDJ needs freedom to move regularly and wont suit him and nor would a set up with a CM who always has one eye on the DM to cover for work either.

It would be more or less a double pivot.

Pure fantasy in my opinion and has zero to do with fluidity.

This desperation to get FDJ to DM is strange. If Busi is not good enough replace him and dont restrict FDJ.
 
Last edited:

serghei

Senior Member
I get what you are saying but it wont happen as not realistic.

FDJ needs freedom to move regularly and wont suit him and nor would a set up with a CM who always has one eye on the DM to cover for work either.

It would be more or less a double pivot.

Pure fantasy in my opinion and has zero to do with fluidity.

As I said in one of the other threads, for me finding a DM who can play the role of Busi is much harder than finding a good box to box midfielder. Most top midfielders in the world are box to box. And some have far better offensive potential than De Jong.

I have a feeling you treat the position as of secondary importance. It's much harder to find an elite DM (especially one that is not a pure destroyer and is very comfortable on the ball and has a very high football IQ) than to find a top box to box midfielder.
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
Oh well I am oot on this one and can wait and see if Wijnaldum signs how it is set up.

The midfield as it is now with Busi at DM and not FDJ needs to be judged as a whole and not just on the errors from Busquets.

Have feeling that will be ignored and it will be focused on for every Busi error and miss the point but lets wait and see.
 

xXKonan

Senior Member
As good as Puig has been, I still think he's the odd man out considering how good FDJ and Pedri have really been.

Puig has done pretty well in the chances he gets, but the problem is his main competition has also been excellent as well. Busi is the most vulnerable out of the starting Midfielders, but I'm convinced he's starting most of the time because Koeman doesn't believe Pjanic to be any better than Busi, and Koeman doesn't see FDJ as a Pivot like Busi is.

If Wijnaldum had come I think Busi wouldn't be playing all that much as he has.
 

Raketa10

Senior Member
As good as Puig has been, I still think he's the odd man out considering how good FDJ and Pedri have really been.

Puig has done pretty well in the chances he gets, but the problem is his main competition has also been excellent as well. Busi is the most vulnerable out of the starting Midfielders, but I'm convinced he's starting most of the time because Koeman doesn't believe Pjanic to be any better than Busi, and Koeman doesn't see FDJ as a Pivot like Busi is.

If Wijnaldum had come I think Busi wouldn't be playing all that much as he has.

+1
 

Birdy

Senior Member
If Wijni comes, it will be 4-2-3-1 again with him and Frenkie being the '2' there.

I think it can work perfectly with none of them being fixated at DM, but rather having both play as box to box and one covering the other when joining the attack.
Having seen almost all Liverpool games since 2018, Wijni has performed similar attacking/defensive roles there many many times.
It can work perfectly.
Koeman has rightfully moved on from the static 4-3-3 of the recent years. When Busi gets parked permanently on the bench for a better player, the whole thing can reach higher standards
 

Home of Barca Fans

Top