Nelson Semedo

[Barcilliant]

Messi cannot and will not play on the wing anymore and the 4-4-2 isn't ideal for this team in anyway shape or form. If I were the manager I would drop Suarez and go back to the 4-3-3 (false 9), but if he insists on continuing to shoehorn a shit Suarez into the team I would much rather him go with the 4-2-3-1, where both Messi and Suarez are allowed to play in their natural positions without sacrificing width. We would give up some midfield control playing like this, but it would be better than what we're currently doing.


Suarez

Denis-Messi-Dembele (Roberto or Deulofeu until January)

Paulinho/Roberto-Busquets

Alba-Umtiti-Pique-Semedo

Stegen

442 is retarded for a team like Barca. I agree with the 4231. Both Messi and Suarez cannot play on the wings. I just don't see what Valverde is trying. Fucking Gomes and Rakitic on the flanks? Lol

 

[MessiCam]

Messi cannot and will not play on the wing anymore and the 4-4-2 isn't ideal for this team in anyway shape or form. If I were the manager I would drop Suarez and go back to the 4-3-3 (false 9), but if he insists on continuing to shoehorn a shit Suarez into the team I would much rather him go with the 4-2-3-1, where both Messi and Suarez are allowed to play in their natural positions without sacrificing width. We would give up some midfield control playing like this, but it would be better than what we're currently doing.


Suarez

Denis-Messi-Dembele (Roberto or Deulofeu until January)

Paulinho/Roberto-Busquets

Alba-Umtiti-Pique-Semedo

Stegen

This is what I've been saying, it allows for a more dominant, attacking game but it won't happen because there is no place for Rakitic and Gomes.

 

[Barcilliant]

EV is turning out to be as bone headed and stubborn as Lucho. He's been incredibly lucky so far but listening to our players it's clear that times have changed. Even when we lost games the opposition suffered. Now we're the ones suffering and eking out results.

 

[MessiCam]

We had a shinier team on a paper (Neymar).
So, last season we played well blah blah, but we were just unlucky.

Yet, this season we suck and we play ugly, yet we are lucky.

Imo, it is not that simple.
We play without Dembele and we didn't get another key player in Coutinho.

Imo, I think that majority od you are spoiled by Pep's Xavi-Iniesta Barca.

I have wrote in Ernesto's thread.
Compared to other Barca's in the last 20-25 years, a current Barca has:
10/10 perfect results
And imo 5-6/10 in terms of beauty.

If you are comparing a current Barca with Pep's Barca, which was 10/10 good in results and 10/10 in beauty, well yes, we play ugly now.

But if you compare Valverde's style in terms of beauty with:
Van Gaal 1, Van Gaal 2, Serra Ferrer, Rexach, Antic, Rijkaard, Tito, Tata, Lucho...
Then Ev's Barca is far from ugly.
Again, for now, I would rate it with 5-6/10 in beauty.

If you had watched Oleguer as a Rb in the past, Fabio Rochemback as our creator, Riquelme ruinning every single pass, Saviola playing as our targetman and similar, I doubt that you would whine about a current team's beauty too much.

We aren't spectacular.
But we are far from ugly and ruining Barca's legacy.
Imo, we are spoiled with Xavi-Iniesta.

Barce pre Xavi looked like a current Barca, more or less.
We had 2 aliens with Xavi and Iniesta.
People will have to accept that we are playing with mortals in our team now.
And current mortals are playing quite okish conpared to other Barca's mortals pre-Xavi.

Why do you keep referencing older models? Valverde, when he took this job, was the one who said that Barca's style of play is sacrosanct. And what does he go and do after a positive start? He shreds it.

 

[Barcilliant]

This is what I've been saying, it allows for a more dominant, attacking game but it won't happen because there is no place for Rakitic and Gomes.

Why does Ev give a fuck about Rakitic and Gomes?

Also why isn't he giving Alena and Arnaiz some minutes. That turnip Van Gaal gave opportunities to Xavi and Iniesta but for some reason Mr youth development is scared of giving opportunities to our youngsters.

 

[MessiCam]

EV is turning out to be as bone headed and stubborn as Lucho. He's been incredibly lucky so far but listening to our players it's clear that times have changed. Even when we lost games the opposition suffered. Now we're the ones suffering and eking out results.

Ter Stegen and Busquets were quite clear in their assessment after the Bilbao game. When senior players speak out then somethings amiss.

 

[DonAK]

Ter Stegen and Busquets were quite clear in their assessment after the Bilbao game. When senior players speak out then somethings amiss.

What did they say?

 

[MessiCam]

Why does Ev give a fuck about Rakitic and Gomes?

Also why isn't he giving Alena and Arnaiz some minutes. That turnip Van Gaal gave opportunities to Xavi and Iniesta but for some reason Mr youth development is scared of giving opportunities to our youngsters.

Because they offer something in defence especially, as Valverde said, "height" in set plays... Wtf?

 

[MessiCam]

What did they say?

Busquets was frank in crediting the win to Ter Stegen and Ter Stegen said he is happy to help but it can't continue like this.

 

[Xaviniesta]

this guy looks like semedo
[youtube]KZgjdQwuUb8[/youtube]

 

[BBZ8800]

Alena, Arnaiz should give more minutes and someone mentioned a starting 11 with (as expected, fans favorites in young players) with Denis as a LW, Roberto as a Cm and Semedo as a RB. I don't have anything against Semedo as a RB though.

But one thing is clearer, imo.
These guys who are whining would like a starting 11 with either Denis (wtf lol)-Messi-Deulo or Denis-Messi-Dembele.
Fans favorite Roberto should be in midfield, as always.
Semedo at a Rb, of course.

But as always, people are too obsessed with technical skills.
Denis, who can dribble, but is a ghost in 100s of other parts of a game: should start.
Roberto, young, domestic, passionate, but lacks in 100s of areas for a starting Cm: should start.

I get an impression sometimes that some of you would play with 11 Grimaldos and Denis's in a team.
Good dribblers, questionable in defense and in physique, but who cares?
They have flair though...

I can't not to comment on this post:

Messi cannot and will not play on the wing anymore and the 4-4-2 isn't ideal for this team in anyway shape or form. If I were the manager I would drop Suarez and go back to the 4-3-3 (false 9), but if he insists on continuing to shoehorn a shit Suarez into the team I would much rather him go with the 4-2-3-1, where both Messi and Suarez are allowed to play in their natural positions without sacrificing width. We would give up some midfield control playing like this, but it would be better than what we're currently doing.


Suarez

Denis-Messi-Dembele (Roberto or Deulofeu until January)

Paulinho/Roberto-Busquets

Alba-Umtiti-Pique-Semedo

Stegen

Denis in his 4 professional season:
1. Sevilla=a squad level, didn't manage to do anything
2. Villareal, 2nd tier level of a club=had one good season in a different system
3. Barcelona, 1st season=one of the players with the lowest amount of minutes under Lucho, after a lot of minutes in the first 2-3 Months. Lucho totally gave up on him (when he probably learned more about his abilities while watching him every day on training grounds).
4. Barcelona, 2nd season, a new coach=the same story. With only 2 wingers in a team currently (Deulo, Denis), he still can't get minutes.

I will write one more time, a golden rule which we have learned in the past with lots of Barca's youngsters: if a player is constantly on a sidelines under a few different coaches in a row (Bartra, Deulofeu in the past), there is an extremely high chance that a player is JUST NOT GOOD ENOUGH, rather than a coach is stupid and he is not seeing "the greatness of a player".

The same could be said about Roberto to some extent.
Lucho played him everywhere except on a CM.
Roberto was more often a CDM in the past and later a Rb and a hybrid RB-CM in a 343.

Under Valverde, he is again a RB.

Imo, an occam's razor would suggest that you have only 2 simple options:
1. either Lucho, Ernesto and other coaches are stupid
2. or guys in whom you have too much faith just aren't THAT good

I mean, some of you are whining how Valverde is bad, this and that, and then your magical idea is to play Denis as a LW and Roberto as a CM starter, ouch.
Play Alena right away.
What is next? Bring Samper back, play him right away.
And if possible: bring Grimaldo and Thiago right away.

A hint: some of these posts are insanely too emotional and too biased towards either: young players, young and passionate, young and domestic, young&domestic&technical etc.
Some of you are too obsessed with: he is young and can dribble or he is young and Catalan.

You can hate these words as much as you want, but I'll say it now:
Roberto will never be a starter CM at Barca (and successful in that role) even if we'll change 18 coaches.
He will be 26 in 3 Months. Rakitic already started to decline a few Months after that, roughly
A 26 year old with 10-20 matches as a CM in his career and you are whining that a coach is blind and stupid, ouch.
Denis will never get nowhere near the Barca's required level to be a starter as a Lw or a Lcm.

First 10 rounds in 2017/18:
Betis 2:0
Alaves 2:0
Espanyol 5:0
Getafe 2:1
Eibar 6:1
Girona 3:0
Las Palmas 3:0
Atletico 1:1
Malaga 2:0
Bilbao 2:0

Wins 9-1-0
Goals 28:3

2016/17, after 10 matches with a magical MSN:
Betis 6:2
Bilbao 1:0
Alaves 1:2
Leganes 5:1
Atletico 1:1
Gijon 5:0
Celta 3:4
Deportivo 4:0
Valencia 3:2
Granada 1:0

7-1-2
Goals: 30:12

So, some suggest that we are playing bad, ugly and inefficient.
Yet, the best attacking trio ever, magical MSN, scored 30 goals compared to 28 this season.
On the other hand, Valverde's fomation, physical players and defending conceded only 3 goals in 10 matches.

Last season, we were trashing Mickey Mouse opponents 6:1 and playing 2:2 all the time with any half decent La liga opponent.
This season, with a more defensive orientated approach and more physical players, we aren't winning 6:1 but 3:0 against Mickey Mouse opponents, but the difference is that against decent La Liga teams, we aren't conceding 2-3 goals easily, but we are winning 1:0 and 2:0.

Last season:
Alaves 1:2
Atletico 1:1
Celta 3:4
Valencia 2:3
Malaga 0:0
Sociedad 1:1
Real 1:1
Villareal 1:1
Betis 1:1
Deportivo 1:2
Malaga 0:2
Sociedad 3:2

 

[BusiTheKing]

The number of goals we have conceded is incredibly misleading to our defensive quality. Do you not watch the games? A team with one win in the last 12 games just managed 17 attempts against us. Both Paris last year and Bayern in 2013 put 4 past us with less.

 

[JamDav1982]

The number of goals we have conceded is incredibly misleading to our defensive quality. Do you not watch the games? A team with one win in the last 12 games just managed 17 attempts against us. Both Paris last year and Bayern in 2013 put 4 past us with less.

Atletico have defended well and conceded a ton of chances in big games for years and get praised for it.

Which is the team with the best defence in the world at moment?

Wouldnt quite call shots from distance as really managing attempts either.

 

[MessiCam]

Atletico have defended well and conceded a ton of chances in big games for years and get praised for it.

Which is the team with the best defence in the world at moment?

Wouldnt quite call shots from distance as really managing attempts either.

Barça are conceding a fair few shots within the box. I put the stats up already... We’re conceding basically the same amount of shots per game as previously. Only difference is Ter Stegen saves per goals conceded is through the roof. It is not sustainable.

 

[Ousmane Dembélé]

Alena, Arnaiz should give more minutes and someone mentioned a starting 11 with (as expected, fans favorites in young players) with Denis as a LW, Roberto as a Cm and Semedo as a RB. I don't have anything against Semedo as a RB though.

But one thing is clearer, imo.
These guys who are whining would like a starting 11 with either Denis (wtf lol)-Messi-Deulo or Denis-Messi-Dembele.
Fans favorite Roberto should be in midfield, as always.
Semedo at a Rb, of course.

But as always, people are too obsessed with technical skills.
Denis, who can dribble, but is a ghost in 100s of other parts of a game: should start.
Roberto, young, domestic, passionate, but lacks in 100s of areas for a starting Cm: should start.

I get an impression sometimes that some of you would play with 11 Grimaldos and Denis's in a team.
Good dribblers, questionable in defense and in physique, but who cares?
They have flair though...

I can't not to comment on this post:


Denis in his 4 professional season:
1. Sevilla=a squad level, didn't manage to do anything
2. Villareal, 2nd tier level of a club=had one good season in a different system
3. Barcelona, 1st season=one of the players with the lowest amount of minutes under Lucho, after a lot of minutes in the first 2-3 Months. Lucho totally gave up on him (when he probably learned more about his abilities while watching him every day on training grounds).
4. Barcelona, 2nd season, a new coach=the same story. With only 2 wingers in a team currently (Deulo, Denis), he still can't get minutes.

I will write one more time, a golden rule which we have learned in the past with lots of Barca's youngsters: if a player is constantly on a sidelines under a few different coaches in a row (Bartra, Deulofeu in the past), there is an extremely high chance that a player is JUST NOT GOOD ENOUGH, rather than a coach is stupid and he is not seeing "the greatness of a player".

The same could be said about Roberto to some extent.
Lucho played him everywhere except on a CM.
Roberto was more often a CDM in the past and later a Rb and a hybrid RB-CM in a 343.

Under Valverde, he is again a RB.

Imo, an occam's razor would suggest that you have only 2 simple options:
1. either Lucho, Ernesto and other coaches are stupid
2. or guys in whom you have too much faith just aren't THAT good

I mean, some of you are whining how Valverde is bad, this and that, and then your magical idea is to play Denis as a LW and Roberto as a CM starter, ouch.
Play Alena right away.
What is next? Bring Samper back, play him right away.
And if possible: bring Grimaldo and Thiago right away.

A hint: some of these posts are insanely too emotional and too biased towards either: young players, young and passionate, young and domestic, young&domestic&technical etc.
Some of you are too obsessed with: he is young and can dribble or he is young and Catalan.

You can hate these words as much as you want, but I'll say it now:
Roberto will never be a starter CM at Barca (and successful in that role) even if we'll change 18 coaches.
He will be 26 in 3 Months. Rakitic already started to decline a few Months after that, roughly
A 26 year old with 10-20 matches as a CM in his career and you are whining that a coach is blind and stupid, ouch.
Denis will never get nowhere near the Barca's required level to be a starter as a Lw or a Lcm.

First 10 rounds in 2017/18:
Betis 2:0
Alaves 2:0
Espanyol 5:0
Getafe 2:1
Eibar 6:1
Girona 3:0
Las Palmas 3:0
Atletico 1:1
Malaga 2:0
Bilbao 2:0

Wins 9-1-0
Goals 28:3

2016/17, after 10 matches with a magical MSN:
Betis 6:2
Bilbao 1:0
Alaves 1:2
Leganes 5:1
Atletico 1:1
Gijon 5:0
Celta 3:4
Deportivo 4:0
Valencia 3:2
Granada 1:0

7-1-2
Goals: 30:12

So, some suggest that we are playing bad, ugly and inefficient.
Yet, the best attacking trio ever, magical MSN, scored 30 goals compared to 28 this season.
On the other hand, Valverde's fomation, physical players and defending conceded only 3 goals in 10 matches.

Last season, we were trashing Mickey Mouse opponents 6:1 and playing 2:2 all the time with any half decent La liga opponent.
This season, with a more defensive orientated approach and more physical players, we aren't winning 6:1 but 3:0 against Mickey Mouse opponents, but the difference is that against decent La Liga teams, we aren't conceding 2-3 goals easily, but we are winning 1:0 and 2:0.

Last season:
Alaves 1:2
Atletico 1:1
Celta 3:4
Valencia 2:3
Malaga 0:0
Sociedad 1:1
Real 1:1
Villareal 1:1
Betis 1:1
Deportivo 1:2
Malaga 0:2
Sociedad 3:2

1. I never suggested that Denis and Roberto would become great players for us or are currently world class, I want them in the starting XI because they are better options right now than Suarez and Rakitic; do you not agree with that?

2. I never suggested that we played great football last year. I wasn't a big fan of Lucho's tactics that relied heavily on MSN and imploded once Messi decided to leave the right flank and the midfield declined. Lucho's tactics were flawed and so are Valverde's right now.

I see your point and that the team is still getting results, but for me the team has gone from one inept coach in Lucho to another in Valverde. It's only a matter of time before this tactical setup falls apart in terms of getting results, the signs are already there. Your post makes some sense, but you really misrepresented what I said, I was neither a big fan of Lucho's MSN reliant tactics, nor am I a blinded Masia puppet that wants to promote everyone and their mothers from the B team.

Just being realistic that's all.