Neymar Jr. - v5

[henias]

He would have been better than Suarez has been this season in exact same positions across the games and Valverde would tweak it to fit him in anyway.

Your is guess work to say he couldnt improve this team and 4-4-2 which he clearly would even in Suarez role.

He would but in reality he wouldn't. Dude loves the spotlight, dribble and play the no. 10 role, it'll be hard to keep him happy by placing him near the defenders line. It's actually best for him and the club that he left for PSG. Win-win situation.

 

[JamDav1982]

He would but in reality he wouldn't. Dude loves the spotlight, dribble and play the no. 10 role, it'll be hard to keep him happy by placing him near the defenders line. It's actually best for him and the club that he left for PSG. Win-win situation.

In reality he would be and Valverde and the players tried so hard to keep him for a reason.

Barca are doing fine enough without him anyway but doesnt minimise him as a player or make him the reason things have improved.

 

[henias]

In reality he would be and Valverde and the players tried so hard to keep him for a reason.

That's before he left. He's a great talent so that's for sure. But after he left, Messi and everyone realise knew that they were tactically more balanced and Jordi Alba especially was able to flourish without Neymar always trying to iniatite futile attacks alone.

 

[Horatio]

Messi and everyone realise knew that they were tactically more balanced and Jordi Alba especially was able to flourish without Neymar always trying to iniatite futile attacks alone.

And you seriously think the tactical improvement is for a large part because of Neymar leaving instead of oh you know....having a new tactically superior coach?

 

[JamDav1982]

That's before he left. He's a great talent so that's for sure. But after he left, Messi and everyone realise knew that they were tactically more balanced and Jordi Alba especially was able to flourish without Neymar always trying to iniatite futile attacks alone.

The team has been more balanced but the players and Valverde are not so stupid to realise Neymar could play in this team.

There is a reason they wanted to keep him and realise he is one of elite players in the world.

You act like he destroyed every attack when in reality he was the most productive wide player for Barca of any bar Messi in recent times.

How can the one who tries 'futile attacks alone' create so many chances? Makes no sense at all.

 

[Mitchell1978]

Neymar isnt a 'party animal' and was arguably Barcas fittest player last season.

lol, i always wonder why are you still here, why haven't you followed you beloved Neymar to PSG

 

[JamDav1982]

lol, i always wonder why are you still here, why haven't you followed you beloved Neymar to PSG

Great input.

 

[BBZ8800]

And you seriously think the tactical improvement is for a large part because of Neymar leaving instead of oh you know....having a new tactically superior coach?

It depends on players also.
If Neymar were here, we would have played differently.

I don't want to go offtopic, but let's make a bet: Dembele in, and we'll lose some % of our midfield balance and defensive strength.
Just change 1 player in the lineup, change a formation a little and you have a totally different team in defense, midfield, attack, through the middle and on wings.

A huge part of our stability was NOT having individual risky players like Neymar.
Again, I am 99% sure that we will now lose a part of that stability once when Dembele will play, because he is a player more similar to Neymar than to safe midfielders from our 442.

If we will lose a part of stability with Dembele's entrance, imo, that is a proof how much players are influencing defense-midfield-attack balance.
And that it is not ALL only because of Lucho/EV.

I do agree with JamDav that maybe we could have kept some balance with Neymar under EV, but only if we played 4411 with Messi and Neymar upfront and Suarez on the bench.
There is no way that we would have these type of midfield and defensive balance with ALL MSN trio on the field.

Again, you can't have too many risky players in attack who will try a lot of risky moves (and thus losing a lot of balls) and keeping possession and defensive stability.

1. more risk=>more lost balls=>more counters against you=>more conceded goals
2. less risk&more safe passes=>less lost balls=>less counters against you=>less conceded goals and less chaos and run and gun approach in general.
I am not saying that we shouldn't play risky passes EVER.
But Messi knows when to play risky.
Yet, Neymar is a dumb who played risky in EVERY single action when he received the ball. And that was like 30 times per match.

Some will reply: but with more players like MSN, you have more attacking options, and more risky passes and more players who are TRYING to create something means=more chances and more goals.
Well, only up to a certain point.
If we would play with 10 Messis on a field, we would clearly create a ton of chances, but on the other hand, we would face 70-80 deadly counters per match.

At the end of the day, a funny thing is:
1. 442 without Neymar is creating more or the same amount of shots than MSN's 433. So, with only 2 attacking players (Messi and Luis), we are creating as much or even more than with 3 risky players in MSN.
2. on the other hand, EV's 442 is way more defensively strong than MSN's 433.

So, basically, with going from 3 attacking players to 2 attacking players, we didn't lose THAT much in creation.
We are scoring the same as before.
And yet, our midfield balance and defense improved a lot.

One more time, if we'll buy Griezmann, quite possibly it will turn out that 4 or 5 attacking players AREN'T creating more chances and AREN'T bringing more victories than a cautious 442 from EV's which is winning all matches with 1:0 or 2:0 and clean sheets.
A team with 4-5 attacking players will probably win 6:1 one day and play 3:3 and 3:4 three days later.
Awesome attack, and yet weaker midfield balance and a defense (and a whole team) extremely prone to counters.

 

[JamDav1982]

BBZ tell us who has the most balanced team in CL in your opinion.

Fairly short answer all it takes.

 

[Mitchell1978]

Great input.

Well its always been clear that you're a Ney-fanboy more then anything else, i just wonder why you haven't followed him

Other then that i don't mind him leaving, its turning out the best option for everyone, for barça and for him probably.

 

[Stoichkov1]

With that front three and obviously below par midfield Barca were one game away from a treble and two doubles in three years and Neymar was one of top players in the world.

Of course it could work and Valverde would just like the players realised that and were desperate for him to stay.

If you are arguing those three up top is too heavy for team to defend try not to blame the hardest working of the three that tracks back the most.

One game away from a treble? we were eliminated in the quarterfinals by atletico in 2016.

 

[henias]

The team has been more balanced but the players and Valverde are not so stupid to realise Neymar could play in this team.

There is a reason they wanted to keep him and realise he is one of elite players in the world.

You act like he destroyed every attack when in reality he was the most productive wide player for Barca of any bar Messi in recent times.

How can the one who tries 'futile attacks alone' create so many chances? Makes no sense at all.

Dont try and blow up a mere sentence that's simply describing and summarising his general style play. I never say he destroyed every attack, but he often tried to rush attacks which are futile when it matters the most. Sure he created alot of chances but he attempted alot as well, especially someone who attempted close to 300 dribbles in a single season.

Like I said I never said he wasn't a great talent but his aggressiveness and his desire for early action and that adrenaline rush spoils any patient buildup tactics which Barca tend to revolves around. He tend to neglect Jordi Alba on the left side who's making alot of runs, especially after the departure of Alves and often drops deep and drift inwards and try and pass to Messi. It's basically a two men show.

Dont try and make me look like I hate Neymar, which clearly is not the case. He is definitely still top 2 beside Messi. If this was FIFA, I would pick him without a doubt. But this isnt. I cant control him and how he feels like playing so as of now, Barca is slightly better off without Neymar.

 

[JamDav1982]

One game away from a treble? we were eliminated in the quarterfinals by atletico in 2016.

Yip which changes nothing from what I said.

 

[Stoichkov1]

Yip which changes nothing from what I said.

I don't understand why you're saying we were one game away from a treble.

 

[JamDav1982]

Dont try and blow up a mere sentence that's simply describing and summarising his general style play. I never say he destroyed every attack, but he often tried to rush attacks which are futile when it matters the most. Sure he created alot of chances but he attempted alot as well, especially someone who attempted close to 300 dribbles in a single season.

Like I said I never said he wasn't a great talent but his aggressiveness and his desire for early action and that adrenaline rush spoils any patient buildup tactics which Barca tend to revolves around. He tend to neglect Jordi Alba on the left side who's making alot of runs, especially after the departure of Alves and often drops deep and drift inwards and try and pass to Messi. It's basically a two men show.

Dont try and make me look like I hate Neymar, which clearly is not the case. He is definitely still top 2 beside Messi. If this was FIFA, I would pick him without a doubt. But this isnt. I cant control him and how he feels like playing so as of now, Barca is slightly better off without Neymar.

He never went for 'futile attacks alone' nearly as much as you make out which is why he created more chances than anyone else.

His dribble success rate was higher than Messis so if he lost it too often point to Messi who lost it more. Both of them were right to take those risks as such big rewards from it even if lose it a lot.

He didnt ignore Alba. The team moved the ball so slowly last season Messi and Neymar rarely got it early in good positions to take teams on and were almost always had 2/3 men closing them down. Both Messi and Neymar were left with either joining in the easy passing or take riks and had to take them as no one else in team could do it bar maybe a moment from Suarez.

Couldnt care less if you hate Neymar or love him it is just opinions.

The team was fucked last season and Neymar and Messi suffered from it.