Philippe Coutinho

[Tackle]

No doubt Firmino would flop at Barcelona. He would become Suarez' sub under Ernie 100% or at best stuck on the wing. Would be Griezman 2.0. Griezmann would slide in easily with Salah and Mane as well no doubt.

Manager certainly plays a role in a player's adaptation, but the system and natural fit with teammates is more important.

Firmino would flop here under any manager as long as Messi continues to play his current free role. Wouldn't have what it takes to cut it as a 9 either. He plays with two goal-scoring, pacey wingers at Liverpool. Not two old grandpas clogging the middle with minimal work rate.

 

[serghei]

Manager certainly plays a role in a player's adaptation, but the system and natural fit with teammates is more important.

Firmino would flop here under any manager as long as Messi continues to play his current free role. Wouldn't have what it takes to cut it as a 9 either. He plays with two goal-scoring, pacey wingers at Liverpool. Not two old granpas clogging the middle with minimal work rate.

Would flop here under any manager who would be unable to properly manage Messi or have the balls to bench Suarez. I agree with that. I have nothing against Valverde as a person. It's his lack of managerial qualities I have issues with.

 

[Messigician]

At this rate Bayern will send him back in January.

 

[Zidane82]

At this rate Bayern will send him back in January.

What’s happened

 

[Messigician]

What’s happened

Dropped from the starting 11 after awful performances, Bayern doing better without him

 

[Chainsaw]

Dropped from the starting 11 after awful performances, Bayern doing better without him

Bad news. That means his overrated overpriced ass is going back to Barca and no one's going to get him for anything close to what Barca paid for him.

Unless by some miracle Barca's next coach revive him.

 

[MTL_Barca]

Well it's not like he was much worse than the other players. He was pretty bad/average but so was everyone not named Lewandowski the past couple weeks of Kovac and Müller was/is not exactly delivering world class performances either.

After Kovac was sacked former assistant coach Flick took over and immediately dropped Cou and Thiago for Müller and Goretzka.

Thought that Müller was bad/average in CL and decent vs Dortmund. Goretzka was meh as always.

Seems like the coach will stay for now so let's see when/if Cou gets a chance. If the coach stays the whole season and prefers the Germans...well he might be fucked

 

[JohnN]

The weird thing is that Coutinho could work better as an AM with DFJ and Arthur behind him than Griezmann will ever work as a left winger. I am making that assumption considering his skillset, but in reality he hasn't been performing in a really high level for a long time now. I am not sure he has that level in him as a never watched him with Liverpool.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Yea, thing is we need to stay away from players trained by managers like Simeone and Klopp, because they absolutely take everything from them physically and mentally.

Seems like Coutinho is not a world beater, but a regular good player who went on a great run under the leadership of a great manager. Coutinho's story would happen the same if we took some of Liverpool's current players. Once taken out of that perfectly calibrated setup imagined by Klopp, their performances would drop, because few of them are actually certified world class able to play under an average manager and impact the game like they did under Klopp.

That isn't very accurate. Coutinho was developing and performing since his days with Brendan Rodgers who might actally have played an evev bigger role in his development than Klopp.
He looked as a player who was destined for stardom during that time and his performances with Klopp looked like the natural progress of him.
I still think his drop in form is just a Hleb esque. This is almost identical and Hleb himself admitted it wasn't related to football. May be I am over complicating things but I think there is more going on this guy life than we know.

 

[Respekt_III]

That isn't very accurate. Coutinho was developing and performing since his days with Brendan Rodgers who might actally have played an evev bigger role in his development than Klopp.
He looked as a player who was destined for stardom during that time and his performances with Klopp looked like the natural progress of him.
I still think his drop in form is just a Hleb esque. This is almost identical and Hleb himself admitted it wasn't related to football. May be I am over complicating things but I think there is more going on this guy life than we know.

Nah you're giving him way to much credit, guy had about 1.5 good seasons all up in his entire career.
He was playing for a fairly shit Liverpool team with low expectations and the PL itself was no where near as tactical to boot.

He was so over priced it still hurts today and only people who didnt watch him enough thought he was going to be a good fit; oddly enough a lot of those same people were against the coutinho transfer were also against the greizman transfer.

 

[Porque]

The weird thing is that Coutinho could work better as an AM with DFJ and Arthur behind him than Griezmann will ever work as a left winger. I am making that assumption considering his skillset, but in reality he hasn't been performing in a really high level for a long time now. I am not sure he has that level in him as a never watched him with Liverpool.

Is the 4312 dead? Has it become one of those relic formations of the mid 2000's? I remember Villarreal with Riquelme playing fantastic with this setup in those years.

If it isn't dead, then our current players (and Coutinho) could probably adapt to this setup. We just got to make sure everyone bar Messi are running 11km or more per game.

MATS

Semedo/Bob-Pique-Lenglet/Umtiti-Alba/Firpo

--Arthur-FDJ-SOMEONE NEW AND SHINY--

---7km Man (Coutinho)---

------Suarez-Griezmann/Dembele------​

 

[Respekt_III]

Is the 4312 dead? Has it become one of those relic formations of the mid 2000's? I remember Villarreal with Riquelme playing fantastic with this setup in those years.

If it isn't dead, then our current players (and Coutinho) could probably adapt to this setup. We just got to make sure everyone bar Messi are running 11km or more per game.

MATS

Semedo/Bob-Pique-Lenglet/Umtiti-Alba/Firpo

--Arthur-FDJ-SOMEONE NEW AND SHINY--

---7km Man (Coutinho)---

------Suarez-Griezmann/Dembele------​

Very realistic, 160m becnh warmer.also.suarez running a lot lol

 

[Donauwelle]

Well it's not like he was much worse than the other players. He was pretty bad/average but so was everyone not named Lewandowski the past couple weeks of Kovac and Müller was/is not exactly delivering world class performances either.

After Kovac was sacked former assistant coach Flick took over and immediately dropped Cou and Thiago for Müller and Goretzka.

Thought that Müller was bad/average in CL and decent vs Dortmund. Goretzka was meh as always.

Seems like the coach will stay for now so let's see when/if Cou gets a chance. If the coach stays the whole season and prefers the Germans...well he might be fucked

Müller is the one that organizes the pressing and orchestrated a lot in the last two matches. Ran his ass off, was everywhere, had ten more duels then the other players, assisted 2 goals against BVB...

He had no dribblings, did not try any step-overs etc.

Yes, really decent...

The Olympiakos match was no festival, normal when the other team parks the bus... but Bayern had atleast 2 goals against in the matches before, even against small teams, looked badly organized and without leadership.

Flick did the right thing. Müller offers more offensively, is on 8 assists and 2 goals this season even with only half of the playing time and often not in a favourite position - and offers you the workrate and the leadership Bayern needs right now.

He just does not have any brazilian flair...

 

[George_Costanza]

At this rate Bayern will send him back in January.

 

[wisconsincule]

This guy is going to be back here next summer isn’t he?

Realistically who would even buy him?