Quique Setien

[FinBarcelonafan]

If Klopp got the Barca job tomorrow and was told Messi has retired and Sancho is on way.... not sure the front three as a unit with work rate and pace would not improve.

Dembele (if fit) on side, Griezmann dropping, linking and pressing like Firmino and Sancho on on other wing.

Midfield he punts Busi, bases on FDJ and can use likes of Roberto, Pjanic and even Coutinho better than has been.

Barca front six with top coach and Messi/Busi/Suarez gone is not hard to believe could be better compared to shit watched last few weeks.

Dembele is never going to be the guy working super hard to press people. Not his mentality. He is not the guy to fight the ball back.

 

[serghei]

Anyway, these things are realistically at least 1 year away. Maybe even 2. Until then, more tired legs, slow football and managers trying to patch things up while catering to our veteran core is all we're going to see. And I don't exclude more CL embarrassments.

In terms of trophies, this scenario could lead at best to a domestic double if Madrid drop their level next season. Worst case scenario, nothing if Madrid improve their current level. Maybe a Copa del Rey.

 

[JamDav1982]

Dembele is never going to be the guy working super hard to press people. Not his mentality. He is not the guy to fight the ball back.

But he has pace and likes of Klopp likes him to fit his style and even then it is just a quick example of how a top coach could change things quite quickly.

If wouldnt fit he gets moved on for someone who would do it.

The front three just now looks decent stat wise but lacks so much and impacts rest of team in such a way it would not be difficult to improve things compared to shit of last few weeks.

Even if lose some individual quality on ball.

The best case scenario would be a younger, fitter team that Messi fits with but just doesnt seem that will happen.

 

[FinBarcelonafan]

But he has pace and likes of Klopp likes him to fit his style and even then it is just a quick example of how a top coach could change things quite quickly.

If wouldnt fit he gets moved on for someone who would do it.

Yeah true. It's tough to say how things would change with a top coach,but these players should improve as an inviduals and as a team players.

 

[DonAK]

But he has pace and likes of Klopp likes him to fit his style and even then it is just a quick example of how a top coach could change things quite quickly.

If wouldnt fit he gets moved on for someone who would do it.

I'm not sure the likes of Klopp or Pep would bother with someone like Dembele who seem to lack the awareness and mentality to play for those two. He gets moved on for someone else as you said.

 

[Batistuta9]

Yea, it's not like Sancho would be better than Messi individually, or better passer, or better scorer. But he would do the things for the team Messi doesn't want to do. And this would open doors for us to move in a better direction as a whole. We could try pressing again for a change. Getting the ball back in the opponent's last third... things we haven't done properly for 4-5 years. Things which are very much fundamental for the sides that dominate in Europe.

Swapping sancho for messi won't improve pressing on its own. This team is finished. We need a new squad. Even klopp wouldn't perform a miracle and start playing well with this team. People forget he took 5 years to turn lfc into a winning team

 

[DonAK]

I think Klopp would love Ansu way more than Dembele even though the former doesn't have OD's electric pace. Just such a smart, bright footballer at such a young age.

 

[JamDav1982]

I'm not sure the likes of Klopp or Pep would bother with someone like Dembele who seem to lack the awareness and mentality to play for those two. He gets moved on for someone else as you said.

It is not some big up of Dembele but just to show what could be possible with better coach with realtively little change.

There are options that could work better.

Fati/Dembele Trincao/Sancho.

Not bad for likes of Klopp that... assuming fitness.

It cannot possibly be worse than how disjointed Barca look now.

 

[serghei]

Swapping sancho for messi won't improve pressing on its own. This team is finished. We need a new squad. Even klopp wouldn't perform a miracle and start playing well with this team. People forget he took 5 years to turn lfc into a winning team

Lack of pressing is down to tired old legs up front: Messi and Suarez. Change them for younger, more hard working players, and you have solid foundations for pressing being a weapon for us again. Like it is so much for likes of Liverpool, Bayern, City.

 

[DonAK]

Anyway, neither Klopp or Pep are going to take over this team. Nor will Pochettino. No established manager will take over so Xavi is probably Barca's best shot at something unless they manage to convince Lucho to return(forgive me Lord for I have sinned talking trash about that man).

At least Xavi will bring some leadership and want to run his own sporting project. Who knows how that will turn out, but hey at least the team won't be able to dictate the terms with him around.

 

[henias]

I think a model like Bayern where there is high energy in the team, a well rehearsed system and very little star-like players who have complete freedom is achievable post Messi.

Every manager would kill for Messi AND a model like Bayern. Our team has no high energy, no system, no pace, no wingers. Any quality players that come here to play a free role would fail terribly. A team is supposed to be diverse and complimentary. Just like I wouldn't want 10 Gnabry in my team. A player however must contribute heavily in the role he plays, in this case Messi has always been very eager and capable of doing so.

And the notion of having Messi not drop deep is not feasible. He aint gonna wait in the box all day. The idea is have him anywhere in the pitch and not have him tracked by opposition team. Also, the teammates always have a choice to not pass to him all the time. If so, Setien didnt do a great job in regulating them through instructions. But you are too focused on him dropping deep and not seeing the bigger picture. A free role allows you to be everywhere on the pitch; Messi is everywhere on that right side of the pitch. He drops deep occasionally to just draw them out once in a while. It aint nothing. Otherwise he would be always in the most congested area doing nothing without the ball and they will know he's always present; it's extremely easy to mark. Heat map of his is fine.

And gosh, why would pressing or tactic be the first thing that comes to your mind. Get proper strikers and wingers first geez. Get younger players. You can't expect something to work out in a broken system. You cant press with our current team too. Messi is the last thing to change if you havent even tried the most fundamental things.

 

[serghei]

Bayern model and Messi model are like oil and water. You either have one or the other. At this point in time, Messi needs the team to be built after him. And for a well functioning side, it is not something to be desired.

Why would Bayern or Liverpool even want Messi? They have something much better than old Messi.

 

[JamDav1982]

Genuinely do not believe the likes of Klopp or Pep would sign Messi who runs and presses as little as does now and certainly not on the huge wages would command.

They would not give up so much of what their teams are built on and the balance of it.

 

[DonAK]

Bayern model and Messi model are like oil and water. You either have one or the other. At this point in time, Messi needs the team to be built after him. And for a well functioning side, it is not something to be desired.

You can have an energetic, dynamic team with Messi in it. Needs the right man, vision and players alongside him.

You can remove Messi from the team and it would do fuck all if the right manager, players and a board, management with vision is not there.

Would be it be your dream team, 100% ideal? No, but it can still be a very good team and a top, top European team.

 

[henias]

Bayern model and Messi model are like oil and water. You either have one or the other. At this point in time, Messi needs the team to be built after him. And for a well functioning side, it is not something to be desired.

Why would Bayern or Liverpool even want Messi? They have something much better than old Messi.

Maybe not a full Bayern model, anything like Enrique's team would be more than good. But our current state of team is worse than that of Atalanta.