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OR.... Tata can grow some Balls and just promote some youth players Edgar Ie, Adama, Samper not to mention Deu and Rafinha coming back from loan.
Armando929
New member
I don't wish to get rid of Xavi. But his time has passed along with Puyol. And pretty soon, injuries are gonna start to take their toll with the more physical play of today than in the years gone by. Xavi will always be gifted, but he no longer has the fitness and quick minded thinking of his prime years... How many times in the past few years(including this season) have we seen guys like Messi, Villa, Neymar, Pedro, Alexis, make a great run into space only for Xavi not to play the through ball, but instead decide to pass sideways or backwards??.. This was crystallized in our loss to Bayern in the CL.. Defensively he offers next to nothing, and he loses possession just as much as Cesc and Busquets now. He also clearly doesn't have the energy to finish matches strong anymore.
The same way changes were made in 2008 when Pep took over, changes need to be made this off season. And Xavi stepping down is one of those changes that needs to be made.
The same way changes were made in 2008 when Pep took over, changes need to be made this off season. And Xavi stepping down is one of those changes that needs to be made.
Galning
Moderator
Newsflash: Puyol is leaving (or even quitting).
F
Flavia
Guest
This.
klc123
Member
According to whoscored, Xavi created 3 chances against Portugal(in 87 minutes), Arbeloa 1 and Iniesta 0(in 120 minutes). Like I said, it feels like I watched a whole different game.
CL won by Iniesta without Xavi: 1
CL won by Xavi without Iniesta: 0
>
Always has been, always will be.
That is such rubbish, when has Xavi played a CL without Iniesta? That's an unfair comparison.
Maybe Xavi isn't as glamorous as player as Iniesta, with less dribbles and fancy controls, but he is much more consistent than Iniesta in my opinion, and he is the workhorse that keeps the team ticking, like the conductor of an orchestra. I thought people could see that, obviously not.
Not having a dig at Iniesta btw.
Them feels, such a player.
You mean Iniesta does more glamorous things that capture your imagination?
Believe it or not, but most of the important stuff in football matches isn't the glorious control and dribbles, it's the hard work, that goes unnoticed, like controlling the tempo and distribution. But I guess that kind of stuff doesn't get you guys out of your seats, so it's a waste of possession and not as good. #xaviout...
Paganinisrvnge
New member
I literally watched all but one of Spains matches at the euros and Iniesta was definitely their best player.
BarcaOG
Banned
Two of my favorite arguments in a row
The first being "why can't you accept - my opinion -" and then proceeding to provide no evidence for it, clearly he doesn't accept your opinion and that's what he's been arguing with you the entire time... And then the second, the "statistics are inaccurate" thing, followed by a) words which don't mean anything (vivacity?! the quality of being attractively lively and animated, especially in a woman? what?) and b) statements that have just been proven wrong by those supposedly inaccurate statistics
Specifically
And the statistics addressing it
Like he provided the counterargument, and then you proceed to ignore it and say the argument again like it's a fact
Good counter post.
You question my use of subjective qualities--intangible variables. But riddle me this: Barceona-PSG last year, return leg at the Camp Nou. PSG is up and Barcelona is playing poorly. An injured Messi comes on the field and, immediately, the team begins to sync. Each player's performance improved dramatically without Messi having made more than 5 passes-- in other words, without him yet having made a profound statistical impact. If you discount the impact of gravity and, yes, vivacity (which, by the way, need not only apply to a woman), how do you account for that?
And if you are so adamant about defending Xavi, answer me this: do you honestly feel that Xavi is as influential and effective today as he was in 2011? By all counts--your beloved statistics-- his impact has declined. What is your answer?
klc123
Member
Two of my favorite arguments in a row
The first being "why can't you accept - my opinion -" and then proceeding to provide no evidence for it, clearly he doesn't accept your opinion and that's what he's been arguing with you the entire time... And then the second, the "statistics are inaccurate" thing, followed by a) words which don't mean anything (vivacity?! the quality of being attractively lively and animated, especially in a woman? what?) and b) statements that have just been proven wrong by those supposedly inaccurate statistics
Specifically
And the statistics addressing it
Like he provided the counterargument, and then you proceed to ignore it and say the argument again like it's a fact
I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this way, they claims with no evidence, and when I use stastics that disprove their argument they say that stastics mean nothing. Then they proceed to use statistics which in my opinion don't really have much relevance (goals scored) to say how he isn't as good as before.
Feels like I'm banging my head against a wall.
klc123
Member
1. The PSG game, of course bringing on the best player on the planet, who was a big talking point before the game, will have an influence. In my opinion it had more of an effect on the PSG players than it did on the barca players, but I'm sure that won't answer your "riddle" with enough "vivacity". To put that argument to bed, messi also had a statistical impact that game, he got an assist/created the goal for villa.
You may have felt he made a difference by walking onto the pitch, but that is conformational bias of you enjoying seeing our best player coming on.
2. Messi is not as effective this season as he was in the 2011 season. I think we should start to phase him out of the team also, as clearly he is on the decline and will only get rapidly worse in the next few years...? See how wrong that argument is now?
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Paganinisrvnge
New member
2008-2009: 27 assists for Barcelona
2009-2010: 18 assists
2010-2011: 10 assists
2011-2012: 14 assists
2012-2013: 12 assists
2013-2014: 5 assists
That's purely facts and then you add in his defensive liability and getting dispossessed more than before.
2009-2010: 18 assists
2010-2011: 10 assists
2011-2012: 14 assists
2012-2013: 12 assists
2013-2014: 5 assists
That's purely facts and then you add in his defensive liability and getting dispossessed more than before.
CatalinR10
Senior Member
I believe that in 2010 , don't know exactly , he had 34 assists in all competitions.
BarcaOG
Banned
Thank you. In the language the denser members of the forum understand: statistics.
BarcaOG
Banned
Ah! So a player's presence--an intangible, non-quantifiable variable- can, in fact influence games! Thank you for capitulating in your very first point. Notice too that I stated: "Each player's performance improved dramatically without Messi...yet having made a statistical impact." Yet. Yet. I did not say his impact was intangible only, because as you point out he did notch up an assist. But before that happened his mere presence revived the entire team. You conceded so yourself. The purpose of this example is to illustrate that influential players' presence can indeed impact games. Xavi, once the best central midfielder, had such impact himself. I argue he no longer does.
Valid point, except my argument is not against Messi. Relatively speaking his influence is and, despite his dip in form, continues to be integral for us. Certainly in comparison to Xavi. Consider too that Messi was injured this season while Xavi was not.
Pepe Silvia
Active member
I watched all of EC 2012 Iniesta was magic the entire tournament, Spains best player. Xavi's performance against Pirlo and Italy was absolutely breathtaking, but overall wasn't nearly as consistent as Iniesta throughout the tournament. Xavi turned it up to epic levels for the final.
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