1 - Marc-Andre ter Ansplant
- Thread starter kaddel11
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TornAndFrayed
Banned
It took half an hour to scroll past that wall of text on mu phone
tl;dr anyone?
Locals fit in better locally than foreigners, I think.
That's just a guess. I didn't read shit.
Topolino
Gemusesuppe
Messi983
Senior Member
[MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION]
While I agree that factors you mentioned influenced on players decision whether to stay or move I think majority of players are still mostly influenced by two things - playing time/their role in team and money. Of course most player will say that playing time is the reason they signed for club X over club Y and most won't admit it was because financial offer of one club was better but we all know how important role money plays in modern football. It's nothing wrong with that of course as all are professionals and wants to earn as much as possible during the 8-10 years of their career they can play on top level. You also never know when you can get serious injury that can ruin your career.
Also, another thing to mention is that there are probably higher statistical posibilities you'll keep a 22 yo player who has only played for one professional club before (like MAtS) longer than you'll keep 28 yo player who has already played for 6 or 7 clubs in his career.
While I agree that factors you mentioned influenced on players decision whether to stay or move I think majority of players are still mostly influenced by two things - playing time/their role in team and money. Of course most player will say that playing time is the reason they signed for club X over club Y and most won't admit it was because financial offer of one club was better but we all know how important role money plays in modern football. It's nothing wrong with that of course as all are professionals and wants to earn as much as possible during the 8-10 years of their career they can play on top level. You also never know when you can get serious injury that can ruin your career.
Also, another thing to mention is that there are probably higher statistical posibilities you'll keep a 22 yo player who has only played for one professional club before (like MAtS) longer than you'll keep 28 yo player who has already played for 6 or 7 clubs in his career.
F
Flavia
Guest
[tw]769515502259634177[/tw]
BBZ8800
Senior Member
It took half an hour to scroll past that wall of text on mu phone
tl;dr anyone?
Oh, in shorter:
In short, for local players=Barca is a home.
For foreign players=Barca is a job.
Barca's history from the last 25-30 years says that only a homegrown players stayed for 10+ years here. Like Puyol, Xavi, Iniesta, Valdes, Busi etc.
My personal guess is that it is influenced by social things like: Barcelona is your city, your friends are here, you are a fan of Barca since early age, your family love Barca, this is your city/country/home, you are used to this style of life and climate.
On the other hand, regarding posts: Neymar/Mats/a random youngish foreign player will stay here for a decade, we need to rely on him:
Barca's stats say that there isn't a single foreign player (except Messi, but he is a La Masia product and a different case than classic foreigners) ever who stayed here longer than 7-8 years (that is an absolute record).
In posts above I have mention 10s of different foreign youngsters+players bought in mid 20s, who's careers are imo influenced by a different culture, being homesick, coming from a different climate, different style of life, wife/family want you to move to a home country/or a new random country, or not willing to stay and wait to long once when you get into fights with a coach/board etc. In shorter, when random problems arrive, foreigners will usually have less patience than local players.
For the end, my estimation:
1. for guys like Xavi and similar, Barca is home and the only place to be.
If you are successful here, more or less, there is 0-1% chance that you will ever leave the club.
Where would you go? This is your home, and this is the best team in the world.
You will leave only if the club kicks you out, break your contract or if you fall down in the pecking order. But even then, you will try to stay in lots of cases.
2. foreign players: Ronaldinho, R9, Etoo, Rivaldo, Neymar, Mats etc:
Barca is not your home.
You are not born here.
Barca is not THE ONLY place where you want to live and play. You are "opened" for other options if they'll arrive somewhere during your career from this or that reason.
Also, imo, foreigners will be easily distracted by lucrative offers from other top teams (compared to Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol etc).
For example, I can imagine Neymar or someone leaving the club for better wages, but I couldn't see Xavi/Puyol doing that ever, no matter how much money you offer them.
That could, imo, to some extent explain this list of record holding foreigners at Barca:
8: Alves (8 seasons)
7: Masch, Marquez, Reiziger
6: R. Koeman, Cocu, Kluivert, Etoo, Saviola
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God Serena
New member
If anyone is looking for a tl;dr on BBZ's latest masterclass, I actually read it. Here are some major bullet points.
-La Masia and Latino players are more likely to stay due to similarities in culture and general Barcelona pride
-Players from other countries can have a large number of factors contribute to causing them to leave
-Based on these things it should be expected that even our most legendary foreign or non-La Masia players are going to leave after so many seasons
-Fuck Neymar
Basically a really long way of saying we might as well have kept Bravo cuz Mats is most likely leaving in X seasons anyway.
-La Masia and Latino players are more likely to stay due to similarities in culture and general Barcelona pride
-Players from other countries can have a large number of factors contribute to causing them to leave
-Based on these things it should be expected that even our most legendary foreign or non-La Masia players are going to leave after so many seasons
-Fuck Neymar
Basically a really long way of saying we might as well have kept Bravo cuz Mats is most likely leaving in X seasons anyway.
ini4ever
Member
Dude, srsly your debating method is so damn unique. The most entertaining one i've ever seen on the net
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It's about re-sale value though. If we sold Mats in a few years for big money, hypothetically, then that'd big money we can spend to replace him. If we stick with Bravo then we lose him for nothing in a few years and then have to find the money from somewhere else which eats into other budgets.
That might not matter too much but when the rest of the team is full of players approaching 30, or in their 30s, then this is something we're going to have to do too often to keep on doing it. As an example we'll lose Iniesta for nothing when it'll cost silly money to try and replace him. We've tried to replace Alves (lost for nothing) on the cheap but will probably end up spending 30 million on a replacement next year.
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oneirophobos
New member
That's a good point. There's a safety in numbers that even if after all we've seen the German somehow still turns out as a fraud, he's still young enough to compete on the market in a way that Bravo really couldn't. If the dilemma between goalies had to come to a head, it happened at most fortuitous time, let's be real here. If the decline in Bravo's performances really happened (and I don't think it did, at least not to the extent some members on this forum claim but that's a given with the sheer intensity of MAtS vs. Bravo arguments here), the media didn't catch up on it, he just returned victorious from second CopaAm win and as a captain of his NT to boot and it was this window that Pep/ManCity didn't hesitate much to spend crazy coins on new additions. People complain about FCB letting go of Bravo for too little but the numbers of transfer fee expectations thrown around on here were completely unrealistic, near-legendary keepers who still play didn't go for as much.
No matter how you try to swing the statistic to fit your own agenda, it makes perfect sense for foreigners spending shorter time at FCB. First, we buy them older and once they proved themselves in their own leagues and are financially a bigger deal for the club. If they fail miserably, the sporting director tries to sell them as quickly as possible before the re-sale value is lost. If they succeed, they still might have to deal with reduced playing time due to highly-competitive nature of our squad while their agents receive lucrative offers from other clubs. Even with our home-grown players, it's easier to keep someone mediocre like Rafinha than a player 3x times better. "Barca DNA" is a nice sentiment but has little to do with the modern business of football.
No matter how you try to swing the statistic to fit your own agenda, it makes perfect sense for foreigners spending shorter time at FCB. First, we buy them older and once they proved themselves in their own leagues and are financially a bigger deal for the club. If they fail miserably, the sporting director tries to sell them as quickly as possible before the re-sale value is lost. If they succeed, they still might have to deal with reduced playing time due to highly-competitive nature of our squad while their agents receive lucrative offers from other clubs. Even with our home-grown players, it's easier to keep someone mediocre like Rafinha than a player 3x times better. "Barca DNA" is a nice sentiment but has little to do with the modern business of football.
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