10 - Lionel Messi - v2

[abual3bed1]

Comparing Leo to Maradona is somehow unfair for both of the players. both are great footballers and will always be said to be the best. Giving the advantage for one of them in one aspect might cause to be unfair for the other. Leo is in a great team and Maradona dragged Napoli "almost" single handedly. Yet football is more difficult today than the days of Diego.

On the skills, Leo tends to play more direct than Diego who used to be in a way a showoff where he wanted to pass through players yet Leo always has his eye on the goal. so please stop with non-sense comparison between the 2 and enjoy Leo while we can. We are privileged to watch Leo live week in and week out and the previous generation had that privilege with Maradona and we all enjoyed our time. so just enjoy it and stop all the non-sense.

 

[Malappapper]

Comparing Leo to Maradona is somehow unfair for both of the players. both are great footballers and will always be said to be the best. Giving the advantage for one of them in one aspect might cause to be unfair for the other. Leo is in a great team and Maradona dragged Napoli "almost" single handedly. Yet football is more difficult today than the days of Diego.

On the skills, Leo tends to play more direct than Diego who used to be in a way a showoff where he wanted to pass through players yet Leo always has his eye on the goal. so please stop with non-sense comparison between the 2 and enjoy Leo while we can. We are privileged to watch Leo live week in and week out and the previous generation had that privilege with Maradona and we all enjoyed our time. so just enjoy it and stop all the non-sense.

You make it sound as if it is irrational or even sacrilegious to compare the two.

One of my basic arguments, is that it is false to claim that Maradona was playing alone. Furthermore, how good Juventus and Inter actually were in 86/87? On what basis can they be seen as immovable objects, moved by the Herculean Diego?

*Clue: Platini played virtually no part that season as he was already well past his best, it was his last year a player.

 

[raskolnikov]

How was diego considered before 86? Im pretty sure he wasnt clearly above zico and Platini.
No need to compare much though, both are legends.

 

[King Leo]

He actually was above zico and platini although. Zico was amazing in my dial 82 but maradona was superior to both before 86. That,s fact

 

[Paganinisrvnge]

Am I the only one that thinks that Maradona ruined one of Messi's good chances to get a world cup in 2010? Hear me out.

What are Argentina lacking right now? A defense more than anything.

In 2010, Inter Milan won the treble(knocking us out in the process) with a very, very good defense of which not one, not two, but three Argentines were crucial figures. I don't understand how Maradona did not call up even one of Cambiasso, Samuel, or Zanetti. Sure, they were already pretty old but they were playing at a high level. Instead, he called up Jonas Gutierrez, Maxi Rodriguez, and Burdisso. He had no ball playing midfielder of quality and played Tevez every match.

I know some things can't be blamed on him since Aguero and Banega have really emerged after the world cup but the defense could have been MUCH better had he picked the Inter players.

 

[Kerrybai]

Am I the only one that thinks that Maradona ruined one of Messi's good chances to get a world cup in 2010? Hear me out.

What are Argentina lacking right now? A defense more than anything.

In 2010, Inter Milan won the trouble(knocking us out in the process) with a very, very good defense of which not one, not two, but three Argentines were crucial figures. I don't understand how Maradona did not call up even one of Cambiasso, Samuel, or Zanetti. Sure, they were already pretty old but they were playing at a high level. Instead, he called up Jonas Gutierrez, Maxi Rodriguez, and Burdisso. He had no ball playing midfielder of quality and played Tevez every match.

I know some things can't be blamed on him since Aguero and Banega have really emerged after the world cup but the defense could have been MUCH better had he picked the Inter players.

A different manager could have made a difference but I don't think it would have been major. I still think Germany would have been too strong and had they some how beaten they still had Spain and the Netherlands to deal with.

The Argentina attack has vastly improved with Aguero and Di Maria moving towards their best years, and of course Messi somehow lifting his game.

 

[Cule4life]

Am I the only one that thinks that Maradona ruined one of Messi's good chances to get a world cup in 2010? Hear me out.

What are Argentina lacking right now? A defense more than anything.

In 2010, Inter Milan won the treble(knocking us out in the process) with a very, very good defense of which not one, not two, but three Argentines were crucial figures. I don't understand how Maradona did not call up even one of Cambiasso, Samuel, or Zanetti. Sure, they were already pretty old but they were playing at a high level. Instead, he called up Jonas Gutierrez, Maxi Rodriguez, and Burdisso. He had no ball playing midfielder of quality and played Tevez every match.

I know some things can't be blamed on him since Aguero and Banega have really emerged after the world cup but the defense could have been MUCH better had he picked the Inter players.

+1
Everyone was wondering why he did'nt call Cambiasso and Zanetti

 

[Paganinisrvnge]

back then a line-up of

------------------------Romero-------------------------
Zanetti----Samuel ---- Gabi Milito -----Heinze
-------------Mascherano----Cambiasso----------
-----------------------Riquelme------------------------
------------------------Messi---------------------------
-----------Tevez----------------Higuain-------------

or something along those lines would have been much more effective. I am no tactical genius but I know that Maradona's squad selection was awful.

 

[lessthanjake]

Am I the only one that thinks that Maradona ruined one of Messi's good chances to get a world cup in 2010? Hear me out.

What are Argentina lacking right now? A defense more than anything.

In 2010, Inter Milan won the treble(knocking us out in the process) with a very, very good defense of which not one, not two, but three Argentines were crucial figures. I don't understand how Maradona did not call up even one of Cambiasso, Samuel, or Zanetti. Sure, they were already pretty old but they were playing at a high level. Instead, he called up Jonas Gutierrez, Maxi Rodriguez, and Burdisso. He had no ball playing midfielder of quality and played Tevez every match.

I know some things can't be blamed on him since Aguero and Banega have really emerged after the world cup but the defense could have been MUCH better had he picked the Inter players.

Totally agree, but part of Argentina's problem was also a lack of a good midfield that could consistently work the ball up to the forwards. It forced them to play Messi in a much deeper role, which takes away a lot of his dangerousness (not that he's not good in a deeper role, but having to make someone capable of 88 goals in a year into just a playmaker really weakens the team). Of course, they could've played Riquelme, if Maradona hadn't had disagreements with him. Without Maradona, they could've played the following:

GK: Sergio Romero
RB: Javier Zanetti
CB: Walter Samuel
CB: Martin Demichelis
LB: Gabriel Heinze
CM: Javier Mascherano
CM: Esteban Cambiasso
CM: Juan Roman Riquelme
LF: Angel Di Maria
CF: Lionel Messi
CF: Gonzalo Higuain

They'd have had Aguero, Tevez, and in-form Diego Milito on the bench to rotate the forwards or provide attacking off the bench. Veron would have been a solid midfielder off the bench.

They probably would still have lost to Germany, but they would have at least been able to play Messi as more of a striker if they had that midfield, and the defense would've been more solid. Bear in mind, though, he DID call up Walter Samuel. Samuel just was injured in the group stages I believe.

 

[lessthanjake]

Could have even played with this:


------------------------Romero-------------------------
Zanetti----Samuel ---- Mascherano -----Heinze
-------------------Cambiasso-----------------------
-------------Riquelme---------------------------------
-------------------------------Aguero---------------
------------------------Messi---------------------------
-----------Higuain----------------Di Maria-------------


You could pretty much mirror the roles Barcelona's players have here. Messi as a false nine. The other two strikers playing a bit more wide but making frequent runs when Messi drops deep. Aguero would play the Iniesta role. Riquelme would play the Xavi role. Etc.

 

[Vapor]

I really hope we face some really touch competition in the Champion's League this year. Seeing Messi do what he does against the best teams in the world (Dortmund or Juventus for instance) would really go a long way in proving to all those "HES ONLY GOOD CAUSE LA LIGA SUX" ignoramuses how good he really is.

Then, once he wins the world cup in 2014 with Argentina there will be no more question about who is the greatest of all time arty1:

 

[misterplatin]

I really hope we face some really touch competition in the Champion's League this year. Seeing Messi do what he does against the best teams in the world (Dortmund or Juventus for instance) would really go a long way in proving to all those "HES ONLY GOOD CAUSE LA LIGA SUX" ignoramuses how good he really is.

Then, once he wins the world cup in 2014 with Argentina there will be no more question about who is the greatest of all time arty1:

He does not have to prove anything to english media.Every year we have faced tough competition. Messi is CL top scorer 4 times in a row ,more than he has been a pichichi .It is hilarious how people forget his contribution in the CL for the last 4 years.

 

[Paganinisrvnge]

There are some people who believe that Stoke, Sunderland, Wigan, etc. all have world class defenses that would stifle Messi.

 

[lessthanjake]

He actually was above zico and platini although. Zico was amazing in my dial 82 but maradona was superior to both before 86. That,s fact

I'm not sure that's true.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onze_d'Or

Maradona was not eligible for the Ballon D'or because he was not from Europe, and the FIFA World Player of the Year did not exist, but the Onze D'or DID exist back then. The award is voted on by the magazine's readers. Prior to 1986, Platini won 3 Onze D'ors in a row, just as he had won 3 Ballon D'ors in a row. The award is voted on by the readers of a French speaking magazine so there is an obvious bias in favor of French players. This may explain Platini winning it over Maradona. HOWEVER, notice that Maradona was in THIRD place in 1985, not only behind Platini but also behind Preben Elkjær Larsen, who is, of course, not French at all. If Maradona were really the clear-cut best in the world at that time, we'd either expect him to get 1st place in this award or at least get 2nd place, losing only to Platini due to bias in favor of French players. That did not happen. Furthermore, he was not in the top three for the award any other year prior to that. Therefore, I think it's hard to argue that Maradona was the clear cut best in the world in the years prior to 1986.

Or how about this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Soccer_(magazine)#Award_winners

A non-French award that gave Platini the title of best in the world in the years prior to 1986.


One look at both these awards indicates that Maradona was not in any way dominant as being considered the world's best player for a long period of time. He was certainly recognized as the player of the year in 1986 due to the World Cup, and he was up there amongst the top players from 1985-1988. He was not, however, the fairly clear-cut best player in the world for 4 years and counting like Messi was. Maradona's dominance in public opinion during his peak of 1985-1988 more seems to resemble Messi's 2007-2010 than it does Messi's 2009-2012.

 

[abual3bed1]

You make it sound as if it is irrational or even sacrilegious to compare the two.

One of my basic arguments, is that it is false to claim that Maradona was playing alone. Furthermore, how good Juventus and Inter actually were in 86/87? On what basis can they be seen as immovable objects, moved by the Herculean Diego?

*Clue: Platini played virtually no part that season as he was already well past his best, it was his last year a player.

It's not irrational or anything, just comparing Messi and Maradona is like comparing between 2 of the finest diamonds there is.

As for Maradona playing alone, I didn't watch much of his matches but thanx to brother's library of Serie A during the 80s, I can tell you that Maradona was "almost" alone and took his team from being a regular mid-table to a title challenger even with strong competition from many teams and great players back then.