11 - Ousmane Dembélé - V1

[FCBfan22]

The loan rumors are true if Griezmann arrives but not crucial. They plan to lend it for 1 year but maybe not in the second possibility.

Well, no width season incoming. We have to remember, that despite Deloufeu being useless, he still dragged defenders wide for at least two months. Anyone who organises themselves as Roma did in the 2nd leg will crush us.

And we are apparently planing to loan Dembele to Atletico. We can only be more stupid if we loan him to Madrid. Plus we will be a laughing stock for the 2nd time this year (loaning a 140 million player).


Squad depth, what is that?

 

[DonAK]

Loaning Dembélé to play in Simeone's defensive system lmao

 

[henias]

The board is a laughing stock.

 

[KingLeo10]

Loaning Dembélé to play in Simeone's defensive system lmao

no better way to teach a creative, pacy forward to defend a 4-1 lead in CL than a spell at atletico. valverde knows.

 

[xXKonan]

Why should we loan our only talented winger?

Seriously do these guys expect to play Griez as a winger when he's not a winger. Seriously all this is just short sighted bullshit all because we are apparently afraid to phase Suarez out who has been on the decline. Wouldn't want to hurt Messi's BFF's feelings despite not living up to standards in the CL and even the league in ages now.

Sure Suarez scored a number of goals this season, but take away those goals what does he have? his passing has been shocking and he's been killing plays and he's always on the floor or offside. I respect the guy for what he has done here but it's pretty obvious he won't ever return to how he once was.

We shouldn't send Dembele on loan, we should bring Griez in and move Suarez to the bench.

 

[DonAK]

no better way to teach a creative, pacy forward to defend a 4-1 lead in CL than a spell at atletico. valverde knows.

Valverde playing 4D Chess here. Why bother wasting your time teaching Dembele his defensive responsibilities when you can send him to Simeone where all he'll do is defend.

To be honest it would be better to sell Dembele instead of loaning him out. If Valverde doesn't trust him or like him or rate him then sell him and get someone like Hazard instead. At least the guy will be obligated to play an established star rather than a young talent.

Imagine Atletico eliminate us again in the CL next season with Dembele playing a key role. We would be the laughing stock of football. Rather not risk that shit, especially knowing how Simeone cannot buy a win against us in the league, but got this club by its balls in the Champions League.

If Griezmann is signed to play as a glorified winger in a 4-4-2 with Suarez and Messi up top I'm already calling next season's CL campaign dead. Coutinho will be a great addition, but having yet another season with the same issues in a competition where intensity, control and balance between attack and defence matters a lot is not going to have a happy ending. Better hope we win the league again then.

 

[FCBfan22]

Why should we loan our only talented winger?

Seriously do these guys expect to play Griez as a winger when he's not a winger. Seriously all this is just short sighted bullshit all because we are apparently afraid to phase Suarez out who has been on the decline. Wouldn't want to hurt Messi's BFF's feelings despite not living up to standards in the CL and even the league in ages now.

Sure Suarez scored a number of goals this season, but take away those goals what does he have? his passing has been shocking and he's been killing plays and he's always on the floor or offside. I respect the guy for what he has done here but it's pretty obvious he won't ever return to how he once was.

We shouldn't send Dembele on loan, we should bring Griez in and move Suarez to the bench.

Exactly. But I'm afraid that with our fucking rodent board, the logic fails. Now watch us panic in 2 years when Suarez declines even more with Messi wasting his every ounce of energy trying to get him to score and we sell every single talented forward we have. Meanwhile, Madrid will sign Eriksen as Modrić replacement.

We are Barcelona, we try to compete in all 3 competitions, so what's wrong with having 4 good forwards? And fucking fix the midfeld. You are loaning out forwards and buying new 100 million ones, buying the defenders, but noone is doing nothing about filling the gap that Iniesta will leave, at least slightly. For fucks sake.

 

[DonAK]

I don't think people realize yet how this team is elevated by Messi, despite his own issues when it comes to intensity and what not.

Once he's gone, we'll be back to being a normal club like Bayern are right now, but with a board and management whose squad planning is among the worst out of all top teams in Europe.

Been saying it since May 2013 when I joined this forum, but people always looked at what was in front of them short-term. I don't want to be pessimistic, but I see very hard times for us from 2021 onwards. When the damage is done it might take many years for us to recover again.

And don't tell me how the club was stuck in a rut in the late 90s or early 2000s. I couldn't give a fucking shit about that. That is in the PAST. At this junction Barca should do whatever it takes for them to stay where they are and get better. Stay as a dominant club for decades. Stop being a bunch of pussies or losers with no desire to compete to be the best.

 

[wisconsincule]

I don’t get how people are criticizing him. I keep saying the same thing. This guy missed half the season with an injury and had absolutely no pre season but yet has produced. He’s soon to be 21. He’s an unpolished diamond but with time will be the real deal. I would rather sack Valverde than loan or sell him. This guy is the real deal.

 

[DonAK]

Dembele is in a bad situation here. I think the best thing for both him and the club would be a sale. I honestly don't see any use for him here with Valverde or any manager like that. Players like him need to play in a system where they are allowed to make mistakes and show their best abilities. Be able to be the dangerous players they are and can be.

For that you need a certain system and a manager with vision. Zidane is proving to be one with Real Madrid. You have Klopp in Liverpool. Pep despite his shitty results in the CL with Man City, I mean just look at the improvement of Sane and Sterling. Heynckes is great with that too.

Valverde just isn't that.

You put young attacking progidies like Hazard with someone like Mourinho and Conte and years later you'll start questioning what went wrong? A player with immense potential, but never gotten someone to develop him and hone his skills.

That case would repeat itself with Dembele. Neither Dembele or Valverde can afford sitting on the bench or developing him because of his preference for experience and rigid tactics.

It's therefore better to sign an already established player.

Valverde can maximize the potential of hard working midfielders like Rakitic or a defender just like Conte did with David Luiz or Mourinho with various players throughout his career. It just won't work with a young winger or a young attacking midfielder IMO.

Having a 100m+ signing rotting on the bench is bad for the club. You'll get less money for him. And it's bad for the player. Hurts his development and he'll not be able to make an instant impact off the bench in 10 minutes either.

Loans never turn out well for us either. Just not worth it.

Being completely serious here, I think there's an argument to the club cutting its losses and getting in someone that's undroppable and got the fundamentals that don't need further developing if we're going to keep Valverde and also go for a similar manager after he eventually leaves.

We're probably fucked either way because we lack vision, but it's better to make something out of a potentially bad situation and try to do the best we can short-term at least.

 

[FCBfan22]

And, the biggest problem I have with this is: we won't be able to play 4-3-3 again if we do that. With this going through, I can see us playing 4-4-2 or 4-2-3-1 the whole season, while playing Griezmann as a LM and Coutinho out of position in RM. Great.

Everything points to that direction. We will loan our only winger and play a world class player out of position. Another thing that indicates into this direction is that we have no desire to sign a central midfielder, despite Don leaving. We are looking at only CDM's, which is the only position, where we are stacked.

Ernie probably thinks that those systems help the defence. They do on short term, but when you play Messi and Suarez constantly together, your midfield will be dead in April from defending in a 4-4-0 formation. Play Messi and 2 hard working forwards. Problem solved. If Luis wants to play, he needs to track back. If not, he is a Messi sub.

 

[Givenchy]

Dembele is in a bad situation here. I think the best thing for both him and the club would be a sale. I honestly don't see any use for him here with Valverde or any manager like that. Players like him need to play in a system where they are allowed to make mistakes and show their best abilities. Be able to be the dangerous players they are and can be.

For that you need a certain system and a manager with vision. Zidane is proving to be one with Real Madrid. You have Klopp in Liverpool. Pep despite his shitty results in the CL with Man City, I mean just look at the improvement of Sane and Sterling. Heynckes is great with that too.

Valverde just isn't that.

You put young attacking progidies like Hazard with someone like Mourinho and Conte and years later you'll start questioning what went wrong? A player with immense potential, but never gotten someone to develop him and hone his skills.

That case would repeat itself with Dembele. Neither Dembele or Valverde can afford sitting on the bench or developing him because of his preference for experience and rigid tactics.

It's therefore better to sign an already established player.

Valverde can maximize the potential of hard working midfielders like Rakitic or a defender just like Conte did with David Luiz or Mourinho with various players throughout his career. It just won't work with a young winger or a young attacking midfielder IMO.

Having a 100m+ signing rotting on the bench is bad for the club. You'll get less money for him. And it's bad for the player. Hurts his development and he'll not be able to make an instant impact off the bench in 10 minutes either.

Loans never turn out well for us either. Just not worth it.

Being completely serious here, I think there's an argument to the club cutting its losses and getting in someone that's undroppable and got the fundamentals that don't need further developing if we're going to keep Valverde and also go for a similar manager after he eventually leaves.

We're probably fucked either way because we lack vision, but it's better to make something out of a potentially bad situation and try to do the best we can short-term at least.

no no no no noooooooooo

seriously if someone is to go, its EV. the guy is a fucking bore turning us into a 442 safety first mess. I can't watch Barca turn into Chelsea and to a lesser extent recent United who are about to lose Martial because Mourinho doesn't care about the future. Dembele is a Barca fan, the kid kicked up a fuss to join us only to have a horrible start to his career here. selling him would be a HUGE mistake.

Get rid of EV, bring in an attacking coach like Tuchel/Sarri and not only Dembele but the whole team will flourish

 

[DonAK]

no no no no noooooooooo

seriously if someone is to go, its EV. the guy is a fucking bore turning us into a 442 safety first mess. I can't watch Barca turn into Chelsea and to a lesser extent recent United who are about to lose Martial because Mourinho doesn't care about the future. Dembele is a Barca fan, the kid kicked up a fuss to join us only to have a horrible start to his career here. selling him would be a HUGE mistake.

Get rid of EV, bring in an attacking coach like Tuchel/Sarri and not only Dembele but the whole team will flourish

Not going to happen and I think we have to accept it and just bite the bullet. I'm grateful for the domestic double just as I was for the 100 point season and Lucho's first couple of seasons, but I won't ignore the warning signs just like I didn't do it back then. It's been a trend lately. A year or two of boom only for us to go bust in the most painful manner. Back to the drawing board. Same issues. Poor signings, managers with a short-term vision and lack of tactical adaptability and player development, both 1st team and Barca B got these issues.

The club is never going to choose a talent over a manager unless it's Messi and that's the right way too. It's up to the club to hire the manager that got the same vision as them and up to the manager to adapt if he want, or can. I have a hard time seeing that happen.

It makes no sporting or financial sense to keep a player(or loan him) that you signed for 105m + incentives that the manager doesn't trust and will likely be starting at the bench a lot. It hurts his development and because he's a young player that need game time, it'll also impact what he can do off the bench for us.

So in the end we'll be benching a 100m+ investment that we'll get no return from as he'll be unable to make a great impact in 10-20 mins with the type of player he is, and we'll keep losing money on him.

 

[FCBfan22]

Not going to happen and I think we have to accept it and just bite the bullet. I'm grateful for the domestic double just as I was for the 100 point season and Lucho's first couple of seasons, but I won't ignore the warning signs just like I didn't do it back then. It's been a trend lately. A year or two of boom only for us to go bust in the most painful manner. Back to the drawing board. Same issues. Poor signings, managers with a short-term vision and lack of tactical adaptability and player development, both 1st team and Barca B got these issues.

The club is never going to choose a talent over a manager unless it's Messi and that's the right way too. It's up to the club to hire the manager that got the same vision as them and up to the manager to adapt if he want, or can. I have a hard time seeing that happen.

It makes no sporting or financial sense to keep a player(or loan him) that you signed for 105m + incentives that the manager doesn't trust and will likely be starting at the bench a lot. It hurts his development and because he's a young player that need game time, it'll also impact what he can do off the bench for us.

So in the end we'll be benching a 100m+ investment that we'll get no return from as he'll be unable to make a great impact in 10-20 mins with the type of player he is, and we'll keep losing money on him.

So, you want ust to turn into Barca's version of Galacticos. Great.

 

[DonAK]

So, you want ust to turn into Barca's version of Galacticos. Great.

I don't want anything, but if we're going to go down this route we'll pretty much end up like AC Milan or Barcelona of the early 2000s. That's inevitable. At least we can maximize the potential of the last few years we got Messi until we go down the long, painful rebuild mode out of the wilderness because our board and management kept fucking up for years and years

Obviously the best scenario would be for us to be flourishing with a club that got a vision for the present and the future, that signs the right players for the positions we need. That hires the right managers, or for our managers to adapt and not only think short-term.

But right now that seems very unlikely. As I said, I don't want us to turn into anything. Barca should strive for success and more success and forget their past where times were difficult. This should be the new standard, but I believe we're more likely to fall back to the end of José Luis Núñez's tenure.

Chaos.

History is repeating itself, but many people are unfortunately only seeing what is in front of them