Stoichkov1
New member
Messi is the player who has the most touches on the ball in the team on average.
11 - Ousmane Dembélé - V1
- Thread starter Jair Ventura
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Messi is the player who has the most touches on the ball in the team on average.
Barcilliant
Senior Member
😂 No way Valverde changes his gala 11
BBZ8800
Senior Member
So:
Rafinha played good against Inter.
And bad against Real and Rayo.
People are laughing at him.
Shiny Gem-bele:
Played like the worst player in the world against Sevilla and deserved several Months of being benched.
Played good for 20 minutes against Real.
Played like a crap again against a 3rd div team in a CDR.
Played like a crap against Rayo, except scoring a goal.
So, in the last 4 matches, Gem-bele had 20 minutes (Real) and 20 seconds (goal against Rayo) of a useful play.
And you are shitting on Rafinha.
Cool story, lol.
I mean, why are we even bothering in debating?
Admit it. For a majority of guys, EV will be an idiot UNTIL:
1. he plays Gembele in every match, since he is a gem, young and has potential
2. plays Malcom for 30 minutes in every match
3. plays Semedo as a RB, no brainer, right?
4. plays Alena in the last 20-30 minutes of a match
5. and also, to give Vidal some minutes
6. plays Arthur in every match
7. and a bonus request, to play the most shiny lineup possible: Alba-Umtiti-Pique (or even bench him)-Semedo, Busi-Coutinho-Arthur, Gembele-Suarez-Messi
Until EV will do all of these 7, he will be trashed after every single match.
Is there even any need to comment Dempele after his last 4 matches?
Be serious.
Currently he looks like a 40M player at best, and even that is questionable.
El Trencaxarxes
Member
He's not, no. As per WhoScored.com Arturo Vidal, Ivan Rakitic, Arthur, Sergio Busquets and Jordi Alba all have more touches per 90 minutes of football than Messi has.
messi15478
Banned
He shouldnt start today, will have many ball losses which will cause many counter attacks for Inter
BBZ8800
Senior Member
Personal insults again.
That says a lot about your arguments.
Also, this is fun lately, whoever doesn't like someone's favorite player is: a troll or a RM fan.
Regarding El Trencax's stats, lol. He used only attacking stats, which shows that Dembele is one of the best creators in our team, no shit Sherlock.
Who are his opponents?
Suarez who can't play a simple pass?
Rakitic a babysitter?
Arthur, who is learning currently how to play a forward pass here and there?
A pivot Busi?
Semedo with 0 assists in 2 years for Barca?
Basically, his only opponents are Messi and Coutinho.
Can I use similar stats showing that Adama is the best dribbler?
Or how awesome Paulinho is due to a ratio of shooting attempts vs goals scored ratio.
Or how Semedo has 0 assists at Barca in 2 seasons, which is a truly amazing achievement.
A short info: we have learned over the years that we can do anything with stats.
We can twist them in any possible way.
I have done it 100s of times, the same as 100s of other guys, to fit their agenda.
It is hard to be too objective when you love/hate some players or EV.
I can use SOME stats to show how Messi is indisputable best in everything.
Or I can cherry pick stats showing how he was below his standard in CL knockout games since 2013 and in knockout games on world cups.
Anyone can turn Suarez into a best goalscorer ever for Barca, using SOME stats.
Or, we can make him look like shit with cherry picking stats from CL knockout games.
Cr7 can be better than Messi or way weaker than Messi, based on which stats do you cherry pick.
Saying how Dembele, as a winger is one of our most dangerous players is equal to throwing stats how Pique and Umtiti are among our players with the highest number of tackles and interceptions.
And that should show how Pique is actually good, right?
If we would have the same team and Adama instead of Dembele, Adama would be in top 2-3 players involved in a highest amount of dangerous situations in attack.
If we would have Deulofeu instead of Dembele, the same.
Of course that he would have been among the top3-4 also.
And wait, now since Deulofeu has more goals/key passes/dribbles/assists than Rafinha or some midfielder, that is a proof how Deulofeu/Dembele have to play?
Well, it depends what a coach needs.
I have said a lot of times: we already have (in majority of matches) enough of attacking power even with 4 midfielders plus Messi and Suarez.
Newsflash: nobody is denying that Dembele is good in attack.
A problem are: his IQ, not being fit to our team, a lack of chemistry with teammates, bad defending, weird positioning and off the ball movement, questionable work ethic.
Ask your mate to use stats about those things.
About my FIFA scientific proven facts, can you find stats which will show that Dempele isn't the worst defender in a current Barca's team and who is sometimes painful to watch when he is trying to close down an opponent.
If I am making mistakes in my post, forgive me, mate.
I am still only 14.
For the end, how to not add some trolling and harsher words in posts after a post like yours.
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El Trencaxarxes
Member
See, you say that but reading the last 10-15-20 pages of this thread you would think that Dembélé does not create a lot, that Dembélé is not a goalscoring threat to be reckoned with and that he is not a world-class talent that has shown so much more at this stage of his career, than countless other footballers have. Let me just quickly reiterate a point: The current favourite for winning Ballon d'Or this year was playing in Dinamo Zagreb when he was Dembélé's aged. Maybe we should stop overreacting to the nth degree every single time one of our players perform slightly worse than we had expected them to. Especially when, at the end of the day, they are still scoring and assisting a lot.
You probably can. I don't think that would be an unfair assessment. Adama is right up there with the likes Messi, Hazard and Neymar. Not only does he complete at a ton of dribbles every single game, but he also does it with staggering efficiency. Adama is undoubtedly one of the best dribblers in the game, so what exactly is your point?
Actually, Paulinho scored fewer goals last season that he was statistically expected to. His non-penalty expected goals were more than two goals above his actual non-penalty goal tally.
That's actually not true. I don't know what your point is here either. Semedo doesn't create a lot of goalscoring opportunities. He holds back.
I'm not sure what your point is. I would never dare suggest that statistics can paint a full picture. What I will suggest, however, is that they can be a useful tool to asses in exactly which aspects of the game a player is consistently contributing constructively. You can look at defensive actions, offensive actions, ball retention, and a load of other statistics to try and gauge exactly where a player has his fortes. And that is exactly what I have been trying to show the choir of doomsday-critics of Dembélé lately. While Rafinha is certainly good and contributes in a lot of areas, it's stupid to pretend that he is as big a creative and offensive capacity as Dembélé. Dembélé is one of the most talented players in the world in those aspects. Rafinha can't be a one-to-one stand-in for Dembélé and vice-versa.
Also, for fuck's sake please spell his name properly instead of this Gem-bele or Dempele gimmick. It legitimately makes you come across as a 10-year old.
BBZ8800
Senior Member
For anyone who is describing this as a good match, you can count it for yourself:
Forward passes: 2
1 successful
1 bad
Dribbles: 0
0 successful
1 failed
Crosses: 6
1 successful
5 lost balls
1 goal scored.
And 5+ backpasses
So, he scored a goal, which is awesome.
Other than that, in attacking actions, he had 9 attempts:
1 good pass, 1 good cross and 7 lost balls (1 dribble, 1 forward pass, 5 crosses):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttCWhVOTtbI
Do I need to add Sevilla's video and Leonesa video also?
That is 3 out of 4 horrible displays in the last 14 days.
And then when some say that Dembele plays like shit overall and that he is lucky with goals like Paulinho the last season, you get offended like teen girls.
He is a 150M player.
And he is either equal to a poor Rafinha, or slightly better.
Which is sad and not good enough, either way.
Forward passes: 2
1 successful
1 bad
Dribbles: 0
0 successful
1 failed
Crosses: 6
1 successful
5 lost balls
1 goal scored.
And 5+ backpasses
So, he scored a goal, which is awesome.
Other than that, in attacking actions, he had 9 attempts:
1 good pass, 1 good cross and 7 lost balls (1 dribble, 1 forward pass, 5 crosses):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttCWhVOTtbI
Do I need to add Sevilla's video and Leonesa video also?
That is 3 out of 4 horrible displays in the last 14 days.
And then when some say that Dembele plays like shit overall and that he is lucky with goals like Paulinho the last season, you get offended like teen girls.
He is a 150M player.
And he is either equal to a poor Rafinha, or slightly better.
Which is sad and not good enough, either way.
Bulgroz
Senior Member
Where's the personal insult ? Did you not read the "and" between "a 14yo troll" and "a guy who uses FIFA stats as a scientific proof" ? I didn't insult you, I just stated a fact: you're a guy who uses FIFA stats as a scientific proof. We all know who the 14yo troll is (hint n°1: he's a guy who managed to post more in a month than some regular users who've been here for several years; hint n°2: since apparently the first hint wasn't clear enough, IT'S NOT YOU).
I really am puzzled at your reaction honestly. I don't think I've ever picked a fight or insulted anyone here (except that said 14yo troll, but once again, I'm pretty sure everyone here has come to the same conclusion as me). I try to be reasonable and open minded when I'm debating (which can be hard sometimes, granted), and when I offend people without wanting to, I apologize.
You might be mistaken when you're saying I'm insulting you "again" then.
But most importantly: it was a joke. Chill out dude, seriously.
El Trencaxarxes
Member
Now, while you're at it, won't you be a darling and tell us what Rafinha and Coutinho did during their time on the pitch on Saturday?
And yet here we are, with Dembélé scoring once and assisting twice in those games. Once again, can you tell me exactly what Rafinha and Coutinho did? Dembélé was a game changer against Real. He forced their entire backline backwards every time he had the ball and was running towards their goal. Without his goal against Rayo, we either would have lost two or three points. Face it, scoring goals and generating good goalscoring opportunities is alfa and omega in football. If you don't score goals, you don't win. It's a simple as that. And Dembélé does both far better than Rafinha and every bit as well as Coutinho.
That is, quite frankly, an embarrassing rhetoric. Especially considering your own tone and choice of words throughout your comments.
on this video, I have never seen a player try as many centers in 20 minutes of the match. it is obvious that Dembélé has returned to the field to conquer.
we can see in this video that he has created many opportunities for incalculable goals.
Remember that he is also behind the third goal. It is him who gives the ball to Sergi roberto for the 3rd goal of Suarez.
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