11 - Ousmane Dembélé - V1

[messi2140]

senior players have already shown their true colors by dissing him publicly and so has our dumb coach

Found it a bit hilarious when this guy :

Said this : “But some people have said it and Ousmane knows himself that it’s a privilege to be where we are. Maybe sometimes you have to focus yourself more and be more responsible in some things. He’s very young and can be inspired by the more experienced players around him.”

And that lawn chair Pique talking how football is a 24 hour thing , while the guy is travelling days before official matches.

 

[Potroh]

as much as I appreciate what Neymar did for us, the way he left the team really brought a sour mouth and I hope he never comes back to the team.

That's all right and I guess almost everyone had an acrid mouth after Neymar departed.
But this is Dembele's thread and soooo many folks brought up the very word "professionalism" here, regarding Dembele's problems, when it has been to be a fashionable thing bashing on him, that the same "professionalism" is needed for the other players, regardless if Dembele or Neymar is in focus.

As sour mouth is not a notion of professionalism, why wouldn't or shouln't Neymar return here - if circumstances and finances allowed it?
I personally truly doubt that it would ever happen, but why not, if possible?
Just lamenting on this, because it is a highly professional matter, rather than an emotional one...

 

[Potroh]

This is for those of you who don't understand why are some of us still against him or are doubting him "even after his decisive goals".

Please come up with your famous statistics and compare Dembele's number of lost balls with those of Suarez and Messi.

 

[BBZ8800]

Please come up with your famous statistics and compare Dembele's number of lost balls with those of Suarez and Messi.

Stats are not telling the whole story.
Messi and Dembele have the same amount of lost balls.

But do you know what is the difference?
= Messi is not losing balls in an unforced way

Messi's lost balls are usually tricky through balls for Suarez and Alba.
Or when he tries to dribble past 3 and score.

Dembele's lost balls are (at least on my personal eye test): unforced errors mostly.

I have already posted a video against Netherlands:

He lost more than 10 balls in this video.
Yet, only 2-3 of those lost balls were actual "tricky" passes (the type of actions where Messi is losing the ball while trying to create a dangerous through ball for a teammate).
And majority of his lost balls are: a poor first touch, a poor shielding of a ball, a bad simple short pass, a failed dribble against 1 defender.

Now, even when Messi plays bad for his standards, he is not making stupid, rookie mistakes like:
1. a bad first touch
2. horrible simple shortpasses
3. being dispossessed due to a poor shielding of a ball
4. and random stupid decisions

All Messi's lost balls are:
1. when he is surround by 2-3 opponents
2. long passes to Alba
3. tricky through balls to Suarez
And that's it.

Dembele is losing balls and possession because he is struggling with basics of football in some moments.
Messi is losing balls because he is trying dangerous passes.

Anyway, people are using this reply: Dembele is losing the same amount of balls as Messi.
And it is implying that they are the same or similar in that area.
But when you dig deeper, you can see why a part of media and fans have turned their backs on Dembele.

So, instead of saying:
Dembele is losing the same (total) amount of balls as Messi.
We should say:
Dembele is losing the highest amount of balls in an unneeded and in an unforced manner.

That way we are getting closer to a truth.

 

[FCB1987]

Stats are not telling the whole story.
Messi and Dembele have the same amount of lost balls.

But do you know what is the difference?
= Messi is not losing balls in an unforced way

Messi's lost balls are usually tricky through balls for Suarez and Alba.
Or when he tries to dribble past 3 and score.

Dembele's lost balls are (at least on my personal eye test): unforced errors mostly.

I have already posted a video against Netherlands:

He lost more than 10 balls in this video.
Yet, only 2-3 of those lost balls were actual "tricky" passes (the type of actions where Messi is losing the ball while trying to create a dangerous through ball for a teammate).
And majority of his lost balls are: a poor first touch, a poor shielding of a ball, a bad simple short pass, a failed dribble against 1 defender.

Now, even when Messi plays bad for his standards, he is not making stupid, rookie mistakes like:
1. a bad first touch
2. horrible simple shortpasses
3. being dispossessed due to a poor shielding of a ball
4. and random stupid decisions

All Messi's lost balls are:
1. when he is surround by 2-3 opponents
2. long passes to Alba
3. tricky through balls to Suarez
And that's it.

Dembele is losing balls and possession because he is struggling with basics of football in some moments.
Messi is losing balls because he is trying dangerous passes.

Anyway, people are using this reply: Dembele is losing the same amount of balls as Messi.
And it is implying that they are the same or similar in that area.
But when you dig deeper, you can see why a part of media and fans have turned their backs on Dembele.

So, instead of saying:
Dembele is losing the same (total) amount of balls as Messi.
We should say:
Dembele is losing the highest amount of balls in an unneeded and in an unforced manner.

That way we are getting closer to a truth.

👍

 

[Cule4life]

When stats not in favor "stats don't tell whole story"

When stats in favor "stats are important too"

Hey [MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION] isn't it your aim to win no matter what, even tolerating ugly football? So why does Dembele losing balls matter to you when he's winning us points with his goals?

Before you say "goals will dry up", why don't you apply that logic to Ernie's shit football where "results will dry up like Roma"

I'll say it again, you have a classic case of cognitive dissonance

 

[Potroh]

Stats are not telling the whole story.
Messi's lost balls are usually tricky through balls for Suarez and Alba.
Or when he tries to dribble past 3 and score.
Dembele's lost balls are (at least on my personal eye test): unforced errors mostly.

I think you have a valid point here, regardless the statistics part, which indeed needs to be handled very carefully.
When you rather often quote those stats in order to aid your arguments, the very same rules should apply.

While you have valid doubts about Dembele, I do not deny that, there are some other factors to be considered.
- Yes Dembele usually screws up EASY balls and easy situations, but this is something that is related to his young age, overall inexperience, lack of routine, his stolen confidence and probably lack of concentration too.
- When he arrived to the club and right before he got seriously injured, he did nice and creative things, shown his technical abilities, but now he rather scores goals.
- He is way less confident, undecided, sometimes scared and all that is the consequence of the false tutelage he has been receiving from a mediocre coach.

Thus you are right when you mention his weak parts but there is a history to it. A forgetful and bad one of that.

Now the logical question comes - according to your notion regarding Messi's lost balls:
- How about Arthur for instance, who does not take the risks, who plays it safe (probably following the coaches verdicts), who makes no useful contributions to attack, who rarely even passes forward, who does just the very thing that you would NOT expect from both Messi and Dembele?
How can he be the rejoiced new "Xavi" in this team, without having any offensive contribution???

Is it the main factor - above anything else - if someone doesn't lose balls at all, or are players - like Dembele - needed? Players, who have imagination, fantasy, unpredictability OR the future Barca will be the mere and dull playground of otherwise good players, who are able to keep the ball, to have 60+ percent of possession BUT are UNABLE to create attacking chances, just as the past two months show and tell???

 

[KingLeo10]

I would like to personally thank Prince Dembele for providing us with this gem for posterity.

Behold, the one and all purpose antidote to BBZ's number filled essays.

 

[henias]

Lol.
Whoscored page says that he had 67% passing accuracy in Bundesliga:
https://www.whoscored.com/Players/299513/History/Ousmane-Dembélé

Are they cheaters?
Do they also have an agenda against Dembele?

All of a sudden...

Stats are not telling the whole story.

 

[Cule4life]

BBZ has always used stats only when it suits his agenda. You guys are late to the party

 

[kollegah]

LOL people again dickriding Dembele for what?
Doing nothing besides scoring a 1on1 vs Oblak which was very lucky to go in.
If Dembele is our saviour, than Paco Alcacer is the god of football.

 

[George_Costanza]

Dembele will the next big thing in football once we get rid of the clueless manager, and get someone who knows what he is doing.

 

[wisconsincule]

LOL people again dickriding Dembele for what?
Doing nothing besides scoring a 1on1 vs Oblak which was very lucky to go in.
If Dembele is our saviour, than Paco Alcacer is the god of football.

Lol what? Doing nothing besides preventing us from losing the match?? There are more people here that blatantly want players to fail than succeed. Pretty pathetic.

 

[shadows]

Dembele will the next big thing in football once we get rid of the clueless manager, and get someone who knows what he is doing.

I think its not that straightforward as getting rid of EV...Dembele also has to get his act together off the field as thats mainly whats keeping him from being completely trusted by the club..

 

[BusiTheKing]

I'm still not completely convinced, because imo, simply putting on any attacking player would have completely changed our game on saturday. I do love the fake shots he does to drop defenders in the box, tho. No doubt he would get plenty of opportunities to put those to good use if he syncs up better with Messi.