7 - Philippe Coutinho - V1
- Thread starter AnfieldEd
- Start date
Alik
Moderator
Whenever I am sad, I open some threads here and when I see posts: EV is an idiot, we need to play Coutinho-Arthur-Busi midfield, you guys make me smile.
Good morning and thanks
Whenever I'm sad, I read your comments on Arthur, Dembele, Semedo, Rafinha. Makes me smile.
Potroh
New member
Whenever I am sad, I open some threads here and when I see posts: EV is an idiot, we need to play Coutinho-Arthur-Busi midfield, you guys make me smile.
Good morning and thanks
In order to cheer up yourself and get into mood, before all you should reread your own posts.
Posts, where you express yourself, your views and knowledge with bad stats, about how each and every talented or exceptional player would NOT fit Barca, how the A-typical bench players should consist the team, and how mediocrity and middle-classness would lead to great results...
CatalinR10
Senior Member
Whenever I am sad, I open some threads here and when I see posts: EV is an idiot, we need to play Coutinho-Arthur-Busi midfield, you guys make me smile.
Good morning and thanks
now now , let's not be so naughty around christmas days
One of them is a humble guy with Barca's DNA who will improve our play.
The other guy is Neymar.
Coutinho is a better fit for Barca than Neymar on his peak of Barca's career
serghei
Senior Member
Maybe if we would see Coutinho partnered with someone like Vidal and just one of Rakitic or Busi in a midfield trio we'll have a bigger picture of what he can and can't do. But how are we supposed to find out if it can work, if Coutinho and Vidal never played together in a midfield three?
Seriously, khaled. These sort of things need work and someone who's a bit of a visionary, someone who has an idea about how to play and perfect a gameplan based on progressive possession. We'll never find those answers under someone as limited, as conservative, and as scared as Valverde.
What we do know is that Coutinho doesn't have the pace and the goal scoring threat to play on the left wing for us. And yet, Valverde only plays him there for a while, because the only player he has the guts to sub is this boy Dembele.
But I agree that we should be smarter on the market. Stop signing players who aren't a very good fit and need great management, because we don't have a very good manager and it's unlikely we'll have in the future as well. Seems like our board doesn't have a clue what type of manager Valverde is and what players he likes in midfield.
A player like Coutinho is very un-Valverde like for the type of midfield he wants. And that's the number one issue for Coutinho at Barcelona. He's stuck between a position that the manager doesn't want to use him in because he doesn't do enough defensive work, and another position that he is not great at for a club of our stature.
Last edited:
Iniesta and Deco were special players. Number 10's/AM with the positional awareness of a CM. They dont come often. They have three at them at City right now, KdB, D.Silva and B.Silva.
Coutinho is a true AM like Ozil, Mata and Fekir. Its very hard to find place to them in a 4-3-3.
At this point I dont know what the solution is.
Coutinho is a true AM like Ozil, Mata and Fekir. Its very hard to find place to them in a 4-3-3.
At this point I dont know what the solution is.
jamrock
Senior Member
I said about coutinho when we just signed him, the best we can hope for his that like KDB, he learns the position in a 3 man midfield over time, the way KDB plays that position now compared to when he started 2/3 seaosns ago is night & day.
Sadly we don't have a coach capable of helping him in his transformation.
Sadly we don't have a coach capable of helping him in his transformation.
serghei
Senior Member
What do you think we signed him for? To be a sub at LW? He was signed to be Iniesta's replacement. We need to use him in that position to see if he can play there or not.
It's pretty simple really...
Not yet. Valverde won't be here for long though...
Barcilliant
Senior Member
BBZ8800
Senior Member
A lot of crazy ideas in this topic without any numbers.
So, a Christmas gift, Mr. Con Man is back
So, a Christmas gift, Mr. Con Man is back
Let's check some stats in all matches where we played 433 or something close to a 433:
Valladolid 1:0, Cou, Busi, Raki
Huesca 8:2, Cou, Busi, Raki
Sociedad 2:1, Rafinha, Raki, Roberto
Psv 4:0, Cou, Busi, Raki
Leganes 1:2, Cou, Busi, Raki
Bilbao 1:1, Rakitic, Roberto, Vidal
Tottenham 4:2, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Valencia 1:1, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Sevilla 4:2, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Inter 2:0, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Real 5:1, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Rayo 3:2, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Inter 1:1, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Betis 3:4, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Psv 2:1, Raki, Busi, Vidal
Villareal 2:0, Raki, Busi, Vidal
Espanyol 4:0, Raki, Busi, Vidal
Levante 5:0, Raki, Busi, Vidal
Celta 2:0, Raki, Busi, Vidal
I haven't included matches:
Atletico, Alaves where we played 442.
Girona 2:2, an early red card for us.
Tottenham 1:1, a mixed lineup.
Now, let's check our players, some midfield trios and their statistical results, goals scored and goals conceded regarding Barca.
Rakitic, 19 matches:
Vall 1:0
Huesca 8:2
Sociedad 2:1
Psv 4:0
Leganes 1:2
Bilbao 1:1
Tott 4:2
Valencia 1:1
Sevilla 4:2
Inter 2:0
Real 5:1
Rayo 3:2
Inter 1:1
Betis 3:4
Psv 2:1
Vill 2:0
Esp 4:0
Lev 5:0
Celta 2:0
= 14w, 3, 2
= 55:20
Busquets, 17 matches:
Vall 1:0
Huesca 8:2
Psv 4:0
Leganes 1:2
Tott 4:2
Valencia 1:1
Sevilla 4:2
Inter 2:0
Real 5:1
Rayo 3:2
Inter 1:1
Betis 3:4
Psv 2:1
Vill 2:0
Esp 4:0
Lev 5:0
Celta 2:0
= 13 wins, 2, 2
= 52:18
Vidal, 6 matches:
Bilbao 1:1
Psv 2:1
Vill 2:0
Esp 4:0
Lev 5:0
Cel 2:0
= 5 wins, 1 draw, 0 defeats
= 16:2
Arthur, 8 matches:
Tott 4:2
Val 1:1
Sev 4:2
Inter 2:0
Real 5:1
Rayo 3:2
Inter 1:1
Betis 3:4
= 5, 2, 1
= 23:13
*********************************************************
Percentage of wins for Barca when a XX midfielder is a starter in 433:
83% Vidal
76% Busquets
74% Rakitic
63% Arthur
Goals scored per match by Barca when a XX midfielder is a starter in 433:
3,06 Busquets
2,89 Rakitic
2,88 Arthur
2,67 Vidal
Goals conceded per match by Barca when a XX midfielder is a starter in 433:
0,33 Vidal
1,05 Rakitic
1,06 Busquets
1,63 Arthur
***********************************************************
Now, let's check some midfield trios, and their stats:
Raki-Busi-Vidal, 5 matches:
Psv 2:1
Vill 2:0
Esp 4:0
Lev 5:0
Cel 2:0
= 5, 0, 0
= 15:1
Arthur-Raki-Busi, 8 matches:
Tott 4:2
Val 1:1
Sev 4:2
Int 2:0
Real 5:1
Rayo 3:2
Inter 1:1
Betis 3:4
= 5, 2, 1
= 23:13
Cou, Busi, Raki, 4 matches:
Vall 1:0
Hue 8:2
Psv 4:0
Leg 1:2
= 3, 0, 1
= 14:4
************************************************
Percentage of Barca's wins with a XX midfield trio:
100% Busi, Raki, Vidal
75% Cou, Busi, Raki
63% Arthur, Busi, Raki
Barca's goals per match with a XX midfield trio:
3,50 Cou-Raki-Busi
3,00 Raki-Busi-Vidal
2,88 Arthur-Busi-Raki
Barca's conceded goals per match:
0,20 Raki-Busi-Vidal
1,00 Cou-Raki-Busi
1,63 Arthur-Busi-Raki
*************************************************
Now, again, stats are in favor of Vidal-Raki-Busi trio.
Defensively, the weakest trio is the one when Arthur plays.
Let's take some additional stats from Whoscored to see official individual defensive stats of our midfielders:
La Liga, all matches:
Tackles:
2,5 Busquets
1,7 Vidal
0,8 Rakitic
0,5 Coutinho
0,5 Arthur
Interceptions:
2,1 Rakitic
1,5 Busquets
0,7 Vidal
0,5 Coutinho
0,3 Arthur
Clearances:
0,6 Rakitic
0,4 Vidal
0,3 Busquets
0,1 Coutinho
0,1 Arthur
Blocks:
0,2 Rakitic
0,2 Busquets
0,1 Vidal
0,0 Coutinho
0,0 Arthur
**************************************************
So, in every single defensive stat, Arthur is the weakest out of these 5.
And now, a lot of guys here, want to pair our defensively the weakest CM with the 2nd weakest (defensively) CM in Coutinho.
That would be: 2 very bad defenders in our midfield (Arthur and Coutinho), paired with Messi who is not defending and Dembele who is also quite a bad defender.
I know, that team would offer nice passes and creativity in attack.
But what happens when we would lose the ball?
= yes, 10s of deadly counters in each match with Busi being caught alone with numerous fast opponents running at him.
So, you guys are shitting on Valverde, but he is actually quite logical and he is playing a number's game.
Currently: Vidal-Busi-Raki is the strongest midfield trio with 100% of wins and conceding 0,20 goals per match.
Midfield trios with Arthur bring more control and TikiTaka passing but also 1,63 goals conceded per match.
While Coutinho-Arthur midfield duo paired with Messi and Dembele would probably break all records in terms of Barca's goals conceded per match.
Every match would end with 4:3, 3:3 and 3:4.
Valladolid 1:0, Cou, Busi, Raki
Huesca 8:2, Cou, Busi, Raki
Sociedad 2:1, Rafinha, Raki, Roberto
Psv 4:0, Cou, Busi, Raki
Leganes 1:2, Cou, Busi, Raki
Bilbao 1:1, Rakitic, Roberto, Vidal
Tottenham 4:2, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Valencia 1:1, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Sevilla 4:2, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Inter 2:0, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Real 5:1, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Rayo 3:2, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Inter 1:1, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Betis 3:4, Arthur, Busi, Raki
Psv 2:1, Raki, Busi, Vidal
Villareal 2:0, Raki, Busi, Vidal
Espanyol 4:0, Raki, Busi, Vidal
Levante 5:0, Raki, Busi, Vidal
Celta 2:0, Raki, Busi, Vidal
I haven't included matches:
Atletico, Alaves where we played 442.
Girona 2:2, an early red card for us.
Tottenham 1:1, a mixed lineup.
Now, let's check our players, some midfield trios and their statistical results, goals scored and goals conceded regarding Barca.
Rakitic, 19 matches:
Vall 1:0
Huesca 8:2
Sociedad 2:1
Psv 4:0
Leganes 1:2
Bilbao 1:1
Tott 4:2
Valencia 1:1
Sevilla 4:2
Inter 2:0
Real 5:1
Rayo 3:2
Inter 1:1
Betis 3:4
Psv 2:1
Vill 2:0
Esp 4:0
Lev 5:0
Celta 2:0
= 14w, 3, 2
= 55:20
Busquets, 17 matches:
Vall 1:0
Huesca 8:2
Psv 4:0
Leganes 1:2
Tott 4:2
Valencia 1:1
Sevilla 4:2
Inter 2:0
Real 5:1
Rayo 3:2
Inter 1:1
Betis 3:4
Psv 2:1
Vill 2:0
Esp 4:0
Lev 5:0
Celta 2:0
= 13 wins, 2, 2
= 52:18
Vidal, 6 matches:
Bilbao 1:1
Psv 2:1
Vill 2:0
Esp 4:0
Lev 5:0
Cel 2:0
= 5 wins, 1 draw, 0 defeats
= 16:2
Arthur, 8 matches:
Tott 4:2
Val 1:1
Sev 4:2
Inter 2:0
Real 5:1
Rayo 3:2
Inter 1:1
Betis 3:4
= 5, 2, 1
= 23:13
*********************************************************
Percentage of wins for Barca when a XX midfielder is a starter in 433:
83% Vidal
76% Busquets
74% Rakitic
63% Arthur
Goals scored per match by Barca when a XX midfielder is a starter in 433:
3,06 Busquets
2,89 Rakitic
2,88 Arthur
2,67 Vidal
Goals conceded per match by Barca when a XX midfielder is a starter in 433:
0,33 Vidal
1,05 Rakitic
1,06 Busquets
1,63 Arthur
***********************************************************
Now, let's check some midfield trios, and their stats:
Raki-Busi-Vidal, 5 matches:
Psv 2:1
Vill 2:0
Esp 4:0
Lev 5:0
Cel 2:0
= 5, 0, 0
= 15:1
Arthur-Raki-Busi, 8 matches:
Tott 4:2
Val 1:1
Sev 4:2
Int 2:0
Real 5:1
Rayo 3:2
Inter 1:1
Betis 3:4
= 5, 2, 1
= 23:13
Cou, Busi, Raki, 4 matches:
Vall 1:0
Hue 8:2
Psv 4:0
Leg 1:2
= 3, 0, 1
= 14:4
************************************************
Percentage of Barca's wins with a XX midfield trio:
100% Busi, Raki, Vidal
75% Cou, Busi, Raki
63% Arthur, Busi, Raki
Barca's goals per match with a XX midfield trio:
3,50 Cou-Raki-Busi
3,00 Raki-Busi-Vidal
2,88 Arthur-Busi-Raki
Barca's conceded goals per match:
0,20 Raki-Busi-Vidal
1,00 Cou-Raki-Busi
1,63 Arthur-Busi-Raki
*************************************************
Now, again, stats are in favor of Vidal-Raki-Busi trio.
Defensively, the weakest trio is the one when Arthur plays.
Let's take some additional stats from Whoscored to see official individual defensive stats of our midfielders:
La Liga, all matches:
Tackles:
2,5 Busquets
1,7 Vidal
0,8 Rakitic
0,5 Coutinho
0,5 Arthur
Interceptions:
2,1 Rakitic
1,5 Busquets
0,7 Vidal
0,5 Coutinho
0,3 Arthur
Clearances:
0,6 Rakitic
0,4 Vidal
0,3 Busquets
0,1 Coutinho
0,1 Arthur
Blocks:
0,2 Rakitic
0,2 Busquets
0,1 Vidal
0,0 Coutinho
0,0 Arthur
**************************************************
So, in every single defensive stat, Arthur is the weakest out of these 5.
And now, a lot of guys here, want to pair our defensively the weakest CM with the 2nd weakest (defensively) CM in Coutinho.
That would be: 2 very bad defenders in our midfield (Arthur and Coutinho), paired with Messi who is not defending and Dembele who is also quite a bad defender.
I know, that team would offer nice passes and creativity in attack.
But what happens when we would lose the ball?
= yes, 10s of deadly counters in each match with Busi being caught alone with numerous fast opponents running at him.
So, you guys are shitting on Valverde, but he is actually quite logical and he is playing a number's game.
Currently: Vidal-Busi-Raki is the strongest midfield trio with 100% of wins and conceding 0,20 goals per match.
Midfield trios with Arthur bring more control and TikiTaka passing but also 1,63 goals conceded per match.
While Coutinho-Arthur midfield duo paired with Messi and Dembele would probably break all records in terms of Barca's goals conceded per match.
Every match would end with 4:3, 3:3 and 3:4.
Last edited:
He's a quality player who's having a tough time and not fitting into the Barca team for some reason. As a Liverpool fan I'd love to have him back, I think he'd be excellent in the current Liverpool team, we badly need a proper CAM and Coutinho would be perfect. Not very likely to happen but I can dream...
Home of Barca Fans
