8 - Pedri

serghei

Senior Member
I mean the way in which his decision making is passive, reactive. He gets the ball and picks the best option out of what is possible for him to do. He doesn't do much to change what is possible. He's sort of submissive to the flow of the game in that way.

If we face an opponent that is well organized, only allowing our midfield to play it sideways, then Pedri will just play it sideways. If a gap opens up between the lines, then he'll go for it. But as long as there's no gap, he'll keep passing sideways. That is how you take responsibility for your own actions. What you want in that situation is a player that takes responsibility for the end result and thus tries actively to break down their defensive organizaiton.

So what does a midfielder need to do in that situation? The answer is something else, something more. Modern football games are decided in isolated, discrete situations in which a team does what the opponent isn't prepared for. Solid, reliable, smart passing for 90 mins gets you to the quater-finals of the CL and no further.

Another way to put it is this. Right now, he's a player that is great at exploiting the opponents weaknesses. But at some point we're going to play teams with no weaknesses.

Nah, creating attacking openings is not as much individually down to the player but is actually the main area where guys like Klopp, Pep, Tuchel earn their laurels. They set up their players so they don't have to be peak Iniesta dribblers to find a progressive pass.

OK, maybe you do some feint or a dribble once that unbalances a situation, and then you can exploit it. Sure, but this is a bonus. It happens rarely, normally you need a sort of general intensity and movement that comes only from having a top manager.

A top team will circulate the ball with speed, and use great off-the-ball movement with runs synchronized between more players. Usually, 2-3 players participate in a sequence of movements which is meant to clear space and create passing lanes and angles that you can work with.

At Barca you never have complex runs that involve several players, because the level of tactics and commitment is not there. Usually, our attacking plan is to give the ball to Messi for him to invent something.
 
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Zidane82

Well-known member
I see Pedri as an incredible talent rather than "world class". World class to me denotes that the player in question either gets in the World XI or every club would start him and pretty much that his game will not improve from this point.

I do agree that against every top team last season our midfield was easily snuffed out. In the Barca vs PSG game alone, Verratti looked head and shoulders above the entire midfield. However it was only their first season together as a midfield trio, and if I'm honest I'm not sure many people see FDJ-Busquets-Pedri as a viable midfield solution for the next few years anyway. Think it was just the best we can muster in our current situation.

For Spain, Pedri looked very comfortable because the trio of him-Busi-Koke worked very well and he had two experienced players next to him. At Barca, FDJ is still learning his craft a bit too.


Pedri is still a kid of course ..

Where were Iniesta and Xavi at this Pedro?s age ??
 

MagIX

Senior Member
Well said. If you compare to Xavi Iniesta time then Pedri is not a starter. But we are talking about current Barca, no one is better than him now. Busquest, Pedri, De Jong are current default midfielder though that trio is not really good.

If you compare any midfielder to Xavi Iniesta time then no one would be a starter for Barcelona.
 

Porque

Senior Member
I think he is overrated by fans in general. The classic "he is 18 and plays like that, just IMAGINE what he'll do when he's 25"
He is also overrated by Koeman. In the EC he found a nice role and played very well in a well balanced midfield. Thiago is much superior to me, but that's not how you pick a good team... Of course a player that's starting for Barcelona and Spain A will play in the olympics team too, just based on that...

Silva is a nice comparison tbh. I don't remember him from Eibar or Celta when he was 18/19, but he at least played full seasons at that age, and was instantly a starter for a very good Valencia when he arrived at 20. I think there are a few similarities in style, and comparing stats between them gives somewhat similar numbers:
https://fbref.com/en/stathead/playe...big_5&player_id1=e2716bd0&player_id2=0d9b2d31

Good post.

I don't think Barca fans are rating him higher than an 18 year old Iniesta (or even Xavi) though despite him cementing himself as a key fixture for Barcelona and Spain at this age though. Atleast this forum, while rating him very highly, are realistic that it is also probably because both club and country do not have the world class alternatives.

The twitter/layman fans may be a different story. Those areas are all about hype and being part of the trend. Check the Renato Augusto train 5 years ago for example.
 

putogusiluz8

The Pale One
When you mention his age, you're switching the discussion to a debate about his talent and potential. What I'm trying to discuss is his value as a starter, because as of right now he occupies a position in our starting eleven. Those are two different discussions. I agree that he's a great talent. I'm not so sure he should be an undisputed starter for us.

There's no better alternative and I might argue in order for him to reach those heights and do so as quickly as possible, having the responsibility of being a starting player (one which he handles well) will do him wonders.
 

Bobo32

Senior Member
Good post.

I don't think Barca fans are rating him higher than an 18 year old Iniesta (or even Xavi) though despite him cementing himself as a key fixture for Barcelona and Spain at this age though. Atleast this forum, while rating him very highly, are realistic that it is also probably because both club and country do not have the world class alternatives.

The twitter/layman fans may be a different story. Those areas are all about hype and being part of the trend. Check the Renato Augusto train 5 years ago for example.
Thanks.
I think there is much hype on this forum too tbh.
His output will improve when he doesn't have to cover and run for Busquets anymore. Same applies to Frenkie.
Maybe this statement is correct, but Barcelonas midfield will be way worse when Busquets retire, if someone doesn't arrive out of nowhere.
 

TacticsTim

Active member
I think the hype with pedri has gone too far now. He is a good 18 year old but he has been a big liability many many times this season, more often than he has been good imo. He has had some really good passes and moves which got people excited but he has so many holes in his game. I don't see him as a guaranteed barca starter at all he might be but he's still very very raw.
 

jamrock

Senior Member
He has most certainly not been a liability,many many times this season, that's literally factual wrong.
 
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vegitot

Senior Member
I think the hype with pedri has gone too far now. He is a good 18 year old but he has been a big liability many many times this season, more often than he has been good imo. He has had some really good passes and moves which got people excited but he has so many holes in his game. I don't see him as a guaranteed barca starter at all he might be but he's still very very raw.

Wrong in every categories.
 

BusiTheKing

Senior Member
Nah, creating attacking openings is not as much individually down to the player but is actually the main area where guys like Klopp, Pep, Tuchel earn their laurels. They set up their players so they don't have to be peak Iniesta dribblers to find a progressive pass.

OK, maybe you do some feint or a dribble once that unbalances a situation, and then you can exploit it. Sure, but this is a bonus. It happens rarely, normally you need a sort of general intensity and movement that comes only from having a top manager.

A top team will circulate the ball with speed, and use great off-the-ball movement with runs synchronized between more players. Usually, 2-3 players participate in a sequence of movements which is meant to clear space and create passing lanes and angles that you can work with.

At Barca you never have complex runs that involve several players, because the level of tactics and commitment is not there. Usually, our attacking plan is to give the ball to Messi for him to invent something.

Well, I have to disagree. I very much doubt that Koeman isn't instructing his players on how to make synchronized runs. That is something any coach managing U14+ will be telling his players.

How well a team does this depends much more on the particular culture and atmosphere pervading the squad. We've cultivated a culture dominated by the attitude of 'don't bother making those runs because it probably won't lead to anything'.

I think that a coach has the ability to influence it by way of shocks to the system, instituting something radical that shakes up the natural status quo order of the team. But just instructing your players to do something won't really do anything. Remember that half time speech footage of Valverde beseeching the team to increase the intensity? We still went out there any game with less intensity than any other top team in Europe. It's about team mental culture first and foremost.

This attitude we have is one that players internalize quickly and then start to propogate themselves with their body language. It becomes entrenched, self-perpetuating. With Pedri you get players who naturally default to the culture of the team. He's not really a guy that seeks to change this attitude. Someone like Frenkie, you could see pushing the squad to break their comfort zone. Coutinho did it for the first few months here but then succumbed to the complacency.

That's the nature of this thing. A positive team culture needs to be reinforced mutually, collectively. If player X starts making runs that call for a synchronized pattern to engage, and no-one else follows his lead, very soon that player X will stop making those runs too. Then when the next new signing Y arrives, player X will likely be one of those dissuading Y from making the same runs. What you need in this case is less subservient and more renegade players. That's why I don't think Pedri will change much. Yeah he's brilliant and calm and all that but as a team, we have bigger problems. (Maybe some of them will dissipate once Messi stops, that's another conversation).
 

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