I must have watched a different game. I though he was our best player. And I am not Iniesta's greatest fan either.
I must have watched a different game. I though he was our best player. And I am not Iniesta's greatest fan either.
J
jiopi
Guest
Tbh, did you watch first leg of Supercopa today?
Irish_Cules
New member
He had spells where he was the best player on the pitch and then he would disapear for significant periods of time also.
impeh
Hi, its me..
i thought he was good, linked up nicely with alba and made a couple of awesome passes out to alves.
Wasnt the biggest fan of him playing out on the left last season (he was a little wasted out wide) but hes playing so well there so far under Tito its better than our other options in big games
Wasnt the biggest fan of him playing out on the left last season (he was a little wasted out wide) but hes playing so well there so far under Tito its better than our other options in big games
Pepe Silvia
Active member
rivals joe montana in coolness in big games.
Ursegor
World Champion
The problem with the Iniesta-Fabregas combination is that the team doesn't trust in Fabregas' overall midfield play so Iniesta has to come inside to release the pressure, keep possession, link up, beat his markers and initiate attacks more often than he should do (plus, he doesn't like to stay wide, he made that clear quite often). If Fabregas could do the same and play like a proper Barcelona midfielder besides his assists, Iniesta would just concentrate on taking on Essien, but as it stands he had to deal with Essien, Khedira, Alonso + Özil and Callejon tracking back, basically playing 2 positions at once. While at the same time the coaching staff doesn't want to lose the positives which Fabregas brings to the team (as mentioned: his final ball, which is probably the best in the world and his directness in transitions, for example that Pedro fail counterattacking chance which Cesc created). And while it might work against 18 La Liga teams that have a 10 times lesser budget than Barcelona, teams which operate on an equal budget like Real Madrid will have it easier to exploit the weaknesses of such an unbalanced lineup.
In short: We have the same problems which we had last season. We create shitloads of chances (which you would expect with Xavi, Iniesta, Fabregas and Messi on the pitch). Yet we fluff easy chances (which you would also expect when there is only 1 constant goal threat upfront who is marked out of the game and the chances fall to the feet of fullbacks and midfielders).
At least that's how I see it. I think we should do a lot better with the player material we have. This team should actually be able to win back to back Champions Leagues and not lose to the worst Chelsea side of all time 2-3 on aggregate or draw against a Real Madrid team with a Essien-Varane-Carvalho-Arbeloa backline and the "best player of all time" who was on a 16 game streak of scoring goals should be able to release more than 1 shot (from a freekick) which wasn't even on target in 90 minutes against THAT backline. The coaching staff need to get their heads out of their asses and apply tactics according to opponents. How many times do we want to see Messi trying to dribble into a wall of 5 players through the middle when Madrid is blatantly congesting the middle? What works wonders against Osasuna might not work against Real Madrid. Is that really so hard to see?
Irish_Cules
New member
Irish_Cules
New member
In fairness every single defence in world football who try to play the offside trap does that.
FCBarca
Mike the Knife
It's part of Mou strategy 101, along with referee intimidation...But yeah, I notice it as well, their hands go up like synchronized swimmers...every time
darthvader7888
Banned
Speaking of swimmers, they accuse us of diving, yet they're the ones who have CR, Di Maria and Pepe on their team. Bunch of fucking hypocrites. Especially Pepe, he apparently beat up that Getafe guy for diving
And speaking of referees, I can see why Chelsea fans love blaming the ref just like the RM fans. I'm guessing it's coz of Mourinho
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abual3bed1
New member
Speaking of swimmers, they accuse us of diving, yet they're the ones who have CR, Di Maria and Pepe on their team. Bunch of fucking hypocrites. Especially Pepe, he apparently beat up that Getafe guy for diving
And speaking of referees, I can see why Chelsea fans love blaming the ref just like the RM fans. I'm guessing it's coz of Mourinho
The Mou legacy.
darthvader7888
Banned
Step 1: Park the bus (using a bunch of walking red cards)
Step 2: One of your players deservedly gets a red card
Step 3: Another of your players stomps on Pedro's leg, no card.
Step 4: Barca deservedly kicks your team's ass.
Step 5: Complain about the refs.
Step 6: Make up bullshit conspiracy theories.
Mourinho logic.
GiantKiller
New member
@Ursegor :
Improvement in Fabregas's overall midfield play is only a matter of time and, in fact, it has gotten somewhat better, if not a lot, than how it was last season. Tbh, I don't think he was sticking out like a sore thumb when the ball was in the middle of park either. Furthermore, I think you're exaggerating a bit on the difficulties faced by Iniesta and the fact that he has to drift inside is, as I see it, related more to the system than Fabregas's shortcomings as a Barca midfielder. That's because, as you say, Iniesta doesn't prefer staying out wide like a full-time winger and I don't think the coaching staff would be too keen to try that out either. As I explained my observations in my previous post in this thread, Iniesta only came inside when Fabregas moved up in the hole to partner Messi or even further to provide central depth, thus leaving a space in behind. Does it sound familiar? To me, it does and I'm referring to the away Clasico in the league last season. We played a similar system and won convincingly against a Madrid that was in MUCH better state than it was the other day. So, with Cesc getting closer to the finish line in the race to fully adapt in our midfield and the whole team in arguably a better shape, I don't see how we're not better off to play in this fashion now and I also don't see how it won't work against teams with budgets similar to us.
Agree about that problem. Tbh, in terms of quality, there has indeed been a step down as we went from having Henry and Eto'o to Pedro, Sanchez and co. as part of the forward line. This may perhaps have resulted in the wide forwards switching to a more 'off-the-ball role' (along with also creating a 5-man midfield of sort) and are now working more to create space because if that's not the case, then it'll have to be a bizarre coincedence that clear cut chances fall to midfielders and fullback in virtually every match. That's just how I see it though.
We should do better considering the players at our diposal, true. However, I'll only start to really worry when we come up against a team that completely neutralizes our game because a properly functioning system WILL result in scoring chances and that's all you can expect, really. We did create chances against Chelsea and Inter. Beyond that, it's the players who have the opportunity to finish plays where luck, to me, is undoutbedly involved.
Messi's lack of deadliness, in my opinion, was more down to him having a bad game, tbh. He's been very influential in the previous encounters (keep in mind that Madrid, as said already, was in better shape almost every time) and as for his game, he's becoming calmer and much more intelligent, to the point where he certainly doesn't always overdribble as you seem to put it.
As for the tactics part, you either be flexible and play according to your opponenet or you play in a way that forces the opponent to change their game (Barca). Even minor adjustments in the system can make a big difference as far as the second style is concerned. It's arguably, from our perspective, only a matter of making as less mistakes as possible. So, I don't see how the way we played wouldn't work as it helps to dominate in the middle on tough away grounds by creating a midfield overload resulting in manipulations of the opposite defence to create space (previous match).
It's getting a bit inconvenient. You can reply to it if you want to, though.
Improvement in Fabregas's overall midfield play is only a matter of time and, in fact, it has gotten somewhat better, if not a lot, than how it was last season. Tbh, I don't think he was sticking out like a sore thumb when the ball was in the middle of park either. Furthermore, I think you're exaggerating a bit on the difficulties faced by Iniesta and the fact that he has to drift inside is, as I see it, related more to the system than Fabregas's shortcomings as a Barca midfielder. That's because, as you say, Iniesta doesn't prefer staying out wide like a full-time winger and I don't think the coaching staff would be too keen to try that out either. As I explained my observations in my previous post in this thread, Iniesta only came inside when Fabregas moved up in the hole to partner Messi or even further to provide central depth, thus leaving a space in behind. Does it sound familiar? To me, it does and I'm referring to the away Clasico in the league last season. We played a similar system and won convincingly against a Madrid that was in MUCH better state than it was the other day. So, with Cesc getting closer to the finish line in the race to fully adapt in our midfield and the whole team in arguably a better shape, I don't see how we're not better off to play in this fashion now and I also don't see how it won't work against teams with budgets similar to us.
Agree about that problem. Tbh, in terms of quality, there has indeed been a step down as we went from having Henry and Eto'o to Pedro, Sanchez and co. as part of the forward line. This may perhaps have resulted in the wide forwards switching to a more 'off-the-ball role' (along with also creating a 5-man midfield of sort) and are now working more to create space because if that's not the case, then it'll have to be a bizarre coincedence that clear cut chances fall to midfielders and fullback in virtually every match. That's just how I see it though.
We should do better considering the players at our diposal, true. However, I'll only start to really worry when we come up against a team that completely neutralizes our game because a properly functioning system WILL result in scoring chances and that's all you can expect, really. We did create chances against Chelsea and Inter. Beyond that, it's the players who have the opportunity to finish plays where luck, to me, is undoutbedly involved.
Messi's lack of deadliness, in my opinion, was more down to him having a bad game, tbh. He's been very influential in the previous encounters (keep in mind that Madrid, as said already, was in better shape almost every time) and as for his game, he's becoming calmer and much more intelligent, to the point where he certainly doesn't always overdribble as you seem to put it.
As for the tactics part, you either be flexible and play according to your opponenet or you play in a way that forces the opponent to change their game (Barca). Even minor adjustments in the system can make a big difference as far as the second style is concerned. It's arguably, from our perspective, only a matter of making as less mistakes as possible. So, I don't see how the way we played wouldn't work as it helps to dominate in the middle on tough away grounds by creating a midfield overload resulting in manipulations of the opposite defence to create space (previous match).
It's getting a bit inconvenient. You can reply to it if you want to, though.
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