Luftstalag14
Culé de Celestial Empire
So you'd rather use anecdotal evidence to prove one is better than the other?
Arjen Robben
- Thread starter FCBNOF
- Start date
So you'd rather use anecdotal evidence to prove one is better than the other?
Icarium
Lifestealer
+1
He does not have insane stamina like robben, those late moment wondrous strikes can only come when he plays conservatively. Robben will look more dangerous than messi in the game i am quite sure of it because he is not marked by 3 players constantly. Anyway why are we even comparing robben to messi?
The debate can only be decided by the performances in the Ned Arg match. If robben takes Ned to the final all by himself then i will agree he had a better world cup than messi. Currently it is still close with robben being more dangerous and messi being more effective. He is winning the matches by running less, give him some credit people. Saying that i wish messi could play like he played in 2008-11, but i just want him to win the world cup now. That running can be taken care at barca, at present i am happy with messi winning matches like this.
KingMessi
SiempreBlaugrana
Exactly. Messi seems to be turning his game up a gear each match. Whereas Robben has insane stamina and has been playing at his highest level since the tournament began.
DonAK
President of FC Barcelona
Correction: Messi covered almost 8 500 metres while Robben ran almost 9 500 metres against Belgium and Costa Rica respectively. Still not that massive difference as people make it out to be especially considering both of them have different roles in their teams.
http://resources.fifa.com/mm/docume...2/83/60_0705_arg-bel_arg_playerstatistics.pdf
http://resources.fifa.com/mm/docume...6/88/59_0705_ned-crc_ned_playerstatistics.pdf
http://resources.fifa.com/mm/docume...2/83/60_0705_arg-bel_arg_playerstatistics.pdf
http://resources.fifa.com/mm/docume...6/88/59_0705_ned-crc_ned_playerstatistics.pdf
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footyfan
Calma, calma
Messi covered 8423m in 90 min, Robben covered 9501m in 90 min, that's a pretty big difference (http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/matches/round=255953/match=300186504/statistics.html, http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/matches/round=255953/match=300186488/statistics.html). What's surprising is that Messi covered more distance in the Bosnia game (8618m, http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/matches/round=255931/match=300186477/statistics.html)
I don't see anybody actually making a distance run argument re: Robben vs Messi in this World Cup, I don't know why you got that feeling. What I will say though is that I don't think Robben is anything special re: stamina.
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DonAndres
Wild Man of Borneo
Well I dunno if it's solely about the vomit because there are other equally plausible reasons. Off the bat we have to remember how lazy and pedestrian Barca's season was as well as Tata's playground training sessions. Not a single Barcelona player aside from Alexis has been playing at an adequate level of stamina or fitness in this WC (just maybe Mascherano, but his movement isn't really exerting). I've heard rumors of players hiring fitness trainers and all the recorded sessions look like child's play more than actual preparation. Messi definitely did not go into this WC as a fully energetic athlete as he should be.
Another is the conditions of the game. Midday heat in the afternoon, extremely dry air. Messi was seen getting drinks of water a notable amount of times against Belgium IIRC, indicating a dry throat and dehydration. That too would cause him to go out of breath more easily and not have as much stamina.
He obviously can't just get up and start running at Robben levels for the entire game but he definitely can put in more and I hope he's fitter for the next match. It's not just about covering more distance but being more active and involved in attack (especially since he's now Argentina's only transition player). For Barca's season, I want Lucho enlisting Messi in those Iron Man runs ASAP
Sumlit
San Claudio Bravo
For me Messi's reduced movement has to do with the fact that he has not reached 100% fitness level since his return from injury. We have to realize that in 2013 Messi missed 100 days due to injury. That's close to a third of the year. And it wasn't just one injury, but 4 different episodes scattered throughout the year. One can easily say Messi has had a full year (2013) of low fitness level due to injury, followed by a tentative and reserved level of performance (in 2014) in preparation for this intense short tournament. Not hard to see how he cannot be at his 100% top fitness level.
On top of that, of the 5 games Argentina have played in Brazil, 4 of them have been played at 1:00PM local time. I don't know how many people here have lived or spent time in the tropics, but 1:00PM in the tropics is basically "do not go out in the sun" time. The heat and humidity is unbearable if you're just standing around, let alone running in a football match.
The last game vs Belgium was probably the hardest to play. Going from playing 120 minutes vs Switzerland at 1:00PM in hot weather and high humidity of Sao Paulo, to playing in the still hot but now dry weather of Brasilia, and just 4 days in between.
When you're not at the peak of your fitness, those are some hard conditions to have to deal with.
On top of that, of the 5 games Argentina have played in Brazil, 4 of them have been played at 1:00PM local time. I don't know how many people here have lived or spent time in the tropics, but 1:00PM in the tropics is basically "do not go out in the sun" time. The heat and humidity is unbearable if you're just standing around, let alone running in a football match.
The last game vs Belgium was probably the hardest to play. Going from playing 120 minutes vs Switzerland at 1:00PM in hot weather and high humidity of Sao Paulo, to playing in the still hot but now dry weather of Brasilia, and just 4 days in between.
When you're not at the peak of your fitness, those are some hard conditions to have to deal with.
B
beautifulgame
Guest
In good hands with great coaches bruh
B
beautifulgame
Guest
Well I dunno if it's solely about the vomit because there are other equally plausible reasons. Off the bat we have to remember how lazy and pedestrian Barca's season was as well as Tata's playground training sessions. Not a single Barcelona player aside from Alexis has been playing at an adequate level of stamina or fitness in this WC (just maybe Mascherano, but his movement isn't really exerting). I've heard rumors of players hiring fitness trainers and all the recorded sessions look like child's play more than actual preparation. Messi definitely did not go into this WC as a fully energetic athlete as he should be.
Another is the conditions of the game. Midday heat in the afternoon, extremely dry air. Messi was seen getting drinks of water a notable amount of times against Belgium IIRC, indicating a dry throat and dehydration. That too would cause him to go out of breath more easily and not have as much stamina.
He obviously can't just get up and start running at Robben levels for the entire game but he definitely can put in more and I hope he's fitter for the next match. It's not just about covering more distance but being more active and involved in attack (especially since he's now Argentina's only transition player). For Barca's season, I want Lucho enlisting Messi in those Iron Man runs ASAP
Even if true this is irrelevant. Had over three weeks to prepare after which is more than enough for even half fit players.
Other than Alexis, Neymar has shown fit, iniesta ran as much as alway, as well as masche and busquets. Messi being lazy is what Messi is now. Accept it. While robben will never be 1/5 of Messi he is a better professional and works harder. We have to accept this
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