Arthur
- Thread starter Jair Ventura
- Start date
SeloBarca
Senior Member
Yea i watched the whole game and you could see that from the minutes he played.
Hes very good at making space for others.
Im suprised he doesnt get neckinjuries with all that headturning he does
He seems to be a VERY intelligent player.
What bothered me a little, just like in Barcelona, was that Arthur was in very good positions, clearly showing he wanted the ball.
Yet the players rather pass it to Coutinho or someone else instead. That was annoying to watch.
Hes very good at making space for others.
Im suprised he doesnt get neckinjuries with all that headturning he does
He seems to be a VERY intelligent player.
What bothered me a little, just like in Barcelona, was that Arthur was in very good positions, clearly showing he wanted the ball.
Yet the players rather pass it to Coutinho or someone else instead. That was annoying to watch.
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FinBarcelonafan
Well-known member
Yea i watched the whole game and you could see that from the minutes he played.
Hes very good at making space for others.
Im suprised he doesnt get neckinjuries with all that headturning he does
He seems to be a VERY intelligent player.
What bothered me a little, just like in Barcelona, was that Arthur was in very good positions, clearly showing he wanted the ball.
Yet the players rather pass it to Coutinho or someone else instead. That was annoying to watch.
Don't worry. The players trust for him will come with the time.
People should be banned a month for such dumb phrases...
serghei
Senior Member
Spoke like a manager who really understands the game. Knowing very well that it's not only the last bit in a sequence that makes the play happen, like the last pass, or a nice finish, but also the start, and how you decompress space in order to make sure the passing is fluid and flows the right way.
Impressive from Tite.
Gaining space and time in football is a cumulative effort. Even the keeper can gain space and time with a good delivery. Arthur is the type of player who provides space, access and time to his teammates. He doesn't get those things in large quantity because he plays it simple and is very possession oriented, but he gets them consistently.
He needs a manager who would understand how valuable this is. To almost never give away the ball and always find space even if he doesn't do extravagant stuff. Xavi had less assists in 2010-11 in La Liga than Borja Valero.
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Gnidrologist
Senior Member
Yeah, people who think that safe passing is easy are clueless. The reason why Xavi was so revered wasn't because of astronomical amount of assists, but his hold on the game, which Arthur is very good at.
Joan
Well-known member
Let's not undermine Xavi's creativity here. He will, and rightfully so, be remembered as one of the most creative midfielders in the game. Not (only) for his assists. Xavi's forward-thinking supported with passes, line breaking ones in the first space, represented an important aspect of his overall style. Now, Arthur might be good at what you call hold of the game, but he's still lacking. It's early and I'm certain he'll prove to be way better at it.
serghei
Senior Member
Xavi was very creative but his 'end product' as some like to call goals, assists and such wasn't great or consistent at all times, especially after Messi became more of a passer and a playmaker. Scored few goals in his career and usually, especially in his best years at Barcelona, wasn't exactly a last pass role player. That was mostly Messi. Messi was the one in the team who basically had the freedom to take individual actions and look for assists, shots, or go on dribbling runs. Xavi made assists - a lot of them great, in important games like CL finals and such - if he had the chance to, but he didn't force things in order to look for them specifically. Which is what most here demand Arthur should do.
Arthur is the same profile of player like Xavi was. He needs to perfect his style and get as close to that standard as possible. His strong points are ball retention, advancing the play in a non decisive but important way, assessing risk then choosing when to play more direct and when to temporize the play, moving a lot and providing easy and fast access for a player on the ball, thus ensuring fluidity and maintaining shape.
Those are a lot of assets. Making assists and scoring goals will come, but for a player of this style, it's more of a result of having a fluid system with a lot of movement around him, than a prerequisite of his role.
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KingLeo10
Senior Member
You also have to keep in mind that defenses have analyzed Xavi's movements and gameplay and it's harder for Arthur to replicate them. Even Xavi's gameplay in 10-11 for instance was more conservative than in 08-09 where he had some 30+ assists (teams didn't know how to play us AT ALL back then. outside of chelsea lol).
BBZ8800
Senior Member
I have no idea why people are simplifying things.
Let's say that Xavi was good at:
1. getting the ball out of our half
2. in shielding the ball
3. off the ball movement
4. shortpasses, safepasses, backpasses
5. he was a creator with tons of forward passes and key passes
Arthur is currently good at:
1. getting the ball out of our half
2. shielding the ball
3. and in safepasses
He is not close to Xavi's level in off the ball movement yet.
And his part of a game with creatovity almost doesn't exist.
Some stats, whoscored:
Xavi, assists per season:
2010: 16 assists
2011: 10 assists
2012: 8 assists
2013: 12 assists
Arthur:
2016: 0 assists
2017: 0 assists
2018: 2 assists
A guy has 2 assits in his whole senior career.
Xavi, key passes:
2010: 3,2 per match
2011: 2,2
2012: 2,0
2013: 1,5
He had less key passes when he was older.
Arthur, key passes per match:
2017: 0,8
2018: 1,4
Xavi, key passes career average: 2,2
Arthur, career average: 0,9
I know, people improve over age.
But there is always like roughly 70% natural talent and 30% learning.
Arthur's natural talent in creativity is extremely poor.
Further, for now, at Gremio, Brasilian NT and Barca, Arthur looks like a player who watched too many videos of possession football from 2009-2011.
The only problem is that extreme possession football is not working anymore.
What is worse, when Xavi and Iniesta kept possession, they were still able to make a killer forward pass in every moment.
Arthur can only keep possession for now and nothing else.
Imo, a current comparisons Xavi-Arthur are somewhat similar to Messi-Halilovic.
Messi has let's say 10 things which makes him Messi.
And Halilovic had SOME of those skills:
1. he visually ran like Messi
2. he was of a similar physical constitution
3. he had similar acceleration and some dribbles
4. he played on a same position
5. he was dribbling and shooting in some actions like Messi
The "only" difference is that Messi is able to score 50 goals and make 15 assists per season, while Halil will have 5+5.
So, imo, you guys see some of Xavi's traits in Arthur, and then you assume that he will suddenly get even traits which he doesn't posses.
Further, to me Arthur is closer to Busi and imo those 2 can't play together because both are too defensive minded in passing (especially Arthur).
Arthur visually looks like Xavi and has SOME of his traits, but he plays way more similar to Busi's position due to a lack of those creative Xavi's skills.
Now once again, watch a video of Xavi on an NT level when he was as old as a current Arthur and try to pay attention to that KEY part of his game, CREATIVITY, VISION, KEY FORWARD passes.
Check how Xavi is NOT passing the ball all the time to the most OBVIOUS choice (the closest or the 2nd closest player around him), like Arthur:
Also, Xavi is doing everything faster than Arthur. Arthur dwells on every single ball for a few mileseconds too long:
And now, watch this again and check Arthur's forward passes and his passing to the most obvious and predictable choice almost every time:
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serghei
Senior Member
Dude, I'm comparing Arthur with Xavi in terms of player profile, not in terms of quality. Of course Xavi was much better, but was much better in the same way Arthur plays.
te amo barca
Blaugrana al vent
Xavi had an outrageous number of assists in 08/09 if I remember correctly. He was one of the most creative passers ever and saying that he was a conservative player is just wrong. Xavi has been a force of nature in through balls until 12/13. Arthur’s talent in through balls does not come near that, not even close.
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