Cr150

[Maradona37]

Benzema put up better KO numbers versus better teams with a much weaker squad around him.

The season Benzema scored 15 (I think it was) CL goals, mostly important goals at important moments against strong teams. Compare that to Ronaldo's 17 in 2014 and 16 in 2016.

Now Ronaldo technically scored more goals, but loads of them were stat-padding or against weak teams. Ronaldo for instance scored loads of goals post New Year in the 2014 CL knockout stage, but use CONTEXT (something Cristiano Ronaldo must be delighted a lot of fans don't apply towards his career), look below the surface, and you see that very few - IF ANY - of those goals made a real difference to the outcome of the ties. His goals against Schalke were inconsequential, he didn't do much against Dortmund other than one goal, and in the semi-final he scored two goals vs Bayern - AFTER Benzema had scored in the first leg and Ramos did all the damage in the second leg. One of Ronaldo's goals was even mishit and Neuer should have saved it.

The final in Lisbon is like a microcosm of parts of Ronaldo's career - a woeful performance where he was one of the worst players on the pitch, but then wins and scores a meaningless penalty in the last minute of extra-time after Ramos, Di Maria and Bale did the pressure work when it counted. Ronaldo turned it on in the 120th minute when the pressure was off, then embarrassingly celebrated with his top off in an attempt to steal the limelight. This is why it's ridiculous when people say he's scored the most CL Final goals - that goal wasn't worth the paper it is printed on, and his goal in the 2008 final was followed by a disappearing act after Chelsea equalised, then a missed penalty in the shootout. The only CL Final of his six that he played well in was against Juventus.

In 2016, most of his goals came against teams like Malmo and Wolfsburg. Edit: just looked it up, he scored 6 against Malmo (including four in an 8-0 win) and 5 against Shakhtar (they were decent back then but they're not a top team) in the group stage. Then 2 against Roma and 3 against Wolfsburg in the knockout stage. None against PSG in the group stage. No goals vs City in the semi (an average City at the time) or Atletico in the final. And we know at this point, that 31 year old Ronaldo had little else to offer on the park but goals.

The only real season that his goalscoring was ultra-impressive in terms of important goals against big teams was in 2017, where he admittedly went mad in the knockout stage after doing very little in the group stage. But even there, it comprises a lot of tap ins and offside goals.

If you are someone who judges by stats, you'll think Ronaldo was great in the 2014 final and Messi was poor the following year. However, anyone who actually watched those games knows Messi was MOTM in 2015 and Ronaldo was invisible in 2014.

This is why, when people say Ronaldo is the greatest CL player ever, I ask for context and to look at the PERFORMANCES, not just the stats. Ronaldo has scored more goals than Messi, but Messi's best performances (especially the three in his finals) absolutely blow Ronaldo's out of the water. And Barcelona won the CL trophies in more style than Real Madrid did.

 

[Maradona37]

I seen someone on Redcafe after last night's thrilling 100 m race say that Noah Lyles reminds him of Ronaldo- a bellend but brings his A game under pressure.

Why does this myth around Ronaldo persist? How do people think he always show up in the big games? Are people just wilfully overlooking that he's been invisible and one of the worst players on the pitch in almost all of his CL Finals? And his record in knockout stages of international tournaments (given how he's all about his stats) is absolutely pathetic, and he's been terrible every time Portugal have exited a tournament dating back to 2004. Can anyone name a great big game he's had in an international tournament (other than Spain and maybe Hungary, but again, group stages matches)?

Even though he's scored plenty of goals in knockout stages of the CL, most of the time he was on the periphery of games and simply finished off the chances created for him. It isn't like he's like Messi or Maradona and running his entire team.

He was terrible at this Euros and the last World Cup too, even if he is old. And he wasn't much better at Euro 2020 despite scoring some goals.

These people who say these things imply he's a much better big-game player than Messi, but it's actually the opposite. He's also been far worse than Messi in direct clasicos played against each other. Didn't he only get two assists in dozens of games? And, as already stated, Messi is much more involved in these games based on eye test.

Comments like that guys are why I think this clown is one of the most overrated players ever (while still an all-time great). It's an absolute myth that he shows up under pressure every time. In fact quite often he's absolutely invisible, as I have illustrated.

 

[Andresito]

I'm just trying to look at this objectively. Speaking about prime CR.

The thing with CR is that he's always had the drive to score goals, the bigger the spotlight the better. He doesn't sulk or shy away and if you're his teammate you for sure will be motivated to win the game when walking out to the pitch.

Now we all know CRs limitations, he can't create magic on his own out of nothing, well, he can score a half chance from a bad angle or a header but the chance will have to be created by someone else. When he gets the chance he wants to take them and usually does it well including penalties which are big pressure moments.

Not sure what his record in finals are either but I'm sure he's won majority of finals he participated in. He might not have 1 G per game but his presence is there still.

That's why I believe his mentality is suited for being under pressure and probably one of the best in the world at it.

 

[Maradona37]

I'm just trying to look at this objectively. Speaking about prime CR.

The thing with CR is that he's always had the drive to score goals, the bigger the spotlight the better. He doesn't sulk or shy away and if you're his teammate you for sure will be motivated to win the game when walking out to the pitch.

Now we all know CRs limitations, he can't create magic on his own out of nothing, well, he can score a half chance from a bad angle or a header but the chance will have to be created by someone else. When he gets the chance he wants to take them and usually does it well including penalties which are big pressure moments.

Not sure what his record in finals are either but I'm sure he's won majority of finals he participated in. He might not have 1 G per game but his presence is there still.

That's why I believe his mentality is suited for being under pressure and probably one of the best in the world at it.

He won the 2008 Cl Final after scoring a header, then disappearing in the second half and extra time. He then missed a penalty in the shootout.

He gets credit for the 2014 CL semis but it was actually Ramos who sealed the tie in the second leg, as Ramos scored two headers before Ronaldo scored his two goals. He was woeful in the 2014 CL Final while Bale, Ramos and Di Maria carried the fight. Scored a meaningless penalty in the 120th minute and celebrated like he was MOTM, like the coward he is.

Invisible again in the 2016 and 2018 finals, did nothing of note. 2016 Euros final he went off injured and I still believe they'd have lost the game had he stayed on.

What you write can be spun to turn on its head - you say he inspires his team-mates through his presence, which is vague and cannot be proved. I can equally say his overly dominating presence inhibits his team-mates and causes them to concede to his presence. The most obvious example of this recently was his and the team's disasterclass when Portugal played Slovenia in the Euros in the summer.

Nobody is denying he works hard, or has drive, or gives his all. But ultimately this guy has been poor in all but one (2 if we are being generous) of his 6 CL Finals (despite his team winning thanks to the efforts of his team-mates) and has what? 3 goals and 2 assists in 22 major tournament knockout games? For a guy who is all about stats and judges himself wholly by his goalscoring (so he brings it on himself), that is fucking terrible.

His CL Final record (when you analyse the context) and international knockout record are shocking. Nobody is saying he's always poor in big games either - nobody is going the other way. But he's really no more special than plenty of players which is why it's clear celebrity worship and PR hype when people use him as the benchmark or reference point for big game mentality and performance. It is clear bollocks when you actually analyse it.

He's also missed a surprisingly high amount of pressure penalties.

You say his mentality is suited for being under pressure but he's actually failed in a lot of big moments and been saved by team-mates. Messi on the other hand? If he had a bad big game for Barca or Argentina nobody was there to make up the difference for him, apart from maybe this year's Copa.

'He doesn't sulk'

Cristiano Ronaldo doesn't sulk? LOL. Being a petty cunt is a huge part of his game.

Like I say, the overall point is not that I am saying Ronaldo is shite in big games in general. But he's definitely overrated in them and this big match mentality under pressure is way overplayed, probably because of his body and the fact he behaves like a relentless sociopath which fools people into believing he has a relentless will and wins everything himself. It's maybe the biggest myth surrounding him when you actually look at his record. Ultimately, anyone as amazing under pressure as some morons claim he is can never have as bad a knockout international record as he has. It's just impossible to reconcile the two things.

Name one time he showed up every time Portugal have exited (or the time they won) a tournament dating back to his debut in 2004. Just one example? Those are the ultimate in pressure games at int level and he's failed about 11 times. It isn't like he's played well and the team has still gone out - he's generally been below average in all those games. He didn't even do anything in the final when they won the Nations League. It goes against your claim in the final paragraph.

He's done better in Copa del Rey Finals and FA Cup Finals but they're smaller games.

 

[Horatio]

His ability to come clutch is overrated by fans and some outside of the fandom

Narrative would have been completely different if his teammates did not show up in finals when he didn’t.

Tremendous player, but not more clutch than Messi, what some would have believe is what he had over him.

Simple truth is Barca been way more dependant on Messi than Real on Ronaldo.

Ronaldo did have the occasional stellar performance, like against Spain and Bayern and Atletico. What you can expect from wc players.

 

[malvolio]

I'm just trying to look at this objectively. Speaking about prime CR.

The thing with CR is that he's always had the drive to score goals, the bigger the spotlight the better. He doesn't sulk or shy away and if you're his teammate you for sure will be motivated to win the game when walking out to the pitch.

Now we all know CRs limitations, he can't create magic on his own out of nothing, well, he can score a half chance from a bad angle or a header but the chance will have to be created by someone else. When he gets the chance he wants to take them and usually does it well including penalties which are big pressure moments.

Not sure what his record in finals are either but I'm sure he's won majority of finals he participated in. He might not have 1 G per game but his presence is there still.

That's why I believe his mentality is suited for being under pressure and probably one of the best in the world at it.

His mental fortitude while under pressure is overrated tbf. Moans and bitches like a child when things don't go his way. He just likes to be the main character, regardless if his team loses or wins.

 

[Horatio]

His mental fortitude while under pressure is overrated tbf. Moans and bitches like a child when things don't go his way. He just likes to be the main character, regardless if his team loses or wins.

beat u to it

 

[malvolio]

beat u to it

 

[Maradona37]

If that is too long to read, this is the main point:

'Ultimately, anyone as amazing under pressure as some people claim he is can never have as bad a knockout international record as he has. It's just impossible to reconcile the two things.'

It's not even like it takes a slight dip, as you expect going from Real Madrid to Portugal. His knockout int record isn't even average, it's horrendous.

 

[Andresito]

He whines and bitches yeah but not usually to an extent where it affects his next play. Regarding bitching after the game I laugh as much as all of you when he does.

Look I'm not going to spend too much time defending CR. I just know if there would be a crucial last minute penalty (still talking prime) I would pick him to shoot it. If there was a chance from 10m in open play, I'd pick someone else.

 

[Maradona37]

How does it not affect his next play? His horrendous free-kick taking actively sabotages Portugal when someone else could take them and either deliver a cross or score themselves. That's actively hindering his team so he can take the spotlight himself. It's selfish, makes the team worse, and proves he's not a team player.

His Portugal team-mates feel pressured to pass to him in every situation (pressure he partly is to blame for on and off the pitch) and that makes the team's moves worse too. Unlike Messi he isn't a positive influence - I wouldn't be surprised if most of his team-mates secretly detest him.

People talk about him being an example for youth - more bollocks myths. At Man United he threw the young players under the bus to preserve his own career. He asked why young players weren't subbed instead of him when Rangnick subbed him.Same with Portugal and refusing to retire despite being ancient.

Fair enough on the penalty shout. But he's missed a fair amount for club and country. And, with all due respect, penalty pressure is totally different from open play pressure. Nobody is denying he's good at pens.

it's clear that things like 'amazing in big games', 'is an example for and teaches the youth' are absolute bollocks myths surrounding him.

 

[Maradona37]

Anyway this only came up because that guy drew a parallel between him and Noah Lyles in terms of big pressure moments, and it became clear that the myth persists to some.

I have outlined examples proving it is a myth. Nobody can dispute those examples as we have all watched them. He shrinks in a lot of big games, and the reason for that is that he can't get involved in the game outside goalscoring and is more easily taken care of against teams that limit domination and chance creation of his teams.

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

Magisterial picture 🔥🔥💯👏

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

The difference

 

[Maradona37]

Magisterial picture 🔥🔥💯👏


View attachment 10684

Looks like something from World War One. Or a historical dictator.